VLN crash at Nurburgring, at least one spectator killed :(
Discussion
cptsideways said:
horst 2b said:
SpeedMattersNot said:
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Just because other parents have enough money to take their kids racing, doesn't mean that alternative routes into motorsport should be dismissed.
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Just for the record, playing car racing games is obviously not one of those 'alternative routes into motorsport', I assume we all agree on that ?Just because other parents have enough money to take their kids racing, doesn't mean that alternative routes into motorsport should be dismissed.
...
Name me one genuinely talented modern day driver who's got there without massive financial backing?
It was a rich man's game only before sponsorship and training programs, but those days are long gone .
To my knowledge, Lewis Hamilton and Schumacher were not born with a silver spoon in their mouth, same with many other well known drivers .
They got sponsored eventually, just not by Sony .
And virtually all successful racing drivers of the past few decades learned the ropes by competing in karting and lower series for many years .
Sims are of course a big part of top tier racing these days, but that's not the kind of racing simulation you can buy on Amazon, software or hardware .
As much as some keyboard warriors like to believe it, you can't learn how to drive on your computer ; professional drivers use professional simulators to improve exsisting skills and save some time learning new technologies or studying tracks .
I don't know what the outcome of the investigation will be, or if a mistake was made that could have been avoided if the driver had more than basic skills and a deeper knowledge of racing .
But I hope in the future pro GT3 won't let drivers participate who got a seat due to a media campaign - and the money that comes with it .
horst 2b said:
Well, racing costs money , it's a part of the game .
It was a rich man's game only before sponsorship and training programs, but those days are long gone .
To my knowledge, Lewis Hamilton and Schumacher were not born with a silver spoon in their mouth, same with many other well known drivers .
They got sponsored eventually, just not by Sony .
When you say eventually, you do realise Hamilton only did 2 years of karting before he got recognised with above average talent. I remember it well as my first ever kart race was in 60cc Cadet at Rye House and we were the same age and in the same class. It was a rich man's game only before sponsorship and training programs, but those days are long gone .
To my knowledge, Lewis Hamilton and Schumacher were not born with a silver spoon in their mouth, same with many other well known drivers .
They got sponsored eventually, just not by Sony .
horst 2b said:
And virtually all successful racing drivers of the past few decades learned the ropes by competing in karting and lower series for many years .
Indeed, this is true, but there is still some contention as to how long people should stay in lower formulas. There is no set 'path' that people should follow. horst 2b said:
Sims are of course a big part of top tier racing these days, but that's not the kind of racing simulation you can buy on Amazon, software or hardware .
Not entirely correct, unless you consider historic racing and other non-professional national championships 'top tier'. horst 2b said:
As much as some keyboard warriors like to believe it, you can't learn how to drive on your computer ; professional drivers use professional simulators to improve exsisting skills and save some time learning new technologies or studying tracks .
If you're referring to me as a 'keyboard warrior' I'd like to hear what exactly qualifies you to make such a statement? Regarding simulators, as I mentioned above a lot of their use is outside of the professional driving remit. A lot of the rich kids will be paying over £350,000 for a season in Formula 3 and that to me suggests they're far from being professional racing drivers. Yet they'll spend hours in a simulator focusing on a much larger range of skills required to be a racing driver than what you mention.
GT Academy works like this;
- Online time trial > down to 20 competitors.
- National finals on game > down to 10 competitors.
- Remaining finalists partake in 3 tests > Fitness, Media and actual driving.
- Top 3 nationals go to EU/World finals > Zero gaming content, all fitness, actual driving, including karting and 370z/GTR
- Wolrd finalists wittled down to just 1 winner.
By this point, that driver has already experienced driver coaching from a heap full of professional drivers. Skip forwards 4 years and they've experienced more in motorsport than most drivers can hope to experience in the first 10 years of their careers.
horst 2b said:
I don't know what the outcome of the investigation will be, or if a mistake was made that could have been avoided if the driver had more than basic skills and a deeper knowledge of racing .
But I hope in the future pro GT3 won't let drivers participate who got a seat due to a media campaign - and the money that comes with it .
Again, this is incredibly short sighted and very insensitive. As has been said multiple times, whilst Jann may have zero 'real skills' before this competition, that is NOT the case now. That is quite simply NOT up for debate. But I hope in the future pro GT3 won't let drivers participate who got a seat due to a media campaign - and the money that comes with it .
