Formula E Beijing

Author
Discussion

BritishRacinGrin

24,602 posts

159 months

Monday 15th September 2014
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Fortunately, many other people are basing their attitudes towards electric cars on facts rather than conjecture.

Roo

11,503 posts

206 months

Monday 15th September 2014
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I recorded it so that I could miss all the build up before and just watch the race.

I enjoyed it. Yes, there's lots to criticise but it will improve as the teams start to do their own things.

I don't dislike the noise. It's like this years F1, it lets you hear other things that the cars are doing such as tyre noise.

spats

838 posts

154 months

Monday 15th September 2014
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Roo said:
I recorded it so that I could miss all the build up before and just watch the race.

I enjoyed it. Yes, there's lots to criticise but it will improve as the teams start to do their own things.

I don't dislike the noise. It's like this years F1, it lets you hear other things that the cars are doing such as tyre noise.
I missed the race, hopefully its on their itv player to rewatch?

The theory sounds fine to me. Yes the green credentials are a bti laughable, but it could have legs as a series if they get it right.

I dont see swapping cars as a real issue though. Ok you could do two sprint races, but this way they could hammer the first car, meaning swapping into the other and having to stretch the battery life and go slower. Could bring in some new tactics?

I like the idea of wireless charging. If they could work that out it would add another element to the race. It all sounds a bit like RC cars or some sort of futuristic racing game but at least give them this season to tweak the formula and next year they get to play with the cars.

How many will moan if it fails that theres not enough racing on tv these days?

IainT

10,040 posts

237 months

Monday 15th September 2014
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PW said:
How can an enthusiast of racing seriously complain about seeing a grid of talented drivers racing each other in a straight fight with equal machinery?

As they're only racing each other, not cars from other categories, why is the lap time the arbiter of whether it is enjoyable to watch or not, rather than what actually happened in the race?

I thought it looked like any other mid-level open-wheel formula street race, which is quite an impressive achievement for a brand new series with brand new technology on a brand new track.
Good points. However the cars look to me to have the same fundamental issue the current GP3 car has regarding overtaking which is compounded by the nature of street circuits. The battery constraints look like they could add an interesting strategic element and a driver who manages to carry corner speed and not use as much grunt to get back up to speed would be rewarded if the races ran enough laps...

The whole 'car change' bit is fundamentally flawed though really breaks the continuity but some of that could just have been the disjointed TV coverage. Maybe a screen-in-screen would have made more sense to see the frantic action while keeping up with on-circuit action.

anonymous-user

53 months

Monday 15th September 2014
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BritishRacinGrin said:
Amen, PW.

REALIST123 said:
Do you really need 'serious talent' in a low grip, underpowered car? I think the reason it looked so 'competitive' is because they are all able to run on the limit quite easily, taking care of the batteries being the main challenge.
What an ignorant comment. Of course you need 'seriously talented' drivers, you need to be 'seriously talented' to beat the merely 'very talented' drivers. It's a race, that's the idea. The skill required to drive a seriously fast lap is not diminished when the available power is low because in this case the available grip is also low.

The main problem I see so far is with the circuit.
OK, I bow to what you think is your greater knowledge.

However, I think it will be an awful long time before we see a FE car doing a 'seriously fast' lap anywhere. Whoever is driving it.

I'm with button on this one-

"Changing a car halfway through a race is quite strange. But it might work. It's all in city centres and it might attract people to the sport that aren't interested in motor sport normally. If they aren't true racing fans, it's quite fun to watch some cars go around that are electric."

woof

8,456 posts

276 months

Monday 15th September 2014
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Kind of off topic but this is an interesting insight.

There's something quite primeval and inbuilt in us that reacts to a noisy engine reving.
I picked my g/f's son up the other day in my Corvette. He's 4 years old. The lad couldn't stop smiling. He loved that engine sound. And I see it all the time when driving the car. Kids (and for that matter adults) love that V8 sound.

