RE: Circuit of Wales 'unviable' says Silverstone

RE: Circuit of Wales 'unviable' says Silverstone

Author
Discussion

dudleybloke

19,717 posts

185 months

framerateuk

2,730 posts

183 months

Tuesday 25th March 2014
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lamboman100 said:
...remotest parts of Britain is crazy
Remotest? Seriously? I can get to London and Birmingham in 2 hours. We're not talking about the outer Hebrides here.

This circuit would be within half an hour of the M4. How on earth is that remote?

Graham

16,368 posts

283 months

Tuesday 25th March 2014
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motoloco said:
Graham said:
mmm so I suppose having a bloody great duel carriageway built so people can get to your circuit doesnt count as state aid...


I guess you mean the A43? That was built to after a long campaign to take all the heavy traffic between the M1 to M40 off the single carriageway roads that ran through several villages. 365 days a year, not just to alleviate the inconvenience on F1 day. Silverstone's benefit was a lucky coincidence.
so the fact that extra millions were spent to get it opened before the gp dont count then

silverstone got plenty of help so should just stop winging

Graham

16,368 posts

283 months

Tuesday 25th March 2014
quotequote all
bqf said:
I race for my hobby, and while anglesey is on my calendar I (and many others) will think about going there, simply because it's a PITA to get to. Ebbw Vale wouldn't be any easier I don't think.
from the midlands less of a ball ache to get to Angelsey than it is Brands hatch.

DonkeyApple

54,919 posts

168 months

Tuesday 25th March 2014
quotequote all
framerateuk said:
Remotest? Seriously? I can get to London and Birmingham in 2 hours. We're not talking about the outer Hebrides here.

This circuit would be within half an hour of the M4. How on earth is that remote?
I'm only 20 mins from the M4, does this mean the circuit is only 10 mins away from me? I'm near J1. wink

bqf

2,226 posts

170 months

Tuesday 25th March 2014
quotequote all
Graham said:
from the midlands less of a ball ache to get to Angelsey than it is Brands hatch.
Really? Where do you live?

bqf

2,226 posts

170 months

Tuesday 25th March 2014
quotequote all
Graham said:
from the midlands less of a ball ache to get to Angelsey than it is Brands hatch.
From the AA website:

Kidderminster - Brands - 167miles, 2 hours, 57 mins
Kidderminster - Anglesey - 136 miles, 3 hours, 20 mins

whistle

CraigyMc

16,299 posts

235 months

Tuesday 25th March 2014
quotequote all
framerateuk said:
lamboman100 said:
...remotest parts of Britain is crazy
Remotest? Seriously? I can get to London and Birmingham in 2 hours. We're not talking about the outer Hebrides here.

This circuit would be within half an hour of the M4. How on earth is that remote?
Google maps recons 3h hours from the planned track location to London.

Given my experience that it's at least 2 hours from Bristol to West London, I'd like to know what mode of transport you are proposing for that 2 hours. Helicopter?

bencollins

3,486 posts

204 months

Tuesday 25th March 2014
quotequote all
Ambitious project, what about starting smaller and growing organically as a business. Gonna be quite snowy and frosty up there.
Can see the track day thing growing though with the computer racing game generation becoming empty nesters.

jmorgan

36,010 posts

283 months

Tuesday 25th March 2014
quotequote all
I get to Coventry from S Wales in two and half hours and this is closer to Coventry from where I live. This place is not far out of anyones way unless you want it to be.

Edited by jmorgan on Tuesday 25th March 18:41

MG CHRIS

9,077 posts

166 months

Tuesday 25th March 2014
quotequote all
Lets get things straight ebbw vale is not in the middle of know where it's half hours drive from Newport or Cardiff.
There are 3 main routes up from the m4 the a470 from cardiff up to the heads of valleys road which is being widened.
A467 from Newport up to newbridge that split into 2 main routes a467-a4046 that goes straight through ebbw vale with a new by-pass around it, or you can split to a472-a4048 which is 50% dual carriage way.

Direct access from midlands via the m5-m50-heads of valleys road.

It's not the wettest place in the country that just bullst it's as wet as any other part of the country.

If your going to comment atleast get some facts not talk st.

As for the track I will see it when I believe it so many things are promised then disappear and I believe this to be the same but as im only 15mins from the planned track which would be brilliant for me and many around the area. as for other tracks in wales llandow is no more than a glorfied kart track and pembrey is over hour and half from me and I live in the valleys. Angelesy is 4hrs drive.

framerateuk

2,730 posts

183 months

Tuesday 25th March 2014
quotequote all
CraigyMc said:
Google maps recons 3h hours from the planned track location to London.

Given my experience that it's at least 2 hours from Bristol to West London, I'd like to know what mode of transport you are proposing for that 2 hours. Helicopter?
Ok, I used to get to London in about 2:30 when I lived near where the circuit is planned, I'm now in Cardiff so it's a bit quicker, so apologies there.

It's still hardly remote though is it? I've driven from Cardiff to Ealing in 2 hours (give or take a couple of minutes) , the circuit is another 25/30 minutes away.

Slight exaggeration on my part, but I honestly can't believe people would call this place remote? For someone who lives in London, Manchester would be more remote!

Edited by framerateuk on Tuesday 25th March 18:59

sisu

2,576 posts

172 months

Tuesday 25th March 2014
quotequote all
framerateuk said:
CraigyMc said:
Google maps recons 3h hours from the planned track location to London.