Edited by SpeedMattersNot on Tuesday 31st March 17:20
horst 2b said:
Well, racing costs money , it's a part of the game .
It was a rich man's game only before sponsorship and training programs, but those days are long gone .
To my knowledge, Lewis Hamilton and Schumacher were not born with a silver spoon in their mouth, same with many other well known drivers .
They got sponsored eventually, just not by Sony .
And virtually all successful racing drivers of the past few decades learned the ropes by competing in karting and lower series for many years .
Sims are of course a big part of top tier racing these days, but that's not the kind of racing simulation you can buy on Amazon, software or hardware .
As much as some keyboard warriors like to believe it, you can't learn how to drive on your computer ; professional drivers use professional simulators to improve exsisting skills and save some time learning new technologies or studying tracks .
I don't know what the outcome of the investigation will be, or if a mistake was made that could have been avoided if the driver had more than basic skills and a deeper knowledge of racing .
But I hope in the future pro GT3 won't let drivers participate who got a seat due to a media campaign - and the money that comes with it .
Sorry that's just bIt was a rich man's game only before sponsorship and training programs, but those days are long gone .
To my knowledge, Lewis Hamilton and Schumacher were not born with a silver spoon in their mouth, same with many other well known drivers .
They got sponsored eventually, just not by Sony .
And virtually all successful racing drivers of the past few decades learned the ropes by competing in karting and lower series for many years .
Sims are of course a big part of top tier racing these days, but that's not the kind of racing simulation you can buy on Amazon, software or hardware .
As much as some keyboard warriors like to believe it, you can't learn how to drive on your computer ; professional drivers use professional simulators to improve exsisting skills and save some time learning new technologies or studying tracks .
I don't know what the outcome of the investigation will be, or if a mistake was made that could have been avoided if the driver had more than basic skills and a deeper knowledge of racing .
But I hope in the future pro GT3 won't let drivers participate who got a seat due to a media campaign - and the money that comes with it .
ks. Jann hasn't just been plonked into a GT3 car from his sofa, he has built up quite a range of experience in many different types of cars. Yes Sony and Nissan have enabled that to happen but do you really think that Nissan would jeopardise its aspirations of winning Le Mans by putting someone in the car that they didn't genuinely believe was the real deal?
As for the circumstances of the accident, the same thing happened to Mark Webber and Peter Dumbreck at Le Mans, its also happened to Yannick Dalmas and Bill Auberlen at the Petit Le Mans. If you want to question those driver's pedigree be my guest.
The notion that a crash caused by getting airborne in a straight line can be attributed to the driver in any way is absurd and shows people who argue it up as the worst kind of ignorant Daily Mail headline believing cretins they really are.
If it were me, I'd be looking at the design characteristics of the car in question and what can be learned about preventing IG from happening again, just as happened with the LMP cars. I will also be cheering Jann on from the sidelines at Le Mans this June.
24lemons said:
horst 2b said:
Well, racing costs money , it's a part of the game .
It was a rich man's game only before sponsorship and training programs, but those days are long gone .
To my knowledge, Lewis Hamilton and Schumacher were not born with a silver spoon in their mouth, same with many other well known drivers .
They got sponsored eventually, just not by Sony .
And virtually all successful racing drivers of the past few decades learned the ropes by competing in karting and lower series for many years .
Sims are of course a big part of top tier racing these days, but that's not the kind of racing simulation you can buy on Amazon, software or hardware .
As much as some keyboard warriors like to believe it, you can't learn how to drive on your computer ; professional drivers use professional simulators to improve exsisting skills and save some time learning new technologies or studying tracks .
I don't know what the outcome of the investigation will be, or if a mistake was made that could have been avoided if the driver had more than basic skills and a deeper knowledge of racing .
But I hope in the future pro GT3 won't let drivers participate who got a seat due to a media campaign - and the money that comes with it .
Sorry that's just bIt was a rich man's game only before sponsorship and training programs, but those days are long gone .
To my knowledge, Lewis Hamilton and Schumacher were not born with a silver spoon in their mouth, same with many other well known drivers .
They got sponsored eventually, just not by Sony .
