RE: Motorsport on Monday: 18/08/14
Discussion
No doubt it is an incomplete account of total earning power because it omits bonuses (if any) and sponsorship deals (if any), but interesting none the less. That said I am surprised by the range though I imagine that competition to get on the bottom rung will keep basic salary costs low if your sponsorship potential is low.
Standout performers this year for me are Ricciardo and Bottas.
Standout performers this year for me are Ricciardo and Bottas.
McSam said:
What's your source?
Maybe Kobayashi is getting paid £150k - but only after personally providing over a million euros from his sponsors and fundraising, so his salary is an irrelevance.
Can we get a proper consideration of the drivers' actual profit / loss from a season?
This with bells on Im amazed some drivers get a salary. Maybe Kobayashi is getting paid £150k - but only after personally providing over a million euros from his sponsors and fundraising, so his salary is an irrelevance.
Can we get a proper consideration of the drivers' actual profit / loss from a season?
oldtimer2 said:
That said I am surprised by the range though I imagine that competition to get on the bottom rung will keep basic salary costs low if your sponsorship potential is low.
Not at all, to get on the bottom rung you need cash. Full stop. Unless you're on a team or sponsor development programme the only way you're getting into an F1 car is by bringing a great big bag of banknotes with you.If we keep in Euros for consistency with the article you need a minimum of about €6m for a back-of-the-grid seat, this is around four times what is needed for GP2. The likes of Gutierrez, Maldonado and Perez can bring this as they are from privelaged families with connections to the elite in their homelands, so commercial backers follow them. As there aren't many Mexican or Venezuelan F1 drivers they are also very marketable back home. On the other hand Charles Pic, Geido van der Garde and Max Chilton just have very wealthy families and associated businesses to support them.
Racing single seaters is seriously expensive, a few years ago (3 or 4 maybe) I had a meeting with the father of a budding racer to discuss sponsoring his son in Formula Renault. Having carefully researched the career paths to F1, and in spite of him having a very marketable name and image, the expectation was that he'd have to find £6-10m to get through the feeder series to F1, and that's before you've bought an F1 drive.
jamiebae said:
Racing single seaters is seriously expensive, a few years ago (3 or 4 maybe) I had a meeting with the father of a budding racer to discuss sponsoring his son in Formula Renault. Having carefully researched the career paths to F1, and in spite of him having a very marketable name and image, the expectation was that he'd have to find £6-10m to get through the feeder series to F1, and that's before you've bought an F1 drive.
Just the one season in GP2 then 
Rude-boy said:
jamiebae said:
Racing single seaters is seriously expensive, a few years ago (3 or 4 maybe) I had a meeting with the father of a budding racer to discuss sponsoring his son in Formula Renault. Having carefully researched the career paths to F1, and in spite of him having a very marketable name and image, the expectation was that he'd have to find £6-10m to get through the feeder series to F1, and that's before you've bought an F1 drive.
Just the one season in GP2 then Still, it's a massive amount of cash. If you want to make a living from racing them sportscars is the way to go, there are far more paid drives available there than the handful of genuinely paid single seater perches.
jamiebae said:
He already had some experience in a lower level single seater series, I think the plan was one year in FR2.0, two in F3 and two in FR3.5 or GP2 which should come in within budget, leaving enough spare to cover a couple of F1 tests/young driver days and maybe a third driver role.
Still, it's a massive amount of cash. If you want to make a living from racing them sportscars is the way to go, there are far more paid drives available there than the handful of genuinely paid single seater perches.
Exactly!! I doubt Audi, Porsche or Toyota have drivers bringing cash; and that's just in LMP1....they're there on merit.Still, it's a massive amount of cash. If you want to make a living from racing them sportscars is the way to go, there are far more paid drives available there than the handful of genuinely paid single seater perches.
I reckon being one of the Porsche GT Factory drivers is a pretty nice job to.
Ridiculous really: paying to take part in top level sport. Can you imagine it in many other sports??
RB Will said:
This segment made me want to kill myself 
"the lowest paid drivers, Caterham's Kamui Kobayashi and Marcus Ericsson, get 'just' 150,000 euros a year (£120,000). Wayne Rooney gets over twice that for one week's 'work' at Manchester United."
He earns more running around for a couple of hours occasionally kicking a ball and falling over than I do working 5 days a week for 5 years in a serious job where thousands of people could be very ill or die if I cock up.
Same here! "the lowest paid drivers, Caterham's Kamui Kobayashi and Marcus Ericsson, get 'just' 150,000 euros a year (£120,000). Wayne Rooney gets over twice that for one week's 'work' at Manchester United."
He earns more running around for a couple of hours occasionally kicking a ball and falling over than I do working 5 days a week for 5 years in a serious job where thousands of people could be very ill or die if I cock up.