Given my experience that it's at least 2 hours from Bristol to West London, I'd like to know what mode of transport you are proposing for that 2 hours. Helicopter?
Ok, I used to get to London in about 2:30 when I lived near where the circuit is planned, I'm now in Cardiff so it's a bit quicker, so apologies there.

It's still hardly remote though is it? I've driven from Cardiff to Ealing in 2 hours (give or take a couple of minutes) , the circuit is another 25/30 minutes away.

Slight exaggeration on my part, but I honestly can't believe people would call this place remote? For someone who lives in London, Manchester would be more remote!

Edited by framerateuk on Tuesday 25th March 18:59
I get the feeling you solve problems.. it is 30 minutes away I will be there in 10.

windy1

393 posts

250 months

Tuesday 25th March 2014
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Anglesey cost about 1.4 million to redevelop from what I remember, so it is not big numbers involved here to get the basic track built.
I make the trip from near London to do events at Anglesey and like someone earlier mentioned it is very easy to get to.
It would be the same visiting the new circuit, just like going to Llandow or Pembrey, very easy to get to.

Graham

16,368 posts

283 months

Tuesday 25th March 2014
quotequote all
bqf said:
Graham said:
from the midlands less of a ball ache to get to Angelsey than it is Brands hatch.
From the AA website:

Kidderminster - Brands - 167miles, 2 hours, 57 mins
Kidderminster - Anglesey - 136 miles, 3 hours, 20 mins

whistle
but in the real world its easier to get to anglsey in the truck, and driving by car lots quicker. its also a better circuit when you get there.. put it this way The TVR series is racing at both this year, and Brands is the one I'll skip


andy97

4,691 posts

221 months

Tuesday 25th March 2014
quotequote all
Graham said:
from the midlands less of a ball ache to get to Angelsey than it is Brands hatch.
I agree, not too difficult a drive and no hold ups at the dartford crossing. The circuit is far far better too. It's the best circuit in the country and well worth the effort to get there. And I say that as someone who lives next to the second best circuit in the UK, Donington!

Edited by andy97 on Tuesday 25th March 21:23

swindonredtop

15 posts

121 months

Tuesday 25th March 2014
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The one subject that has baffled me ever since this was announced and hasn't been mentioned yet as far as I can see skimming the responses, is noise. Google Map the site and there's two relatively big housing estates Rassau and Garnlydan right alongside the industrial estate and proposed track. I lived in Rassau for 5 years and can imagine nothing better than a race track on my door step but given the recent cases with Croft, Mallory, various pre-existing banger cicuits and the trouble even Bedford Autodrome has keeping below limits, all of which pre-exist the complainants, even if this gets built, what happens when the first noise complaint comes in from the houses next door? A white elephant that can only operate limited days - makes it even harder to see how the numbers stack up. As much as I'd love to see it happen, I just can't see how it can.

b0rk

2,289 posts

145 months

Tuesday 25th March 2014
quotequote all
Circuit of wales is an automotive business park with a racing circuit attached not a race circuit with a business park.

I can quite understand why Silverstone would be miffed as the future plan for sustainability of Silverstone is based around the business park funded by the new owners. WAG potentially throwing 10's of millions at CoW fundamentally effects the economics of the Silverstone tech park.

I can't be arsed to dig through the published business plan again but would suspect the WAG funding matches or consists of the majority of the amount needed for the basic "circuit" element, Rockingham for example cost £70million in 2001 prices. Whilst costs have gone up since then honestly the circuit build phase will not be costing £270 million.

Reardy Mister

13,757 posts

221 months

Wednesday 26th March 2014
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Hellbound said:
As someone who's spent most of his life in Wales, I can say that the area in question would benefit far more from a much improved railway network and also that much talked about line from Cardiff to London in 40mins. That single improvement to infrastructure alone would improve much of South Wales. But it will never happen. Why? Because the people who run Wales are caught between London and their own ego's.


Wales needs to find st loads of oil and gas...and pretty sharphish.
100% this.

CoW is lunacy. For me the question is this: how would I benefit, were it built? If it secured Motogp, I would have further to drive, even more chance of it pissing with rain and its logistically more difficult to reach. If it diverted funding from Silverstone, the (major) circuit nearest me (and most central to the largest section of the population and motorsport industry) will decline, So what is the point?

The country is barely sustaining the holding of premier motorsport events at its established circuits (thank you Bernie), or the amount of even club level motorsport, that is available. This will be a white elephant of epic proportions if it goes ahead.

Aside from that, my perception is that for the amount of land they occupy and grief they get from surrounding areas (NIMBYs), the job creation for these circuits is relatively small and unlikely to do enough to counteract local bad feeling towards noise, traffic, speeding track day warriors/fans etc. I suspect you could have the same economic impact with a fraction of the cap-ex by getting a good annual music festival established. And music is something the Welsh are known for, at least. And spaced-out students don't care what the weather does.







ayseven

130 posts

145 months

Wednesday 26th March 2014
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You wouldn't get most governments in the world ready to pay for a circuit that isn't holding a national GP; certainly not here in Canada. Our local circuit is probably the best one in the whole country and it is of course, totally privately held. Nobody expects the government to pay for anything. I have no idea if these places make money, but they are playthings for rich people, not businesses as such.