And virtually all successful racing drivers of the past few decades learned the ropes by competing in karting and lower series for many years .
Sims are of course a big part of top tier racing these days, but that's not the kind of racing simulation you can buy on Amazon, software or hardware .
As much as some keyboard warriors like to believe it, you can't learn how to drive on your computer ; professional drivers use professional simulators to improve exsisting skills and save some time learning new technologies or studying tracks .
I don't know what the outcome of the investigation will be, or if a mistake was made that could have been avoided if the driver had more than basic skills and a deeper knowledge of racing .
But I hope in the future pro GT3 won't let drivers participate who got a seat due to a media campaign - and the money that comes with it .
ks. Jann hasn't just been plonked into a GT3 car from his sofa, he has built up quite a range of experience in many different types of cars. Yes Sony and Nissan have enabled that to happen but do you really think that Nissan would jeopardise its aspirations of winning Le Mans by putting someone in the car that they didn't genuinely believe was the real deal?
As for the circumstances of the accident, the same thing happened to Mark Webber and Peter Dumbreck at Le Mans, its also happened to Yannick Dalmas and Bill Auberlen at the Petit Le Mans. If you want to question those driver's pedigree be my guest.
The notion that a crash caused by getting airborne in a straight line can be attributed to the driver in any way is absurd and shows people who argue it up as the worst kind of ignorant Daily Mail headline believing cretins they really are.
If it were me, I'd be looking at the design characteristics of the car in question and what can be learned about preventing IG from happening again, just as happened with the LMP cars. I will also be cheering Jann on from the sidelines at Le Mans this June.
horst 2b said:
cptsideways said:
horst 2b said:
SpeedMattersNot said:
...
Just because other parents have enough money to take their kids racing, doesn't mean that alternative routes into motorsport should be dismissed.
...
Just for the record, playing car racing games is obviously not one of those 'alternative routes into motorsport', I assume we all agree on that ?Just because other parents have enough money to take their kids racing, doesn't mean that alternative routes into motorsport should be dismissed.
...
Name me one genuinely talented modern day driver who's got there without massive financial backing?
It was a rich man's game only before sponsorship and training programs, but those days are long gone .
To my knowledge, Lewis Hamilton and Schumacher were not born with a silver spoon in their mouth, same with many other well known drivers .
They got sponsored eventually, just not by Sony .
And virtually all successful racing drivers of the past few decades learned the ropes by competing in karting and lower series for many years .
Sims are of course a big part of top tier racing these days, but that's not the kind of racing simulation you can buy on Amazon, software or hardware .
As much as some keyboard warriors like to believe it, you can't learn how to drive on your computer ; professional drivers use professional simulators to improve exsisting skills and save some time learning new technologies or studying tracks .
I don't know what the outcome of the investigation will be, or if a mistake was made that could have been avoided if the driver had more than basic skills and a deeper knowledge of racing .
But I hope in the future pro GT3 won't let drivers participate who got a seat due to a media campaign - and the money that comes with it .
You know there is people in seats simply because of money don't you? Rich Russian businessmen without any skill what so ever?
Your post is absolutely ridiculous. It's not often I get wound up by a forum, but you've managed to do it.
horst 2b said:
Well, racing costs money , it's a part of the game .
It was a rich man's game only before sponsorship and training programs, but those days are long gone .
To my knowledge, Lewis Hamilton and Schumacher were not born with a silver spoon in their mouth, same with many other well known drivers .
They got sponsored eventually, just not by Sony .
And virtually all successful racing drivers of the past few decades learned the ropes by competing in karting and lower series for many years .
Sims are of course a big part of top tier racing these days, but that's not the kind of racing simulation you can buy on Amazon, software or hardware .
As much as some keyboard warriors like to believe it, you can't learn how to drive on your computer ; professional drivers use professional simulators to improve exsisting skills and save some time learning new technologies or studying tracks .
I don't know what the outcome of the investigation will be, or if a mistake was made that could have been avoided if the driver had more than basic skills and a deeper knowledge of racing .
But I hope in the future pro GT3 won't let drivers participate who got a seat due to a media campaign - and the money that comes with it .
Allow me to shorten down soke of the previous posts You come across as, and seem to be, an insensitive, clueless and arrogant fIt was a rich man's game only before sponsorship and training programs, but those days are long gone .
