The 2017 Rallying thread
Discussion
It's an interesting one. Not sure how long Ogier's contract was with VW ? They'll no doubt have had to pay him for the full term irrespective.
I'd have though Wilson put some money in and possibly asked Ford to equal it or pay the balance.
Ogier intimated that he wasn't being paid a lot for his one year contract, so maybe Wilson paid him what he could afford and cancelled his order for a new helicopter ...
I'd have though Wilson put some money in and possibly asked Ford to equal it or pay the balance.
Ogier intimated that he wasn't being paid a lot for his one year contract, so maybe Wilson paid him what he could afford and cancelled his order for a new helicopter ...
tux said:
Is Ogiers drive with Msport not being paid for by VW/Red Bull then? The guy on the TV commentary seemed convinced Malcolm Wilson is financing it himself?
VW will pay up what's left on his contract - plus his sponsorship from Red Bull. As M-Sport is essentially a 'Privateer' team and has no title sponsor, then its plausible that Malcolm is getting his wallet out. However, there was an interview on BT Sport with the Ford CEO about a possible full 'official' return - and I've read that a few of the Ford top brass were at M-Sport when Ogier signed. So, maybe there is something happening in regards to a Ford return.
Really enjoyed the coverage, via a mix of Red Bull tv and BT Sport.. Resisted a WRC+ pass, based on that I'll probably watch enough as it is. The WRC "live" website gave good updates throughout. Cars looked and sounded good, and clear that it's going to be pretty close over the whole season. Not long until Sweden.
Just a real shame about the tragedy on Thursday night, and thoughts to all involved.
Just a real shame about the tragedy on Thursday night, and thoughts to all involved.
Well it was a shame for us that stage 16 was cancelled. The marshalling was crazy with loads of whistling and no clear instructions, while a quick turn around between runs meant people changing position was always going to cause trouble. All the police seem to is stand around doing sweet FA or they go mental at people. Then some of the spectator points have been a joke, literally barely 6 feet wide. Rally Gbs pens are a luxury in comparison!!
Breen..
https://twitter.com/AlastairCummins/status/8231777...
And Evans on stage 14.
https://twitter.com/AlastairCummins/status/8231732...
Breen..
https://twitter.com/AlastairCummins/status/8231777...
And Evans on stage 14.
https://twitter.com/AlastairCummins/status/8231732...
ELUSIVEJIM said:
Over the Monte weekend the rival manufactures Ford, Citroen, Hyundai and Toyota decided to veto Volkswagen's plans to have the 2017 Polo WRC homologation approved.
It is not completely dead in the water but the likely hood is very slim now.
What are peoples thoughts on this matter?
Narrow mindedness on the part of them all springs to mind, Ford (Wilson) will be aware Ogier would probably head straight back to the VW in 2018 if the Polo was homologated, Citroen just want to win the championship again. Toyota want to win full stop, ditto Hyundai. What they're failing to appreciate is that the more manufacturers there are in the championship, the more high profile it'll become, and that in turn attracts more/bigger sponsors and more manufacturers too .....It is not completely dead in the water but the likely hood is very slim now.
What are peoples thoughts on this matter?
Slippydiff said:
ELUSIVEJIM said:
Over the Monte weekend the rival manufactures Ford, Citroen, Hyundai and Toyota decided to veto Volkswagen's plans to have the 2017 Polo WRC homologation approved.
It is not completely dead in the water but the likely hood is very slim now.
What are peoples thoughts on this matter?
Narrow mindedness on the part of them all springs to mind, Ford (Wilson) will be aware Ogier would probably head straight back to the VW in 2018 if the Polo was homologated, Citroen just want to win the championship again. Toyota want to win full stop, ditto Hyundai. What they're failing to appreciate is that the more manufacturers there are in the championship, the more high profile it'll become, and that in turn attracts more/bigger sponsors and more manufacturers too .....It is not completely dead in the water but the likely hood is very slim now.
What are peoples thoughts on this matter?
Really enjoyed the Monte (despite the shadow cast on Friday), all the cars look great and seem quite closely matched. I do like the Toyota and looking forward to seeing the new relaxed JML in action in Sweden.
The Fiestas look very good, and have a great team in Ogier, Tanak and Evans (on tyres with varying grip levels). The Hyundai in Neuville's hands does look awesome.
Hopefully Citroen will start to turn-up more from Sweden onwards.
Can't wait until February for Sweden
[quote=Slippydiff]
Narrow mindedness on the part of them all springs to mind, Ford (Wilson) will be aware Ogier would probably head straight back to the VW in 2018 if the Polo was homologated, Citroen just want to win the championship again. Toyota want to win full stop, ditto Hyundai. What they're failing to appreciate is that the more manufacturers there are in the championship, the more high profile it'll become, and that in turn attracts more/bigger sponsors and more manufacturers too .....
Could not agree more.
Obviously the VW would be a very fast addition to the WRC and this is the issue with the other teams. They know it will be straight on the pace even without the full VW backing.
