The Official Korean GP thread (WITH SPOILERS)

[IainT]

The ad isn't completely clear but I don't think it comes with a 'proper' engine.

[350Matt]

Might need a few more engine parts and hardware to actaully get it to move as its not complete

[weyland yutani]

Ad says its a show engine. £200K is a bargain for a modern F1 car, joe blogs would never feel the performance difference to a RB7 anyway.

[Munter]

You'll need to buy a working engine as well to actually use it in BOSS or something.

[anonymous-user]

Engine and Gearbox because the Hydraulic system to use the original supplied gearbox is very complex and expensive however im sure if you went to Cosworth and Xtrac and waved the cheque book you could get a working engine and gearbox.

[Daston]

Any idea where Massa is getting his pace from? I guess the set up is much more to his liking or he is enjoying racing again. It just seems his performance has been very strong over the last two races (which is good to see). Still a bit of a crap feeling when Ferrari told him to slow down .

Wonder if the Italian mafia have kidnapped his girlfriend or something!

[Chrisgr31]

Daston said:

Any idea where Massa is getting his pace from? I guess the set up is much more to his liking or he is enjoying racing again. It just seems his performance has been very strong over the last two races (which is good to see). Still a bit of a crap feeling when Ferrari told him to slow down .

Wonder if the Italian mafia have kidnapped his girlfriend or something!

I think it is the threat of losing his job! Hasn't he done this for the last couple of seasons? Crap first half, makes up for it in the second?

[anonymous-user]

It is strange how he has all of a sudden found the extra tenth or two of pace but its nice to see. Maybe he understands the tyres better now or something.

[Serendipity72]

tux said:

It is strange how he has all of a sudden found the extra tenth or two of pace but its nice to see. Maybe he understands the tyres better now or something.

This is what they were saying at the weekend. Tyre management.
He is a very fast driver indeed, possibly faster than Fred but not as rounded in all the other skills.

[E30M3SE]

He's had top 5 finishes in every race since Spa with the exception of S'pore (8th)where he had a 1st lap puncture due to Petrov making contact.

[FloppyRaccoon]

E30M3SE said:

He's had top 5 finishes in every race since Spa with the exception of S'pore (8th)where he had a 1st lap puncture due to Petrov making contact.

And it seems to have paid off, he's signed for next year. I'm happy for him, he's driven pretty damn well recently.

[E30M3SE]

Yes, it won't please some round these parts though.

[MGJohn]

E30M3SE said:

Yes, it won't please some round these parts though.

I am one of the exceptions ~ I'm pleased he's got a further extension to his eight years with Ferrari.

Am I the only one who believes his recent improvement in form is because in earlier races this season, did he have first call on the best bits, best car or upgrades... or did the No. 1 driver always have that?

Some enthusiasts believe that the two cars in a team are exactly the same .... simply not true. Rarely ever the case. Usually No 1 driver having first call on the best bits.

Anyone watching the grid walk by DC this past weekend would have noticed the differences he pointed out between Grosjean's and Raikkonen's cars.

With the fairest and best will in the world, it's almost impossible to have two exactly identical cars.

[FloppyRaccoon]

MGJohn said:

E30M3SE said:

Yes, it won't please some round these parts though.

I am one of the exceptions ~ I'm pleased he's got a further extension to his eight years with Ferrari.

Am I the only one who believes his recent improvement in form is because in earlier races this season, did he have first call on the best bits, best car or upgrades... or did the No. 1 driver always have that?

Some enthusiasts believe that the two cars in a team are exactly the same .... simply not true. Rarely ever the case. Usually No 1 driver having first call on the best bits.

Anyone watching the grid walk by DC this past weekend would have noticed the differences he pointed out between Grosjean's and Raikkonen's cars.

With the fairest and best will in the world, it's almost impossible to have two exactly identical cars.

There's got to be at least some truth in this. You can guarantee if there was only one new version of any particular part, Fernando would get it. With Ferrari in a rush to develop their cars, maybe they focused on just the one to begin with? Possibly it's only now things have started to balance out.

[hairyben]

MGJohn said:

I am one of the exceptions ~ I'm pleased he's got a further extension to his eight years with Ferrari.

Am I the only one who believes his recent improvement in form is because in earlier races this season, did he have first call on the best bits, best car or upgrades... or did the No. 1 driver always have that?

Some enthusiasts believe that the two cars in a team are exactly the same .... simply not true. Rarely ever the case. Usually No 1 driver having first call on the best bits.

Anyone watching the grid walk by DC this past weekend would have noticed the differences he pointed out between Grosjean's and Raikkonen's cars.

With the fairest and best will in the world, it's almost impossible to have two exactly identical cars.

Are those "bits" really worth that much though? Maybe in the 60's a "new bit" cost a team a lot and they only had the one, but in the modern era any new bit they so much as think might give half a tenth will be airmailed in triplicate. Is my understanding at least.

And if they conspired to give massa a slightly lesser car... so he'd be unable to challenge the team leader... wouldn't that defeat the whole logic of having a superstar no.1 driver?

[MGJohn]

hairyben said:

MGJohn said:

I am one of the exceptions ~ I'm pleased he's got a further extension to his eight years with Ferrari.

Am I the only one who believes his recent improvement in form is because in earlier races this season, did he have first call on the best bits, best car or upgrades... or did the No. 1 driver always have that?