To my knowledge, Lewis Hamilton and Schumacher were not born with a silver spoon in their mouth, same with many other well known drivers .
They got sponsored eventually, just not by Sony .
And virtually all successful racing drivers of the past few decades learned the ropes by competing in karting and lower series for many years .
Sims are of course a big part of top tier racing these days, but that's not the kind of racing simulation you can buy on Amazon, software or hardware .
As much as some keyboard warriors like to believe it, you can't learn how to drive on your computer ; professional drivers use professional simulators to improve exsisting skills and save some time learning new technologies or studying tracks .
I don't know what the outcome of the investigation will be, or if a mistake was made that could have been avoided if the driver had more than basic skills and a deeper knowledge of racing .
But I hope in the future pro GT3 won't let drivers participate who got a seat due to a media campaign - and the money that comes with it .
ktard.horst 2b said:
But I hope in the future pro GT3 won't let drivers participate who got a seat due to a media campaign - and the money that comes with it.
It appears you might need a little education. Let me help, firstly by pointing you to his career summary on Wikipedia. He won GT Academy in 2011, which got him into a real car, where he proved he had talent. Over the following few years, he's scored seats in European F3, GP3 and at Le Mans. He is now a factory LMP1 driver, has scored himself a Red Bull Junior position and is also a current GP3 driver. You do not get a factory LMP1 drive (or any of the rest of it) off the back of winning a competition 4 years ago. Scroll down his Wikipedia page to the list of GT Academy graduates. Most have been so unsuccessful that they do not even have a Wikipedia entry. The man has talent.andylaurence said:
horst 2b said:
But I hope in the future pro GT3 won't let drivers participate who got a seat due to a media campaign - and the money that comes with it.
It appears you might need a little education. Let me help, firstly by pointing you to his career summary on Wikipedia. He won GT Academy in 2011, which got him into a real car, where he proved he had talent. Over the following few years, he's scored seats in European F3, GP3 and at Le Mans. He is now a factory LMP1 driver, has scored himself a Red Bull Junior position and is also a current GP3 driver. You do not get a factory LMP1 drive (or any of the rest of it) off the back of winning a competition 4 years ago. Scroll down his Wikipedia page to the list of GT Academy graduates. Most have been so unsuccessful that they do not even have a Wikipedia entry. The man has talent.What I say is no simulator can teach you how to drive, it only does what I mentioned above .
A computer game can teach you virtually nothing about driving , even if it is considered sophisticated and you buy those fancy controlers .
Playstations of course don't count at all . Neither does talent, as such a thing doesn't exist for rookies .
I checked the Wiki of the guy, and more sources - he has very little experience, and was by no means successful in any challenging role , just a few orchestrated successes.
He got shoe horned into the Sony/Nissan marketing gig 4 years ago, without any notable former racing experience .
I understand he comes from money .
Next thing you know, that kid is racing a GT3 car on the Nordschleife, which is a bit more demanding than his earlier races - and launches his car into the air in a place where such a thing is known to happen by professional drivers .
But again, I don't know the result of the investigation will be; if there has been a lack of driver competence, I trust driver, team and responsible GT academy personell will be charged , fined, have licences revoked and serve time .
horst 2b said:
People, you don't listen .
What I say is no simulator can teach you how to drive, it only does what I mentioned above .
A computer game can teach you virtually nothing about driving , even if it is considered sophisticated and you buy those fancy controlers .
Playstations of course don't count at all . Neither does talent, as such a thing doesn't exist for rookies .
I checked the Wiki of the guy, and more sources - he has very little experience, and was by no means successful in any challenging role , just a few orchestrated successes.
He got shoe horned into the Sony/Nissan marketing gig 4 years ago, without any notable former racing experience .
I understand he comes from money .
Next thing you know, that kid is racing a GT3 car on the Nordschleife, which is a bit more demanding than his earlier races - and launches his car into the air in a place where such a thing is known to happen by professional drivers .
But again, I don't know the result of the investigation will be; if there has been a lack of driver competence, I trust driver, team and responsible GT academy personell will be charged , fined, have licences revoked and serve time .
Max Verstappen is 17, should we revoke his licence too?What I say is no simulator can teach you how to drive, it only does what I mentioned above .
