Another Sad example of money not talent buying rides.....!
Discussion
http://www.crash.net/motorsport/champcar/news/1571...
Jesus - the junior Mansell's have done Sod all in the mnor categories.
He should get them out doing real jobs (if they had should skill and been regular top 3 racers, all well and good but far from it iN BMW and F3).
Laughable. But typical.
I rate Mansell but the shine wears thin when he pushes his no hope sons this far.
Jesus - the junior Mansell's have done Sod all in the mnor categories.
He should get them out doing real jobs (if they had should skill and been regular top 3 racers, all well and good but far from it iN BMW and F3).
Laughable. But typical.
I rate Mansell but the shine wears thin when he pushes his no hope sons this far.
Yes, totally agree - they haven't impressed at all. IIRC Greg is the marginally better of the pair. But look at the Scheckters; they were of differing abilities and one could argue that Thomas hasn't fulfilled his potential...and while we're about it, what about Matthias Lauda and Vanina Ickx...
We also have Jolyon Palmer, Max Chilton, Alex Brundle, Stefan Wilson all in the junior formulae and arugably all there on the the strength of the family name.
We also have Jolyon Palmer, Max Chilton, Alex Brundle, Stefan Wilson all in the junior formulae and arugably all there on the the strength of the family name.
Make me sick - you have to believe half of the people in professional Motorsport are only there due to daddies cash and that there alot more inherently faster people out there not getting the chances.
Obviously exception (ALOT) - but it would wind me up racing against them - well at least they'd be behind.
How do they have anyself respect.
Off to ask my father for a few 100 grand..................
Obviously exception (ALOT) - but it would wind me up racing against them - well at least they'd be behind.
How do they have anyself respect.
Off to ask my father for a few 100 grand..................
i think you are being both a bit hard on the mansells and a bit naive about motorsport and the world in general.
leo and greg had little or no racing experience before taking to cars, that puts you at a disadvantage to those who have done 10 years of karting, not withstanding who your dad is. equally when you look at something like fbmw you can see that the grid is full of kids with rich daddies, so i don't see that the mansells are in anyway different.
as for money taking a big decision in who drives where, this has always been the case and i am of the opinion that being a good(ace) driver does not mean you are more deserving of a drive than a plodder who's worked hard for his cash and bought the drive. think johnny herbert to damon hill.
motorsport reflects life quite well, anyone whose worked in a big business long enough to see personnel changes will be often left scratching their head as to how someone so incompetant can be promoted above them.... its mainly because they have other skills that are more or just as relevant as doing a good job -like an ability to build relationships with 'da management'
just my tuppence worth
leo and greg had little or no racing experience before taking to cars, that puts you at a disadvantage to those who have done 10 years of karting, not withstanding who your dad is. equally when you look at something like fbmw you can see that the grid is full of kids with rich daddies, so i don't see that the mansells are in anyway different.
as for money taking a big decision in who drives where, this has always been the case and i am of the opinion that being a good(ace) driver does not mean you are more deserving of a drive than a plodder who's worked hard for his cash and bought the drive. think johnny herbert to damon hill.
motorsport reflects life quite well, anyone whose worked in a big business long enough to see personnel changes will be often left scratching their head as to how someone so incompetant can be promoted above them.... its mainly because they have other skills that are more or just as relevant as doing a good job -like an ability to build relationships with 'da management'
just my tuppence worth
rubystone said:
We also have Jolyon Palmer, Max Chilton, Alex Brundle, Stefan Wilson all in the junior formulae and arugably all there on the the strength of the family name.
Not entirely fair. Max isn't setting the World alight but has potential
Alex is on a very steep learning curve and has improved (IIRC) massively over the year.
Jolyon is (was) actually really getting there and but for his horrific injuries from the quad accident which he is still recovering from would have been in the top 5 at worst in FPA this year IMO. Provided he is able to make a full recovery I expect to see him out again next season and at the front again.
Sefan raced karts until the end of last year when he did the FPA Autum Trophy where he was the top Rookie. This year he came second in the main Championship, has been selected for the Autosport Young Driver of the Year Award and has been given the status of BRDC Rising Star.
stockhatcher said:
i think you are being both a bit hard on the mansells and a bit naive about motorsport and the world in general.
leo and greg had little or no racing experience before taking to cars, that puts you at a disadvantage to those who have done 10 years of karting, not withstanding who your dad is. equally when you look at something like fbmw you can see that the grid is full of kids with rich daddies, so i don't see that the mansells are in anyway different.