RB Will said:
This segment made me want to kill myself
"the lowest paid drivers, Caterham's Kamui Kobayashi and Marcus Ericsson, get 'just' 150,000 euros a year (£120,000). Wayne Rooney gets over twice that for one week's 'work' at Manchester United."
He earns more running around for a couple of hours occasionally kicking a ball and falling over than I do working 5 days a week for 5 years in a serious job where thousands of people could be very ill or die if I cock up.
Same here! "the lowest paid drivers, Caterham's Kamui Kobayashi and Marcus Ericsson, get 'just' 150,000 euros a year (£120,000). Wayne Rooney gets over twice that for one week's 'work' at Manchester United."
He earns more running around for a couple of hours occasionally kicking a ball and falling over than I do working 5 days a week for 5 years in a serious job where thousands of people could be very ill or die if I cock up.
Ferrari got mugged. Or mugged themselves (again). It doesn't take a genius to work out that Bianchi (their driver, the irony) would have scored more points than the sad clown for 1/10th or 1/20th of the money. But are they going to pay Kimi not to drive (again!!!!!) next year ? Or this time, did they manage to impose a performance clause ?
With that kind of naivety, no wonder they are struggling.
With that kind of naivety, no wonder they are struggling.
jason61c said:
"Paid a pittance
The poor drivers flogging their guts out at the tail end of the field actually get paid a fairly meagre salary, given they're putting themselves at risk every time they roll out of pit lane - even if it is something they love."
Really? Should we feel sorry for them? Racing an F1 car is safer than most things you do on a day to day basis. How many people would be happy to get paid £150-200k to do what they do? Not to mention all the other streams of cash they have coming in.
Such a silly statement really.
You shouldn't feel sorry for them, but I'm pretty sure having a career as an F1 driver completely takes over your life. Constantly away from home, family/partner relationships suffer, I'd want a sThe poor drivers flogging their guts out at the tail end of the field actually get paid a fairly meagre salary, given they're putting themselves at risk every time they roll out of pit lane - even if it is something they love."
Really? Should we feel sorry for them? Racing an F1 car is safer than most things you do on a day to day basis. How many people would be happy to get paid £150-200k to do what they do? Not to mention all the other streams of cash they have coming in.
Such a silly statement really.
t load of money as well.On top of that there are press conferences, annoying sponsorship crap like filming adverts to do, not being able to eat/drink what you want etc. £200k would be the minimum.
Not to mention that in order to actually get into F1 your family has probably spent hundreds of thousands of pounds, and sacrificed a lot of their time as well.
ETA: Now I understand people say 'get paid loads of money to do something you love', but it appears there is no escape. It's racing/training/simulator/testing for 10 months a year, and if successful you will do this for 15 years (i.e. Jenson).
Edited by RenOHH on Monday 18th August 17:53
Alex Langheck said:
jamiebae said:
He already had some experience in a lower level single seater series, I think the plan was one year in FR2.0, two in F3 and two in FR3.5 or GP2 which should come in within budget, leaving enough spare to cover a couple of F1 tests/young driver days and maybe a third driver role.
Still, it's a massive amount of cash. If you want to make a living from racing them sportscars is the way to go, there are far more paid drives available there than the handful of genuinely paid single seater perches.
Exactly!! I doubt Audi, Porsche or Toyota have drivers bringing cash; and that's just in LMP1....they're there on merit.Still, it's a massive amount of cash. If you want to make a living from racing them sportscars is the way to go, there are far more paid drives available there than the handful of genuinely paid single seater perches.
I reckon being one of the Porsche GT Factory drivers is a pretty nice job to.
Ridiculous really: paying to take part in top level sport. Can you imagine it in many other sports??
Even in GTE-Am at Le Mans, or domestic GT3 championships drivers earn a reasonable living because the amateur pilots need a quick guy to share the car with if they want to win. Single seaters is a mugs game at the moment, the only people making money are the guys running teams in feeder series, and Bernie and the big guys in F1.
derin100 said:
RB Will said:
This segment made me want to kill myself
"the lowest paid drivers, Caterham's Kamui Kobayashi and Marcus Ericsson, get 'just' 150,000 euros a year (£120,000). Wayne Rooney gets over twice that for one week's 'work' at Manchester United."
He earns more running around for a couple of hours occasionally kicking a ball and falling over than I do working 5 days a week for 5 years in a serious job where thousands of people could be very ill or die if I cock up.
Same here! "the lowest paid drivers, Caterham's Kamui Kobayashi and Marcus Ericsson, get 'just' 150,000 euros a year (£120,000). Wayne Rooney gets over twice that for one week's 'work' at Manchester United."