A computer game can teach you virtually nothing about driving , even if it is considered sophisticated and you buy those fancy controlers .
Playstations of course don't count at all . Neither does talent, as such a thing doesn't exist for rookies .
I checked the Wiki of the guy, and more sources - he has very little experience, and was by no means successful in any challenging role , just a few orchestrated successes.
He got shoe horned into the Sony/Nissan marketing gig 4 years ago, without any notable former racing experience .
I understand he comes from money .
Next thing you know, that kid is racing a GT3 car on the Nordschleife, which is a bit more demanding than his earlier races - and launches his car into the air in a place where such a thing is known to happen by professional drivers .
But again, I don't know the result of the investigation will be; if there has been a lack of driver competence, I trust driver, team and responsible GT academy personell will be charged , fined, have licences revoked and serve time .
Judging someone just because they won a competition based off a driving game without opening your eyes and seeing the evidence that he clearly has a lot of talent is a bit rich.
horst 2b said:
People, you don't listen .
What I say is no simulator can teach you how to drive, it only does what I mentioned above .
A computer game can teach you virtually nothing about driving , even if it is considered sophisticated and you buy those fancy controlers .
Playstations of course don't count at all . Neither does talent, as such a thing doesn't exist for rookies .
I checked the Wiki of the guy, and more sources - he has very little experience, and was by no means successful in any challenging role , just a few orchestrated successes.
He got shoe horned into the Sony/Nissan marketing gig 4 years ago, without any notable former racing experience .
I understand he comes from money .
Next thing you know, that kid is racing a GT3 car on the Nordschleife, which is a bit more demanding than his earlier races - and launches his car into the air in a place where such a thing is known to happen by professional drivers .
But again, I don't know the result of the investigation will be; if there has been a lack of driver competence, I trust driver, team and responsible GT academy personell will be charged , fined, have licences revoked and serve time .
I'm afraid it is the majority in this topic (and forum) who are fully aware of the situation. It appears however, that you are the one who isn't listening. What I say is no simulator can teach you how to drive, it only does what I mentioned above .
A computer game can teach you virtually nothing about driving , even if it is considered sophisticated and you buy those fancy controlers .
Playstations of course don't count at all . Neither does talent, as such a thing doesn't exist for rookies .
I checked the Wiki of the guy, and more sources - he has very little experience, and was by no means successful in any challenging role , just a few orchestrated successes.
He got shoe horned into the Sony/Nissan marketing gig 4 years ago, without any notable former racing experience .
I understand he comes from money .
Next thing you know, that kid is racing a GT3 car on the Nordschleife, which is a bit more demanding than his earlier races - and launches his car into the air in a place where such a thing is known to happen by professional drivers .
But again, I don't know the result of the investigation will be; if there has been a lack of driver competence, I trust driver, team and responsible GT academy personell will be charged , fined, have licences revoked and serve time .
I have real life racing experience and simulator racing experience, from gran turismo to the 2010 Mercedes F1 simulator. If you think that there are no transferable skills between Gran Turismo and the real world, you are categorically incorrect. It doesn't teach you a lot, but it definitely teaches you the basics for such things as racing lines, concentration and simple steering corrections.
I asked you what qualifies you to make such statements. What is your experience? What makes you think it is you who is right, against the majority of people on here?
The WHOLE POINT of the Nissan GT Academy, is to take drivers with limited real life experience and set various challenges before deciding the best candidate (chosen by current and ex-professional racing drivers may I add!). From there they are given progressively harder racing tasks and based on how good they are, the faster and further their careers progress.
To suggest that by winning a GP3 race and finishing 3rd in LMP2 is 'not significant in a challenging role' then you know absolutely nothing about motorsport.
You're clearly either severely below average IQ, or a massive troll.
Skylinecrazy said:
Have you seen Jann drive? Believe me, he's got a lot more talent than a lot of 'pro' drivers out there. This is someone that's competed at Le mans etc.
You know there is people in seats simply because of money don't you? Rich Russian businessmen without any skill what so ever?
Your post is absolutely ridiculous. It's not often I get wound up by a forum, but you've managed to do it.
