NASCAR driver kills competitor on track.
Discussion
drakart said:
At race speeds - completely agree. At yellow flag speed - the steering works.
As long as you are off the power they will steer.
Not what my mate who races them believes. Far easier to turn quickly on the power than just steering. As long as you are off the power they will steer.
Plus massive blind spots means it could easily be an accident.
I've raced vaguely similar things and whilst I don't disagree, he killed him by having the power on. He got ripped under the wheels. I just think that there were better ways to react - ie. not by speeding up the impact speed and exposing him to a spinning rear wheel and sliding that rear wheel towards the guy.
They race simular cars at Coventry Std ,At normal speeds they steer normal but at race speeds they just chuck them sideways and use the 700 bhp to drift them around on the shale surface.
By the way at low speeds they stop on a dime so no reason for Tony not to use them and most are running loads of inside brake bias to help drag the front into the bend and keep them away from the fence.
By the way at low speeds they stop on a dime so no reason for Tony not to use them and most are running loads of inside brake bias to help drag the front into the bend and keep them away from the fence.
Colonial said:
John D. said:
The one where Stewart guns the throttle and goes sideways as he clips the other driver. Gunning the throttle sent the car sideways rather than gain speed. You can see him steer right into the oversteer.
A sprintcar doesn't steer in a traditional sense. It steers on the throttle. It's not like a standard road car.
Yellow flag doesn't mean slow down, it just means caution and no overtaking. Even if it did mean slow down, then would any of you guys like to try to slow a sprint car on a gravel track to avoid a guy running out on the track who wanted to have words with you? I agree that he could even be gassing the car to try to avoid the guy. It definitely doesn't look deliberate IMO.
In the briefing for all races I've been involved with, they say in the event of an accident either stay put or dive over the nearest tyre wall. Don't walk onto the racing line. That pretty much amounts to suicide IMO.
In the briefing for all races I've been involved with, they say in the event of an accident either stay put or dive over the nearest tyre wall. Don't walk onto the racing line. That pretty much amounts to suicide IMO.
Edited by MarJay on Monday 11th August 15:15
The thing that everyone fails to even think about is that Stewart probably wouldn't even twig who the person was initially.
All you'd see would be a person on track, and you'd then react to that appropriately. I for one know that when something like a safety car comes out, your mind, for the first 30s or so, is elsewhere as you gather your thoughts about the rest of the race. If someone ran out at me within those 30s, I would not have the presence of mind to be able to attach that person to the car that was just behind me on track. It wouldn't be until you'd settled yourself to see where everyone had ended up behind you and in front of you that you'd work out who it was that had gone off.
In my opinion, no racing driver would ever aim their car at a person. I for one see a car and a person very differently. I'm racing against a car first, and a person second.
Either way, it's very sad that this had to happen...
All you'd see would be a person on track, and you'd then react to that appropriately. I for one know that when something like a safety car comes out, your mind, for the first 30s or so, is elsewhere as you gather your thoughts about the rest of the race. If someone ran out at me within those 30s, I would not have the presence of mind to be able to attach that person to the car that was just behind me on track. It wouldn't be until you'd settled yourself to see where everyone had ended up behind you and in front of you that you'd work out who it was that had gone off.
In my opinion, no racing driver would ever aim their car at a person. I for one see a car and a person very differently. I'm racing against a car first, and a person second.
Either way, it's very sad that this had to happen...
MarJay said:
Yellow flag doesn't mean slow down, it just means caution and no overtaking.
Sorry MarJay but that's simply not correct. A yellow flag is universally known in Motorsport to mean that you have to slow down (the norm is half race speed). For example, drivers are penalised if they set a faster sector/lap time during a yellow flag. That's why you will hear Martin Brundle talk say how that yellow has ruined someone's lap...Edited by MarJay on Monday 11th August 15:15
My thoughts on this terrible accident are sadly that this is down to Ward Jr. He should never have been out in the middle of a dark race track in a black race suit. Having watched it a couple of times (more than enough given the circumstances) I think Stewart didn't see him to the last second and tried to swerve around him. I don't for one second subscribe to some of the morons out there saying he "murdered him!". No doubt Tony Stewart is an a
hole but he's not a murderer. We all know motorsport is dangerous at the best of times even when all the safety precutions are adhered to. But walking on to a live race track in the dark in a black race suit was unfortunately the single most dumbest thing Ward Jr ever did and sadly it was also the last.
I'm sorry if that came across as harsh as my thoughts and condolences are with his family as this must be just awful for them but this was a terrible accident that could have been avoided.
StuartMcKay said:
Sorry MarJay but that's simply not correct. A yellow flag is universally known in Motorsport to mean that you have to slow down (the norm is half race speed). For example, drivers are penalised if they set a faster sector/lap time during a yellow flag. That's why you will hear Martin Brundle talk say how that yellow has ruined someone's lap...
Not strictly true. The rule only specifies that you need to:MSA Blue Book Q.15.1 e said:
Yellow flag – Stationary: Danger, slow down sufficiently to ensure that full control of the vehicle can be retained. No overtaking.
SourceSo it means 'just below full race pace'. Not half speed. F1 and general FIA/MSA regulations are two very different things. Also, the rules for stock car and US racing is subtly different again.