as for money taking a big decision in who drives where, this has always been the case and i am of the opinion that being a good(ace) driver does not mean you are more deserving of a drive than a plodder who's worked hard for his cash and bought the drive. think johnny herbert to damon hill.
motorsport reflects life quite well, anyone whose worked in a big business long enough to see personnel changes will be often left scratching their head as to how someone so incompetant can be promoted above them.... its mainly because they have other skills that are more or just as relevant as doing a good job -like an ability to build relationships with 'da management'
just my tuppence worth
Cobblersleo and greg had little or no racing experience before taking to cars, that puts you at a disadvantage to those who have done 10 years of karting, not withstanding who your dad is. equally when you look at something like fbmw you can see that the grid is full of kids with rich daddies, so i don't see that the mansells are in anyway different.
as for money taking a big decision in who drives where, this has always been the case and i am of the opinion that being a good(ace) driver does not mean you are more deserving of a drive than a plodder who's worked hard for his cash and bought the drive. think johnny herbert to damon hill.
motorsport reflects life quite well, anyone whose worked in a big business long enough to see personnel changes will be often left scratching their head as to how someone so incompetant can be promoted above them.... its mainly because they have other skills that are more or just as relevant as doing a good job -like an ability to build relationships with 'da management'
just my tuppence worth
stockhatcher said:
i think you are being both a bit hard on the mansells and a bit naive about motorsport and the world in general.
leo and greg had little or no racing experience before taking to cars, that puts you at a disadvantage to those who have done 10 years of karting, not withstanding who your dad is. equally when you look at something like fbmw you can see that the grid is full of kids with rich daddies, so i don't see that the mansells are in anyway different.
as for money taking a big decision in who drives where, this has always been the case and i am of the opinion that being a good(ace) driver does not mean you are more deserving of a drive than a plodder who's worked hard for his cash and bought the drive. think johnny herbert to damon hill.
motorsport reflects life quite well, anyone whose worked in a big business long enough to see personnel changes will be often left scratching their head as to how someone so incompetant can be promoted above them.... its mainly because they have other skills that are more or just as relevant as doing a good job -like an ability to build relationships with 'da management'
just my tuppence worth
Have to agree with you. People only tend to get on in motorsport if they have a) money and b) contacts. Nigel Mansell has both so its no suprise his kids are moving up.leo and greg had little or no racing experience before taking to cars, that puts you at a disadvantage to those who have done 10 years of karting, not withstanding who your dad is. equally when you look at something like fbmw you can see that the grid is full of kids with rich daddies, so i don't see that the mansells are in anyway different.
as for money taking a big decision in who drives where, this has always been the case and i am of the opinion that being a good(ace) driver does not mean you are more deserving of a drive than a plodder who's worked hard for his cash and bought the drive. think johnny herbert to damon hill.
motorsport reflects life quite well, anyone whose worked in a big business long enough to see personnel changes will be often left scratching their head as to how someone so incompetant can be promoted above them.... its mainly because they have other skills that are more or just as relevant as doing a good job -like an ability to build relationships with 'da management'
just my tuppence worth
Its not the way it should be but its the way it has been for years and will continue to be.
NightDriver said:
stockhatcher said:
i think you are being both a bit hard on the mansells and a bit naive about motorsport and the world in general.
leo and greg had little or no racing experience before taking to cars, that puts you at a disadvantage to those who have done 10 years of karting, not withstanding who your dad is. equally when you look at something like fbmw you can see that the grid is full of kids with rich daddies, so i don't see that the mansells are in anyway different.
as for money taking a big decision in who drives where, this has always been the case and i am of the opinion that being a good(ace) driver does not mean you are more deserving of a drive than a plodder who's worked hard for his cash and bought the drive. think johnny herbert to damon hill.
motorsport reflects life quite well, anyone whose worked in a big business long enough to see personnel changes will be often left scratching their head as to how someone so incompetant can be promoted above them.... its mainly because they have other skills that are more or just as relevant as doing a good job -like an ability to build relationships with 'da management'
just my tuppence worth
Have to agree with you. People only tend to get on in motorsport if they have a) money and b) contacts. Nigel Mansell has both so its no suprise his kids are moving up.leo and greg had little or no racing experience before taking to cars, that puts you at a disadvantage to those who have done 10 years of karting, not withstanding who your dad is. equally when you look at something like fbmw you can see that the grid is full of kids with rich daddies, so i don't see that the mansells are in anyway different.
as for money taking a big decision in who drives where, this has always been the case and i am of the opinion that being a good(ace) driver does not mean you are more deserving of a drive than a plodder who's worked hard for his cash and bought the drive. think johnny herbert to damon hill.