Well said, I'm delighted to see just how many people on this forum have backed Jann on this. A top driver. It is also worrying to see just how many arm chair experts are criticising Nissan and Sony(?) for putting money into the sport by backing the GT academy. We should be trying to encourage companies to invest large sums into the industry for our entertainment.You know there is people in seats simply because of money don't you? Rich Russian businessmen without any skill what so ever?
Your post is absolutely ridiculous. It's not often I get wound up by a forum, but you've managed to do it.
Can I just also leave this link to the daily sportscar web site editorial which I think sums things up very well.
http://www.dailysportscar.com/2015/03/31/getting-r...
Just my 2p's worth.
What Horst appears to be saying (if not just trolling.) is that anyone who trains on simulators is not up to the task of bonfide worldvies who've learnt from hands on real life experience.
Let's hope he never has to get on a plane with pilots who've trained for hours on flight simulators to enable them to deal with aircraft situations, or that any wars break out that require his protection by fighter pilots, who train more on simulators than commercial pilots do. Or even be treated by doctors and nurses who learn on simulated patients. Fire fighters who fight simulated fires. Can you see how this is going??
Clearly anyone who has climbed through the ranks in their field by 'playing pretend on a simulator' is not adequate enough for him. all I can say is I hope you never find yourself in a situation that requires the assistance of anyone who uses simulated learning.
Without a doubt in my mind, had Jann not been involved in this tragic accident, because that's what it is, an accident, his driving credentials wouldn't be under scrutiny by these cretins. And had it been any other driver on that grid, regardless of fame and ability, we'd not be having the "is he a real driver" argument. I doubt we'd even be having a discussion had it been a rich amateur driver involved.
How is Jann any worse a driver than this guy?! - http://youtu.be/O4HSpx3aBq8
Quite simply he isn't, rich guys playin at racing drivers are far more dangerous in my eyes than drivers like Jann who've had a good amount of training (be it virtual or actual track time) than the money racers.
just because you own it doesn't mean you can race it.
Let's hope he never has to get on a plane with pilots who've trained for hours on flight simulators to enable them to deal with aircraft situations, or that any wars break out that require his protection by fighter pilots, who train more on simulators than commercial pilots do. Or even be treated by doctors and nurses who learn on simulated patients. Fire fighters who fight simulated fires. Can you see how this is going??
Clearly anyone who has climbed through the ranks in their field by 'playing pretend on a simulator' is not adequate enough for him. all I can say is I hope you never find yourself in a situation that requires the assistance of anyone who uses simulated learning.
Without a doubt in my mind, had Jann not been involved in this tragic accident, because that's what it is, an accident, his driving credentials wouldn't be under scrutiny by these cretins. And had it been any other driver on that grid, regardless of fame and ability, we'd not be having the "is he a real driver" argument. I doubt we'd even be having a discussion had it been a rich amateur driver involved.
How is Jann any worse a driver than this guy?! - http://youtu.be/O4HSpx3aBq8
Quite simply he isn't, rich guys playin at racing drivers are far more dangerous in my eyes than drivers like Jann who've had a good amount of training (be it virtual or actual track time) than the money racers.
just because you own it doesn't mean you can race it.
Jann is a great driver, the GT Academy having been on both sides of it a few times is cracking and has turned out some real talent. Anyone else in that car would have done the same - from initial look it seems to have nothing to do with the driver at all and just a horrendous set of circumstances all coming together at one time... 
Over the years a number of cars have had the same thing happen when running completely flat under trays, I don't pretend to understand the physics/aerodynamics involved but I hope they can put a stop to it.
Over the years a number of cars have had the same thing happen when running completely flat under trays, I don't pretend to understand the physics/aerodynamics involved but I hope they can put a stop to it.
horst 2b said:
People, you don't listen
you really dont have a clue how motorsport works do you... Jan has plenty of experience and holds the relavent FIA licence to drive such a car at the ring. you dont get the licence by just rocking up, you need to complete a certain number of races at various levels to gain the right level of licence. As a winner of the Sony competition Jan will have had a huge amount of tuition and seat time, far more than many drivers, and by all intents and purposes is a pro driver..The FIA saw fit to give him the right licence, and the car is built to fia standards and specifications.. There is no issue with the actions of sony and nissan they take things very seriously and professionally, you dont work for nintendo do you lol.
you berate the route to motorsport of driving games, but thats just the route to get there, everyone starts somewhere, the game at least proves some aptitude and understanding of lines, so is a good start. but you learn from there the same as anyone who decides to have a go and starts racing..