RacerMike said:
StuartMcKay said:
Sorry MarJay but that's simply not correct. A yellow flag is universally known in Motorsport to mean that you have to slow down (the norm is half race speed). For example, drivers are penalised if they set a faster sector/lap time during a yellow flag. That's why you will hear Martin Brundle talk say how that yellow has ruined someone's lap...
Not strictly true. The rule only specifies that you need to:MSA Blue Book Q.15.1 e said:
Yellow flag – Stationary: Danger, slow down sufficiently to ensure that full control of the vehicle can be retained. No overtaking.
SourceSo it means 'just below full race pace'. Not half speed. F1 and general FIA/MSA regulations are two very different things. Also, the rules for stock car and US racing is subtly different again.
In any case, a tragic incident for all involved...
I think some people need to know about American culture.
Its considered OK to climb out your car and vent your frustration, it happens every week in NASCAR. This because in oval racing a "yellow" is full course caution so everybody is expected to slows down and a pace car will pace the field.
Its considered OK to climb out your car and vent your frustration, it happens every week in NASCAR. This because in oval racing a "yellow" is full course caution so everybody is expected to slows down and a pace car will pace the field.
entropy said:
I think some people need to know about American culture.
Its considered OK to climb out your car and vent your frustration, it happens every week in NASCAR. This because in oval racing a "yellow" is full course caution so everybody is expected to slows down and a pace car will pace the field.
If a NASCAR driver attempted to walk on track as cars approached he'd be dragged out of the way by officials. driver might take a jog around the garage area to find a rival (yes Mr Bowyer I do mean you). Fights on pitlane etc maybe, but not in the middle of the track with cars oncoming, pace car or not.Its considered OK to climb out your car and vent your frustration, it happens every week in NASCAR. This because in oval racing a "yellow" is full course caution so everybody is expected to slows down and a pace car will pace the field.
Crafty_ said:
If a NASCAR driver attempted to walk on track as cars approached he'd be dragged out of the way by officials. driver might take a jog around the garage area to find a rival (yes Mr Bowyer I do mean you). Fights on pitlane etc maybe, but not in the middle of the track with cars oncoming, pace car or not.
Really.....https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9ckPEP1Z3CYCrafty_ said:
If a NASCAR driver attempted to walk on track as cars approached he'd be dragged out of the way by officials. driver might take a jog around the garage area to find a rival (yes Mr Bowyer I do mean you). Fights on pitlane etc maybe, but not in the middle of the track with cars oncoming, pace car or not.
Crafty_ said:
If a NASCAR driver attempted to walk on track as cars approached he'd be dragged out of the way by officials. driver might take a jog around the garage area to find a rival (yes Mr Bowyer I do mean you). Fights on pitlane etc maybe, but not in the middle of the track with cars oncoming, pace car or not.
To clarify I was referring to the remonstrating finger pointing thing - the officials do bugger all until after hot head manages to to aim his finger as the right person; some hot heads throw their helmet at the car in question and I seem to remember a certain Smoke do something at Martinsville in the late 90s: correct me if I'm wrong but didn't he stick his head in someone's car under caution?RacerMike said:
StuartMcKay said:
Sorry MarJay but that's simply not correct. A yellow flag is universally known in Motorsport to mean that you have to slow down (the norm is half race speed). For example, drivers are penalised if they set a faster sector/lap time during a yellow flag. That's why you will hear Martin Brundle talk say how that yellow has ruined someone's lap...
Not strictly true. The rule only specifies that you need to:MSA Blue Book Q.15.1 e said:
Yellow flag – Stationary: Danger, slow down sufficiently to ensure that full control of the vehicle can be retained. No overtaking.
SourceSo it means 'just below full race pace'. Not half speed. F1 and general FIA/MSA regulations are two very different things. Also, the rules for stock car and US racing is subtly different again.
Smoke climbs out getting mad and trying to get his hands/fists into the late Kenny Irwin Jr who is still in his car:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9mRY79mat34
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9mRY79mat34
StuartMcKay said:
Sorry MarJay but that's simply not correct. A yellow flag is universally known in Motorsport to mean that you have to slow down (the norm is half race speed). For example, drivers are penalised if they set a faster sector/lap time during a yellow flag. That's why you will hear Martin Brundle talk say how that yellow has ruined someone's lap...
In either of the two series I race in here in the US, you'd only slow down to 50% speed if there were double waved yellows. A 'normal' yellow would be ~70% race speed. entropy said:
I think some people need to know about American culture.
Its considered OK to climb out your car and vent your frustration, it happens every week in NASCAR. This because in oval racing a "yellow" is full course caution so everybody is expected to slows down and a pace car will pace the field.
This is absolutely not true of all US motorsport. With about 15 minutes to go before the end of the last race I did (a 12 hour at Brainerd) a car spun on the start-finish straight and ended up on it's side (we got about 4 inches of rain that day, it was extremely wet). The driver didn't wait for a safety truck to get to him before he climbed out, and he stood up in triumph (presumably for not having a scratch on him) on the side of the car. End result was a severe bIts considered OK to climb out your car and vent your frustration, it happens every week in NASCAR. This because in oval racing a "yellow" is full course caution so everybody is expected to slows down and a pace car will pace the field.
king from the race director for doing so. Unless you're on fire, you wait in the car for instructions. NASCAR unfortunately has been much less strict on this sort of thing and it is true, they basically encourage helmet throwing and other stupid nonsense. Hopefully that's going to change after this tragic accident.
Edited by Dr JonboyG on Tuesday 12th August 04:49
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