motorsport reflects life quite well, anyone whose worked in a big business long enough to see personnel changes will be often left scratching their head as to how someone so incompetant can be promoted above them.... its mainly because they have other skills that are more or just as relevant as doing a good job -like an ability to build relationships with 'da management'
just my tuppence worth
Its not the way it should be but its the way it has been for years and will continue to be.
jellison said:
NightDriver said:
stockhatcher said:
i think you are being both a bit hard on the mansells and a bit naive about motorsport and the world in general.
leo and greg had little or no racing experience before taking to cars, that puts you at a disadvantage to those who have done 10 years of karting, not withstanding who your dad is. equally when you look at something like fbmw you can see that the grid is full of kids with rich daddies, so i don't see that the mansells are in anyway different.
as for money taking a big decision in who drives where, this has always been the case and i am of the opinion that being a good(ace) driver does not mean you are more deserving of a drive than a plodder who's worked hard for his cash and bought the drive. think johnny herbert to damon hill.
motorsport reflects life quite well, anyone whose worked in a big business long enough to see personnel changes will be often left scratching their head as to how someone so incompetant can be promoted above them.... its mainly because they have other skills that are more or just as relevant as doing a good job -like an ability to build relationships with 'da management'
just my tuppence worth
Have to agree with you. People only tend to get on in motorsport if they have a) money and b) contacts. Nigel Mansell has both so its no suprise his kids are moving up.leo and greg had little or no racing experience before taking to cars, that puts you at a disadvantage to those who have done 10 years of karting, not withstanding who your dad is. equally when you look at something like fbmw you can see that the grid is full of kids with rich daddies, so i don't see that the mansells are in anyway different.
as for money taking a big decision in who drives where, this has always been the case and i am of the opinion that being a good(ace) driver does not mean you are more deserving of a drive than a plodder who's worked hard for his cash and bought the drive. think johnny herbert to damon hill.
motorsport reflects life quite well, anyone whose worked in a big business long enough to see personnel changes will be often left scratching their head as to how someone so incompetant can be promoted above them.... its mainly because they have other skills that are more or just as relevant as doing a good job -like an ability to build relationships with 'da management'
just my tuppence worth
Its not the way it should be but its the way it has been for years and will continue to be.
As I said, this is not the way it should be and these two guys should realise there not cut out for it. But, if an opportunity like this is offered to them you cant blame them for taking it up.
NightDriver said:
jellison said:
NightDriver said:
stockhatcher said:
i think you are being both a bit hard on the mansells and a bit naive about motorsport and the world in general.
leo and greg had little or no racing experience before taking to cars, that puts you at a disadvantage to those who have done 10 years of karting, not withstanding who your dad is. equally when you look at something like fbmw you can see that the grid is full of kids with rich daddies, so i don't see that the mansells are in anyway different.
as for money taking a big decision in who drives where, this has always been the case and i am of the opinion that being a good(ace) driver does not mean you are more deserving of a drive than a plodder who's worked hard for his cash and bought the drive. think johnny herbert to damon hill.
motorsport reflects life quite well, anyone whose worked in a big business long enough to see personnel changes will be often left scratching their head as to how someone so incompetant can be promoted above them.... its mainly because they have other skills that are more or just as relevant as doing a good job -like an ability to build relationships with 'da management'
just my tuppence worth
Have to agree with you. People only tend to get on in motorsport if they have a) money and b) contacts. Nigel Mansell has both so its no suprise his kids are moving up.leo and greg had little or no racing experience before taking to cars, that puts you at a disadvantage to those who have done 10 years of karting, not withstanding who your dad is. equally when you look at something like fbmw you can see that the grid is full of kids with rich daddies, so i don't see that the mansells are in anyway different.
as for money taking a big decision in who drives where, this has always been the case and i am of the opinion that being a good(ace) driver does not mean you are more deserving of a drive than a plodder who's worked hard for his cash and bought the drive. think johnny herbert to damon hill.
motorsport reflects life quite well, anyone whose worked in a big business long enough to see personnel changes will be often left scratching their head as to how someone so incompetant can be promoted above them.... its mainly because they have other skills that are more or just as relevant as doing a good job -like an ability to build relationships with 'da management'
just my tuppence worth
Its not the way it should be but its the way it has been for years and will continue to be.
As I said, this is not the way it should be and these two guys should realise there not cut out for it. But, if an opportunity like this is offered to them you cant blame them for taking it up.