Part of the problem with the 2014 F1 regs is that the cars are so much quieter (they sound pretty crap in real life. On TV they've boosted the volume and dynamics up so it sounds OK on TV)

As a spectacle Formula E hasn't got it - It's slow and poorly conceived and there's no noise apart from the whining that sounds like a dentist drill to me (definitely not a plus)

Formula E isn't anything but the FIA marketing dept trying to pretend it's green and jumping on that band wagon. Electric cars might be part of a bigger solution involving regenerated systems, Hydrogen powered and fossil fuel vehicles but it ain't going to save the world.

However, I'd would love to see that SC BMW i8 race - what a cracking car that is. 24 race prepared i8's on the grid - now we're talking.


garycat

4,382 posts

209 months

Monday 15th September 2014
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woof said:
However, I'd would love to see that SC BMW i8 race - what a cracking car that is. 24 race prepared i8's on the grid - now we're talking.

The i8 is designed as a road car with typical road usage, so it would be out of battery in 3 laps and then you have a 1.5 litre 3 cylinder car carrying a load of extra weight around.

Rude-boy

22,227 posts

232 months

Monday 15th September 2014
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Honestly Formula E is hitting new ground that has not been covered before.

It is a Spec. formula this year and next the teams will be allowed to develop their own cars. Competition will improve the breed.

As for those saying it is a bandwagon jumping exercise and doomed to failure I really do think that they need to have a better look at things.

One little hint as to not only the potential but the intent here is to read the names of the teams and to do a little research into who the teams REALLY are.

Right now if I was CVC I would not be running for the hills but I would be starting to feel uneasy about anything beyond 2020.


woof

8,456 posts

276 months

Monday 15th September 2014
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garycat said:
woof said:
However, I'd would love to see that SC BMW i8 race - what a cracking car that is. 24 race prepared i8's on the grid - now we're talking.

The i8 is designed as a road car with typical road usage, so it would be out of battery in 3 laps and then you have a 1.5 litre 3 cylinder car carrying a load of extra weight around.
Really - well that sounds crap. Great marketing by BMW to make it out to be something it isn't



Carmo99

1,308 posts

185 months

Monday 15th September 2014
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Sslightly off current topic, but I was surprised by the different pace of the drivers. The top 6 or 7 seemed v close and limited by the power saving / boost (remember how quick NH caught prost in 3 corners.
The other 15 or so drivers were much slower, Legge, Chanduck, no name 1, no name 2 etc.
Are the cars identical, subject only to suspension tuning? If so it appears skill /talent makes a huge difference.

kiseca

9,339 posts

218 months

Monday 15th September 2014
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IainT said:
I don't think it was malicious but the junk to the left was.....
.... the remains of Heidfeld's car hehe

IainT

10,040 posts

237 months

Monday 15th September 2014
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kiseca said:
IainT said:
I don't think it was malicious but the junk to the left was.....
.... the remains of Heidfeld's car hehe
Genius!

cidered77

1,614 posts

196 months

Tuesday 16th September 2014
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Gaz. said:
spats said:
I missed the race, hopefully its on their itv player to rewatch?
Highlights are on ITV player.

Hate the sound, hated the track. But on the up side things can only improve. As for CVC looking over their shoulder by 2020- that isn't that far away and currently Formula 4 knocks Formula-E into a cocked hat. Someone asked for a comparison for other cars- in Monaco on the 9th May 2015 we'll see how far off the are from GP3 & Porsche Supercup
you can watch the whole race on youtube - a very impressive 212,000 views so far (TUSC and WEC seem to be less than 10k!)

