Formula E Beijing
Discussion
kambites said:
I think it has potential once the spec cars disappear for future seasons, although there's probably a good chance of such a performance/range disparity between different cars that there is little actual racing at the front. They need to ditch the daft gimmicks if they want it to appeal to actual racing fans rather than social media types.
They need social media types to build a market that's attractive to sponsors.Remember Chapman's law (one of them) "Money is how we keep score in motorsport these days".
Altrezia said:
If this is the future of motorsport then I may hang up my helmet.
I found it hard to watch it was so dull. Slow cars, no grip and a boring track.
Let's see what happens next time out, but so far, not impressed.
Electric racing has the potential to bring more racers into motorsport and eventually at a lower cost. I found it hard to watch it was so dull. Slow cars, no grip and a boring track.
Let's see what happens next time out, but so far, not impressed.
One of the biggest hurdles of the majority of formulas has been the noise issue. We could have circuits running electric junior single seaters and track days for road legal EVs 24/7. After all, motor racing is about a driver having fun and competing, not massaging his ego with loud noise. Most racing drivers will race anything on wheels.
kambites said:
I think it has potential once the spec cars disappear for future seasons, although there's probably a good chance of such a performance/range disparity between different cars that there is little actual racing at the front. They need to ditch the daft gimmicks if they want it to appeal to actual racing fans rather than social media types.
Social media types? Doesn't that include people on forums? You know, the people who after every F1 race express how they think the sport should be run, who should or shouldn't be driving, what punishments should be dished out, what is unfair etc.Now the fans can actually have their say, e.g Nick Heidfeld could be gifted a 5 second power advantage and Nico Prost never receives one for the rest of the season.
I had to chuckle at the green environmental claims being bandied about.
Two cars managed 25 laps of a 3.44km circuit giving a total distance of 86km.
The cars use 28kwh batteries made by Williams and as the aim is to go as quick as possible without running out of charge, I guess they used all 56kwh. That's 1.5km/kwh. Pretty feeble.
If these cars were charged on the UK grid with a generous figure of 470gCO2/kwh (It's actually higher at the moment due to increased coal use) this would result in a total CO2 emission of 26.3kg... or 306gCO2/km. Even a range rover can beat that!
Two cars managed 25 laps of a 3.44km circuit giving a total distance of 86km.
The cars use 28kwh batteries made by Williams and as the aim is to go as quick as possible without running out of charge, I guess they used all 56kwh. That's 1.5km/kwh. Pretty feeble.
If these cars were charged on the UK grid with a generous figure of 470gCO2/kwh (It's actually higher at the moment due to increased coal use) this would result in a total CO2 emission of 26.3kg... or 306gCO2/km. Even a range rover can beat that!
Yeah, but a Formula E car is a racecar, in a race. How many racecars can match that emissions performance? I know what you're saying, it's somewhat misleading to claim that Formula E racing is a clean pastime, I just think that comparison with a Range Rover is a bit apples and oranges.
humph said:
I had to chuckle at the green environmental claims being bandied about.
Two cars managed 25 laps of a 3.44km circuit giving a total distance of 86km.
The cars use 28kwh batteries made by Williams and as the aim is to go as quick as possible without running out of charge, I guess they used all 56kwh. That's 1.5km/kwh. Pretty feeble.
If these cars were charged on the UK grid with a generous figure of 470gCO2/kwh (It's actually higher at the moment due to increased coal use) this would result in a total CO2 emission of 26.3kg... or 306gCO2/km. Even a range rover can beat that!
Actually, the main 'bandying about' in the build-up has been that they hope the technology will improve and accelerate the evolution of EV's together with trying to attract a new audience. I can't fathom out why so many car enthusiasts are putting Formula E down. Combustion engine cars were allowed to evolve. Two cars managed 25 laps of a 3.44km circuit giving a total distance of 86km.
The cars use 28kwh batteries made by Williams and as the aim is to go as quick as possible without running out of charge, I guess they used all 56kwh. That's 1.5km/kwh. Pretty feeble.
If these cars were charged on the UK grid with a generous figure of 470gCO2/kwh (It's actually higher at the moment due to increased coal use) this would result in a total CO2 emission of 26.3kg... or 306gCO2/km. Even a range rover can beat that!
Edited by oilspill on Sunday 14th September 13:57
JonRB said:
marshalla said:
I suspect they can't get the battery packaging right yet. The damn things probably occupy most of the chassis.
Yes, you're probably right. In fact, they probably concluded it was easier to have 2 cars. 
Also by swapping batteries you're resigning to the electric cars archilles heel; the goal must surely be to work on endurance.
civicduty said:
10 place grid penalty for Prost at the next round.
Should be sitting a race out on the naughty step, utterly reprehensible driving. Had Heidfelts car not gone it to the barrier floor first then he'd be lucky to be alive.Very disappointed in the race. As others have pointed out. Slow. Crap looking. Naff track. Awful noise - not just 'not great' but actually nasty.
Formula E might last two years but it's got fail written all over it.
So many 'motorsport enthusiasts' dismissing this series within 25 laps of it starting. It's depressing. I look forward to the next round of the championship and the next discussion thread when there will hopefully be fewer small minded changeophobes putting it down. The milk float picture- very droll. Original. Well done. The comparison with Range Rover CO2 emissions? Relevant. Well done.
The series will develop, and I acknowledge that development is needed, but I just hope that this series gains some momentum and gets the chance to develop.
The series will develop, and I acknowledge that development is needed, but I just hope that this series gains some momentum and gets the chance to develop.
IainT said:
Had Heidfelts car not gone it to the barrier floor first then he'd be lucky to be alive.