There is obviously a specific issue with flat bottomed cars with that part of the circuit and the ride heights they have to run there... I suspect a regulation change on the cars will be the way forward.
cars have taken off before and i guess in certain combinations they will again, all you can do is make changes when you do find a cause, and try to protect spectators better where it might happen
horst 2b said:
andylaurence said:
horst 2b said:
But I hope in the future pro GT3 won't let drivers participate who got a seat due to a media campaign - and the money that comes with it.
It appears you might need a little education. Let me help, firstly by pointing you to his career summary on Wikipedia. He won GT Academy in 2011, which got him into a real car, where he proved he had talent. Over the following few years, he's scored seats in European F3, GP3 and at Le Mans. He is now a factory LMP1 driver, has scored himself a Red Bull Junior position and is also a current GP3 driver. You do not get a factory LMP1 drive (or any of the rest of it) off the back of winning a competition 4 years ago. Scroll down his Wikipedia page to the list of GT Academy graduates. Most have been so unsuccessful that they do not even have a Wikipedia entry. The man has talent.What I say is no simulator can teach you how to drive, it only does what I mentioned above .
A computer game can teach you virtually nothing about driving , even if it is considered sophisticated and you buy those fancy controlers .
Playstations of course don't count at all . Neither does talent, as such a thing doesn't exist for rookies .
I checked the Wiki of the guy, and more sources - he has very little experience, and was by no means successful in any challenging role , just a few orchestrated successes.
He got shoe horned into the Sony/Nissan marketing gig 4 years ago, without any notable former racing experience .
I understand he comes from money .
Next thing you know, that kid is racing a GT3 car on the Nordschleife, which is a bit more demanding than his earlier races - and launches his car into the air in a place where such a thing is known to happen by professional drivers .
But again, I don't know the result of the investigation will be; if there has been a lack of driver competence, I trust driver, team and responsible GT academy personell will be charged , fined, have licences revoked and serve time .
Why then will a driver do much better in a simulator than a non-driver?
One is not a substitute for the other, but I strongly disagree that you can learn nothing about driving from a simulator or game.
horst 2b said:
andylaurence said:
horst 2b said:
But I hope in the future pro GT3 won't let drivers participate who got a seat due to a media campaign - and the money that comes with it.
It appears you might need a little education. Let me help, firstly by pointing you to his career summary on Wikipedia. He won GT Academy in 2011, which got him into a real car, where he proved he had talent. Over the following few years, he's scored seats in European F3, GP3 and at Le Mans. He is now a factory LMP1 driver, has scored himself a Red Bull Junior position and is also a current GP3 driver. You do not get a factory LMP1 drive (or any of the rest of it) off the back of winning a competition 4 years ago. Scroll down his Wikipedia page to the list of GT Academy graduates. Most have been so unsuccessful that they do not even have a Wikipedia entry. The man has talent.What I say is no simulator can teach you how to drive, it only does what I mentioned above .
A computer game can teach you virtually nothing about driving , even if it is considered sophisticated and you buy those fancy controlers .
Playstations of course don't count at all . Neither does talent, as such a thing doesn't exist for rookies .
I checked the Wiki of the guy, and more sources - he has very little experience, and was by no means successful in any challenging role , just a few orchestrated successes.
He got shoe horned into the Sony/Nissan marketing gig 4 years ago, without any notable former racing experience .
I understand he comes from money .
Next thing you know, that kid is racing a GT3 car on the Nordschleife, which is a bit more demanding than his earlier races - and launches his car into the air in a place where such a thing is known to happen by professional drivers .
But again, I don't know the result of the investigation will be; if there has been a lack of driver competence, I trust driver, team and responsible GT academy personell will be charged , fined, have licences revoked and serve time .
Comments are typical of someone not close to the UK/European race scene, and having no knowledge of the people involved, or the skill & ability of JM (and others like him e.g.Luca Ordonez).
Your last comment is staggering, and shows inability to even stay up with the latest news from the circuit/VLN. I've passed your comments onto NISMO and hope now that they put you in your place.
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