Roo

11,503 posts

206 months

Tuesday 16th September 2014
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Gaz. said:
Someone asked for a comparison for other cars- in Monaco on the 9th May 2015 we'll see how far off the are from GP3 & Porsche Supercup
Thought I'd read somewhere that they will be using a different circuit layout.

cidered77

1,614 posts

196 months

Tuesday 16th September 2014
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Roo said:
Gaz. said:
Someone asked for a comparison for other cars- in Monaco on the 9th May 2015 we'll see how far off the are from GP3 & Porsche Supercup
Thought I'd read somewhere that they will be using a different circuit layout.
Hi - I posted this on the other thread, but the pre-season testing at Donnington GP allows very specific comparisons:

"Quick research shows that a lap time around Donnington (circuit not suited to it as only a couple of heavy regenerative braking points, also pre-season testing before development and setup completed) was a 1:35.4. That actually is comparable with lower forumla ford classes, but to put into perspective is the same as a 458 Challenge car, and 2 seconds quicker than a WTCC car! Alternative perspective - 25 seconds off Prost's laprecord, but 20 seconds faster than a Caterham Academy!

This is not fast for a single seat race car - but it's still fast, and quicker than most road cars short of a very very well sorted 991/997 GT3 or hypercar. There is not a single E-only device on the planet that could have covered that distance more quickly. It's still an incredibly expensive sub 900kg open wheeled bewinged racecar for gawd's sake!"


cidered77

1,614 posts

196 months

Tuesday 16th September 2014
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Carmo99 said:
Sslightly off current topic, but I was surprised by the different pace of the drivers. The top 6 or 7 seemed v close and limited by the power saving / boost (remember how quick NH caught prost in 3 corners.
The other 15 or so drivers were much slower, Legge, Chanduck, no name 1, no name 2 etc.
Are the cars identical, subject only to suspension tuning? If so it appears skill /talent makes a huge difference.
there are some *proper* teams running these things though, with some of the best single seat engineers in the world. GP2 is won by the same teams consistently - you could make the same argument there. Best teams have the best engineers and the best setup and simulation work.

toerag

748 posts

131 months

Tuesday 16th September 2014
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redface


H18 ENF

698 posts

168 months

Tuesday 16th September 2014
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The opening few laps had me quite disappointed.

The bloody awful music on the parade lap, then when they did get going they seemed very slow and not much happening.

However, as it went on and you begin to see the strategies in place and the amount of overtaking that took place I was gripped. The build up to the last corner was incredible and I think that even if the crash hadn't happened I think I'd have been talking about the last lap anyway.

Having said that the TV commentary felt laboured and poor Jennie Gow in the studio, not even on site, just felt completely disconnected. The on screen graphics were poor, all the text was too small to read and to make it worse it was mainly 'glowing' white on an 'electric' blue background. As I tweeted at the time (@benjamin_field) Formula E may be new but broadcasting isn't, so I don't understand why there were so many fundamental errors.

In terms of racing I think the rest of the season will be good. The tracks won't all be based on a grid system (from what I can tell), drivers will get used to what they can get out of the cars and Prost (probably) won't try and kill anyone again.

I really did think that Heidfield would be dead after that, the angle just looked all wrong!

Moving past this season, that is when it will get really interesting as each team will be developing their own units and not just relying on what is supplied to them.

Shame the next race is in November but I will definitely be tuned in!

TheArchitect

1,238 posts

178 months

Wednesday 17th September 2014
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Carmo99 said:
Sslightly off current topic, but I was surprised by the different pace of the drivers. The top 6 or 7 seemed v close and limited by the power saving / boost (remember how quick NH caught prost in 3 corners.
The other 15 or so drivers were much slower, Legge, Chanduck, no name 1, no name 2 etc.
Are the cars identical, subject only to suspension tuning? If so it appears skill /talent makes a huge difference.
I don't have the rules but I understand all components are pretty much the same bar the usual suspension adjustments. However each car will always be different depending on how its built as some teams will build the car better than others.

Mr Whippy

28,944 posts

240 months

Wednesday 17th September 2014
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Also aero might cost quite a bit here.

Looking at some cars they ran a lot less rear wing vs others, so at the higher speeds with such low power outputs it'll make a huge difference... say the 80-100mph acceleration will be light-years apart... so getting the aero just right is probably really important too!

Dave