Talk is that Mikkelson seems to be the name which would be planning to use the VW but I am sure both Ogier and Latvala would be pretty annoyed if the VW was given the go ahead.
To be fair this situation could and should have been dealt much better by Volkswagen.
I would imagine IF they do get the go ahead the teams would only agree to a very limited program for the Polo.
Narrow mindedness on the part of them all springs to mind, Ford (Wilson) will be aware Ogier would probably head straight back to the VW in 2018 if the Polo was homologated, Citroen just want to win the championship again. Toyota want to win full stop, ditto Hyundai. What they're failing to appreciate is that the more manufacturers there are in the championship, the more high profile it'll become, and that in turn attracts more/bigger sponsors and more manufacturers too .....
Could not agree more.
Obviously the VW would be a very fast addition to the WRC and this is the issue with the other teams. They know it will be straight on the pace even without the full VW backing.
Talk is that Mikkelson seems to be the name which would be planning to use the VW but I am sure both Ogier and Latvala would be pretty annoyed if the VW was given the go ahead.
To be fair this situation could and should have been dealt much better by Volkswagen.
I would imagine IF they do get the go ahead the teams would only agree to a very limited program for the Polo.
The BT coverage featured an interview at rally end with a Ford motorsport boss from the US who said they'd be working even closer with M-Sport in future. Looks like Malcolm's financial gamble on Ogier has paid off.
Must say the Frenchman has gone up in my estimation after this weekend. I know it's his home rally, but to win first time out in a non-works car is sheer class.
Must say the Frenchman has gone up in my estimation after this weekend. I know it's his home rally, but to win first time out in a non-works car is sheer class.
greeny12 said:
The BT coverage featured an interview at rally end with a Ford motorsport boss from the US who said they'd be working even closer with M-Sport in future. Looks like Malcolm's financial gamble on Ogier has paid off.
Must say the Frenchman has gone up in my estimation after this weekend. I know it's his home rally, but to win first time out in a non-works car is sheer class.
Others (including your good self) may disagree. but I don't think it's ever been in question that he's a class act, and some way above most of the other drivers in the WRC. Had he not been, JML and AM would've won far more events in the same car over the past 3-4 years, or indeed have taken WRC crowns.Must say the Frenchman has gone up in my estimation after this weekend. I know it's his home rally, but to win first time out in a non-works car is sheer class.
This season may/will proveto be the turning point in his dominance though. Neuville, Evans, Tanak (both the latter will no doubt benefit from Ogier driving/developing the Fiesta) and possibly Meeke look to have a serious chance of wins this year. That's without bringing Toyota into the equation, they may have flattered to deceive on the Monte (though I suspect not).
I can see some musical chairs at the end of 2017, much as I like Dani Sordo and think he's good/for the sport, I think it's time he moved on.
I've always had mixed feelings about Paddon, no doubt quick, but does he have the makings of champion ? I'm not convinced.
Meeke ? things need to change, and change fast. Sure the Monte is always a massive lottery, but there's just too many silly off's which cost him dearly. Again, there's no doubting his outright speed, but as Rob the Kube found out, speed without consistency doesn't get you podiums or win championships or indeed endear you to team bosses. What's more Breen's looking more consistent and comfortable in his role at Citroen than Meeke currently.
It'll be interesting to see if Ford do step up to the plate and finance Wilson/Ogier, if not I can see Ogier at Toyota (in place of Hanninen) or at Hyundai (in Sordo's place) next year, I suspect all bridges have been burnt between Ogier and Citroen if their unwillingness to let Ogier drive the '17 C3 late last year was anything to go by.
The meeting about Vw was only a short one, and I believe the only real issue was the lifting of parts, due to the missing Monte and maybe Sweden. It's a shame, but I can see both sides of the issue really.
Currently been sat in the plane at Nice airport for 2 hours with at least another 1 to go. As epic as Monte has been I just want to get home now!
Currently been sat in the plane at Nice airport for 2 hours with at least another 1 to go. As epic as Monte has been I just want to get home now!
Slippydiff said:
Others (including your good self) may disagree. but I don't think it's ever been in question that he's a class act, and some way above most of the other drivers in the WRC. Had he not been, JML and AM would've won far more events in the same car over the past 3-4 years, or indeed have taken WRC crowns.
No, I certainly don't disagree with that. I've always admired Ogier, who wouldn't given his palmares? However, there's no doubt that in recent years the VW has been very much the package to have so he's had a natural 'head start' if you like. Malcolm and team have clearly built a good car for the 2017 regs, but all things considered this to me is a hugely impressive feat by Ogier. Chapeau!
tyrrell said:
Agree Paddon looks a liability, Meek desperately needs to get his act together, Sordo needs to go as well.
Paddon is a liability because? Thursday's accident could happen to anyone on the Monte, even Ogier made a mistake on ice!Edited by tyrrell on Monday 23 January 14:42
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