Some enthusiasts believe that the two cars in a team are exactly the same .... simply not true. Rarely ever the case. Usually No 1 driver having first call on the best bits.

Anyone watching the grid walk by DC this past weekend would have noticed the differences he pointed out between Grosjean's and Raikkonen's cars.

With the fairest and best will in the world, it's almost impossible to have two exactly identical cars.

Are those "bits" really worth that much though? Maybe in the 60's a "new bit" cost a team a lot and they only had the one, but in the modern era any new bit they so much as think might give half a tenth will be airmailed in triplicate. Is my understanding at least.

And if they conspired to give massa a slightly lesser car... so he'd be unable to challenge the team leader... wouldn't that defeat the whole logic of having a superstar no.1 driver?

No conspiracy at all. Cleanse your mind of such irrelivant stuff. It only clouds the issue.

Over the past few seasons, unless I heard wrong, there were several reports where very last minute upgrades flown to the circuits were SINGLE items only!

Hence the "My wing is slower than your'n" mallarkey .. not just wings of course, lots of unseen stuff. ...

That's how I have always seen these things. If it doesn't fit in with Alonso is a Driving God and Massa is useless mindsets so prevalent on this website in recent years .... TOUGH!

FloppyRaccoon said:

There's got to be at least some truth in this. You can guarantee if there was only one new version of any particular part, Fernando would get it. With Ferrari in a rush to develop their cars, maybe they focused on just the one to begin with? Possibly it's only now things have started to balance out.

Nailed it!

[MGJohn]

PW said:

Does that explain why he has been well off the pace for most of 2010, 2011, and even winter testing...? Ferrari's development programme can't be that bad!

Well off the pace you say... so how do YOU explain mixing it repeatedly with golden boy Hamilton and other "racers" during that time?

It could explain the apparent "poor form". Not an impossibility or is it?

Alonso has been with top dogs Ferrari for three seasons now. Will this be third time lucky or will he let yet another WDC opportunity pass him by in a Top car?

Massa was crucial in helping Raikkonen win his single WDC with Ferrari. He nearly secured his WDC and for a few precious seconds was WDC until Hamilton lucked out. You may think that counts for little. I don't and no doubt in my mind neither do the top brass in Ferrari.

That's the way I see these things and who really knows ALL the facts. Certainly not you nor I. Spin a coin and who's right... or wrong. very difficult to prove but, I bet Alonso and the management at ferrari really know and they aint saying, nor should they. Meantime, speculate away. Massa drives for Ferrari in 2013 when so many here and elsewhere thought it was a certainty that one of the faster young bloods would oust him.

[MGJohn]

Bedazzled said:

MGJohn said:

Am I the only one who believes his recent improvement in form is because in earlier races this season, did he have first call on the best bits, best car or upgrades... or did the No. 1 driver always have that?

Are you suggesting Massa's had to wait until now to get all the bits Alonso had all season? I very much doubt it, the car was a dog early in the season and he just couldn't drive it. It's most probably tyre related, they've changed something on the car recently and finally got it in tune with his driving style.

upgrades, best bits, it's ongoing... isn't it? He could always be playing catch up with the upgrades even yesterday. Eventually it could get closer. Was he faster than No. 1 driver yesterday or not? Had they deployed the "Massa ... is ... faster ... than ... yow" message, could he alone have caught the second RB ... and passed it where No. 1 driver had clearly failed to do so ?

There again I may have got it all wrong and the little fella is useless.

[anonymous-user]

MGJohn said:

hairyben said:

MGJohn said:

I am one of the exceptions ~ I'm pleased he's got a further extension to his eight years with Ferrari.

Am I the only one who believes his recent improvement in form is because in earlier races this season, did he have first call on the best bits, best car or upgrades... or did the No. 1 driver always have that?

Some enthusiasts believe that the two cars in a team are exactly the same .... simply not true. Rarely ever the case. Usually No 1 driver having first call on the best bits.

Anyone watching the grid walk by DC this past weekend would have noticed the differences he pointed out between Grosjean's and Raikkonen's cars.

With the fairest and best will in the world, it's almost impossible to have two exactly identical cars.

Are those "bits" really worth that much though? Maybe in the 60's a "new bit" cost a team a lot and they only had the one, but in the modern era any new bit they so much as think might give half a tenth will be airmailed in triplicate. Is my understanding at least.

And if they conspired to give massa a slightly lesser car... so he'd be unable to challenge the team leader... wouldn't that defeat the whole logic of having a superstar no.1 driver?

No conspiracy at all. Cleanse your mind of such irrelivant stuff. It only clouds the issue.

Over the past few seasons, unless I heard wrong, there were several reports where very last minute upgrades flown to the circuits were SINGLE items only!

Hence the "My wing is slower than your'n" mallarkey .. not just wings of course, lots of unseen stuff. ...

That's how I have always seen these things. If it doesn't fit in with Alonso is a Driving God and Massa is useless mindsets so prevalent on this website in recent years .... TOUGH!

FloppyRaccoon said:

There's got to be at least some truth in this. You can guarantee if there was only one new version of any particular part, Fernando would get it. With Ferrari in a rush to develop their cars, maybe they focused on just the one to begin with? Possibly it's only now things have started to balance out.

Nailed it!

You seriously think so?

Well let's wait and see what sort of queue forms for Massa's services in 2014..........

[majordad]

Could be a big queue if he ends up P1 at the year end .