He earns more running around for a couple of hours occasionally kicking a ball and falling over than I do working 5 days a week for 5 years in a serious job where thousands of people could be very ill or die if I cock up.
RenOHH said:
jason61c said:
"Paid a pittance
The poor drivers flogging their guts out at the tail end of the field actually get paid a fairly meagre salary, given they're putting themselves at risk every time they roll out of pit lane - even if it is something they love."
Really? Should we feel sorry for them? Racing an F1 car is safer than most things you do on a day to day basis. How many people would be happy to get paid £150-200k to do what they do? Not to mention all the other streams of cash they have coming in.
Such a silly statement really.
You shouldn't feel sorry for them, but I'm pretty sure having a career as an F1 driver completely takes over your life. Constantly away from home, family/partner relationships suffer, I'd want a sThe poor drivers flogging their guts out at the tail end of the field actually get paid a fairly meagre salary, given they're putting themselves at risk every time they roll out of pit lane - even if it is something they love."
Really? Should we feel sorry for them? Racing an F1 car is safer than most things you do on a day to day basis. How many people would be happy to get paid £150-200k to do what they do? Not to mention all the other streams of cash they have coming in.
Such a silly statement really.
t load of money as well.On top of that there are press conferences, annoying sponsorship crap like filming adverts to do, not being able to eat/drink what you want etc. £200k would be the minimum.
Not to mention that in order to actually get into F1 your family has probably spent hundreds of thousands of pounds, and sacrificed a lot of their time as well.
ETA: Now I understand people say 'get paid loads of money to do something you love', but it appears there is no escape. It's racing/training/simulator/testing for 10 months a year, and if successful you will do this for 15 years (i.e. Jenson).
Edited by RenOHH on Monday 18th August 17:53
t load of money as well"That happens to 'normal' people with 'normal' jobs all the time. I'd still struggling to find any reason why i'd feel sorry for one of them.
jason61c said:
That happens to 'normal' people with 'normal' jobs all the time. I'd still struggling to find any reason why i'd feel sorry for one of them.
But I didn't say you should feel sorry for them. I said they should be paid that much because it takes up their entire life. But just how many people have jobs that require them to go to 19-20 different countries per year for 4-5 days at a time?I bet they're on £200k+ too.
RenOHH said:
jason61c said:
That happens to 'normal' people with 'normal' jobs all the time. I'd still struggling to find any reason why i'd feel sorry for one of them.
But I didn't say you should feel sorry for them. I said they should be paid that much because it takes up their entire life. But just how many people have jobs that require them to go to 19-20 different countries per year for 4-5 days at a time?I bet they're on £200k+ too.
t. Perhaps admiration as they devote their entire youth to their craft. No boozing from Friday till Sunday every week like the rest of us, no long lies if we fancy it, flying 1st class until it becomes tedious. Often not knowing what country they are in because all the hotel rooms look the same, and once a season they actually get to race in their home GP and sleep in their own bed (perhaps). Many (and I admire old man Hamilton for this) from modest backgrounds scraping to gain recognition.Then the ability to smile all day, every day when they must be gritting their teeth just wanting the constant photo shoots and handshaking to end. Perpetually signing autographs for snotty, cheeky, unruly kids they probably want to slap, and the parents who are even worse. Then the hard nosed business side, dealing with the politics and slimy b
ds like Ecclestone, worrying that their agent is fleecing them or their accountant is robbing them. And you just know some bd is knocking off the gorgeous bird you can't get to see cos she's off on a cosmetics advert assignment on the other side of the world. Then the papers make up a story that she is being knocked off or that you have touched up a 15 year old bird who looked 25.It isn't the life Graham Hill, Chapman and Clark had. Theirs was I suspect, genuinely a bit more romantic when the racing was an interruption to the beach. Or a small cafe with a few glasses of wine and the chance to leer at the passing totty safe in the knowledge that all but the very well informed, would think you were just dirty old (young) men.
You can have it. The money just isn't worth the hassle. The celebrity status is all that matters to them now. As someone pointed out, in what other sport would the competitor have to buy a place on the start line. Would Usain Bolt or Mo even get a run? Probably not.
Make Essex raceway, some Go Karting and 4x4 mud plugging part of F1 and find out who the really good drivers are. Get them all back on Brands, Cadwell, Oulton Park in V8 touring cars, and throw in a couple of WRC races as part of the championship, then we might see some really good drivers emerge.
F1 has become too specialised. Even Marques is pondering the prospect of racing a Moto2 bike when he bags the championship, and Clark died in an F2 race. Make a Moto3 race part of the F1 calendar, all drivers must participate. I'll bet my mortgage the motorcyclists could adapt to cars better than the other way round and would wipe the floor with our F1 primadonna's across the motorsports spectrum.
OK, now I have an idea. Not the above though. Any promoters out there?
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