You need to check the video again; his head was unbelievably close to the wall, must have been a matter of inches. From the reaction of a lot of people in the pits (including Alain) they thought he'd had it.Not a great start - I'd hoped for more racing as drivers decided when and how to use overboost, but most of it seemed to be a line astern procession. The speed (or lack thereof) itself didn't bother me as there can be some exciting racing in the lower formulae that are slower than this. The track was a big let down with no elevation changes and mickey-mouse chicanes that gave no overtaking opportunities. Unsafe too, given Heidfeld's accident; if there's one thing they need to learn from this (and GP3) it's that sausage curbs have no place on single seater tracks.
A few things that didn't make sense to me:
1. The formation lap. Went on for ever; the engines didn't need to warm up and it was too slow to put any heat in the brakes or tyres. It did nothing except dilute the anticipation of the start.
2. The car swap. If the intent is to ensure the driver is strapped in safely, then they should limit the garage time and an FIA bod confirm the straps are safe. From the coverage it looked as though the driver could rush the change over and then add seconds by cruising the pitlane. It made for some interesting tactics but may not have ensured the drivers' safety.
3. Fan boost - did anyone actually notice it being deployed?
A few things that didn't make sense to me:
1. The formation lap. Went on for ever; the engines didn't need to warm up and it was too slow to put any heat in the brakes or tyres. It did nothing except dilute the anticipation of the start.
2. The car swap. If the intent is to ensure the driver is strapped in safely, then they should limit the garage time and an FIA bod confirm the straps are safe. From the coverage it looked as though the driver could rush the change over and then add seconds by cruising the pitlane. It made for some interesting tactics but may not have ensured the drivers' safety.
3. Fan boost - did anyone actually notice it being deployed?
oilspill said:
kambites said:
I think it has potential once the spec cars disappear for future seasons, although there's probably a good chance of such a performance/range disparity between different cars that there is little actual racing at the front. They need to ditch the daft gimmicks if they want it to appeal to actual racing fans rather than social media types.
Social media types? Doesn't that include people on forums? You know, the people who after every F1 race express how they think the sport should be run, who should or shouldn't be driving, what punishments should be dished out, what is unfair etc.Now the fans can actually have their say, e.g Nick Heidfeld could be gifted a 5 second power advantage and Nico Prost never receives one for the rest of the season.
Watched it live and watched a replay just to double check but this race was an epic face plant, pitting for a car swap half way through was laughable and really undermines the message that electric cars are raceable, the cars themselves were slow and the warm lap was just embarrassing.
sad61t said:
Not a great start - I'd hoped for more racing as drivers decided when and how to use overboost, but most of it seemed to be a line astern procession. The speed (or lack thereof) itself didn't bother me as there can be some exciting racing in the lower formulae that are slower than this. The track was a big let down with no elevation changes and mickey-mouse chicanes that gave no overtaking opportunities. Unsafe too, given Heidfeld's accident; if there's one thing they need to learn from this (and GP3) it's that sausage curbs have no place on single seater tracks.
A few things that didn't make sense to me:
1. The formation lap. Went on for ever; the engines didn't need to warm up and it was too slow to put any heat in the brakes or tyres. It did nothing except dilute the anticipation of the start.
2. The car swap. If the intent is to ensure the driver is strapped in safely, then they should limit the garage time and an FIA bod confirm the straps are safe. From the coverage it looked as though the driver could rush the change over and then add seconds by cruising the pitlane. It made for some interesting tactics but may not have ensured the drivers' safety.
3. Fan boost - did anyone actually notice it being deployed?
The very slow formation lap was to minimise the battery drain on that lap. I doubt it makes much difference not being able to warm up the tyres, so that will stay. The brakes would benefit from warming up, but that raises another question- why carbon brakes? With top speeds of 100mph or so, they're hardly needed are they? I know they weigh a lot, but even so?A few things that didn't make sense to me:
1. The formation lap. Went on for ever; the engines didn't need to warm up and it was too slow to put any heat in the brakes or tyres. It did nothing except dilute the anticipation of the start.
2. The car swap. If the intent is to ensure the driver is strapped in safely, then they should limit the garage time and an FIA bod confirm the straps are safe. From the coverage it looked as though the driver could rush the change over and then add seconds by cruising the pitlane. It made for some interesting tactics but may not have ensured the drivers' safety.
3. Fan boost - did anyone actually notice it being deployed?
I've only just seen what these things weigh. 888Kg with 200bhp? No wonder they're slow.
I'll watch any form of motor racing and I don't really care what the propulsion is, but a power to weight ratio of little over 200bhp per tonne isn't going to be interesting to many, is it?
MikeO996 said:
IainT said:
Had Heidfelts car not gone it to the barrier floor first then he'd be lucky to be alive.
You need to check the video again; his head was unbelievably close to the wall, must have been a matter of inches. From the reaction of a lot of people in the pits (including Alain) they thought he'd had it.MikeO996 said:
Godalmighty83 said:
the cars themselves were slow
Do we have any objective evidence of this? I.e did anything else run on the track over the weekend? Are they running any tracks that are regularly used so we could compare?
Are there any meaningful times for Donington practice?
Maybe better to compare with FF Duratec. Same power but the FE weighs well over twice as much, and again worse rubber.
REALIST123 said:
MikeO996 said:
Godalmighty83 said:
the cars themselves were slow
Do we have any objective evidence of this? I.e did anything else run on the track over the weekend? Are they running any tracks that are regularly used so we could compare?
Are there any meaningful times for Donington practice?
Maybe better to compare with FF Duratec. Same power but the FE weighs well over twice as much, and again worse rubber.
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