Ever thought of trying another brand of car?
stockhatcher said:
i think you are being both a bit hard on the mansells and a bit naive about motorsport and the world in general.
leo and greg had little or no racing experience before taking to cars, that puts you at a disadvantage to those who have done 10 years of karting, not withstanding who your dad is. equally when you look at something like fbmw you can see that the grid is full of kids with rich daddies, so i don't see that the mansells are in anyway different.
as for money taking a big decision in who drives where, this has always been the case and i am of the opinion that being a good(ace) driver does not mean you are more deserving of a drive than a plodder who's worked hard for his cash and bought the drive. think johnny herbert to damon hill.
motorsport reflects life quite well, anyone whose worked in a big business long enough to see personnel changes will be often left scratching their head as to how someone so incompetant can be promoted above them.... its mainly because they have other skills that are more or just as relevant as doing a good job -like an ability to build relationships with 'da management'
just my tuppence worth
I'm far from naive - I have a number of friends in the motorpsort industry. One in particular ran TCars for several years - a category that a number of the drivers I mentioned have come through. He rates Max Chilton as being a talented guy, but is less than complimentary about some of the others.leo and greg had little or no racing experience before taking to cars, that puts you at a disadvantage to those who have done 10 years of karting, not withstanding who your dad is. equally when you look at something like fbmw you can see that the grid is full of kids with rich daddies, so i don't see that the mansells are in anyway different.
as for money taking a big decision in who drives where, this has always been the case and i am of the opinion that being a good(ace) driver does not mean you are more deserving of a drive than a plodder who's worked hard for his cash and bought the drive. think johnny herbert to damon hill.
motorsport reflects life quite well, anyone whose worked in a big business long enough to see personnel changes will be often left scratching their head as to how someone so incompetant can be promoted above them.... its mainly because they have other skills that are more or just as relevant as doing a good job -like an ability to build relationships with 'da management'
just my tuppence worth
I recall watchig Damon Hill in the '80s in his Cellnet backed cars - he wasn't short of a budget then!
The Mansells just don't have what it takes to get to the top. That's the only point I was really making. I don't care whether they are bankrolled or not. Oh and just cos you don't have a full karting background doesn't mean that your natural talent can't shine through...didn't Bruno Senna have little or no karting experience when he started racing a couple of seasons ago?
Of course motorport is full of people with big money who spend to gain success. I know several people in that camp. One that I can talk about, since he's dead is Charles Golding. Used to turn up at WECC sprints with his big truck and Escort Cosworth and blow the amateurs into the weeds - but didn't make him a popularman. Mind you, he did build me an ace engine for my Midget, so not all bad then
One final point - there are some very good drivers in FBMW, not all of whom have big budgets. The problem with that category now is that in order to succeed in the combined world fornext year you do need a big budget, always assuming you were forunate enough to gain an entry in the first place.
jellison said:
Make me sick - you have to believe half of the people in professional Motorsport are only there due to daddies cash and that there alot more inherently faster people out there not getting the chances.
Half? 
I'd say it was nearer 95%, the other 5% representing the scholarship crowd etc. In the championships and clubs that I've raced in I've seen occasional people rise up to BTCC and GT racing, and it's never the people at the front of the field, it's the people with money and sponsorship. This has always been the way in motor racing as far as I know.rude-boy said:
rubystone said:
We also have Jolyon Palmer, Max Chilton, Alex Brundle, Stefan Wilson all in the junior formulae and arugably all there on the the strength of the family name.
Not entirely fair. Max isn't setting the World alight but has potential
Alex is on a very steep learning curve and has improved (IIRC) massively over the year.
Jolyon is (was) actually really getting there and but for his horrific injuries from the quad accident which he is still recovering from would have been in the top 5 at worst in FPA this year IMO. Provided he is able to make a full recovery I expect to see him out again next season and at the front again.
Sefan raced karts until the end of last year when he did the FPA Autum Trophy where he was the top Rookie. This year he came second in the main Championship, has been selected for the Autosport Young Driver of the Year Award and has been given the status of BRDC Rising Star.
Hang on a minute.
These lads obviously want to race cars and are fortunate to have the family money to enable them to do it at their chosen level.
Who are we to dictate whether or not they are deserving of a place on any grid ?
They might not be front runners but they're doing something that they want to do.
It's an expensive sport and always will be. I'd love to be able to do it at that level (although my talent is probably far from near) but don't have the funds. It's a tough world but just because I can't do it, doesn't mean that I begrudge others who are more fortunate.
What do you suggest, that Mansell funds somebody elses kids just because they might have more talent ?
These lads obviously want to race cars and are fortunate to have the family money to enable them to do it at their chosen level.
Who are we to dictate whether or not they are deserving of a place on any grid ?
They might not be front runners but they're doing something that they want to do.
It's an expensive sport and always will be. I'd love to be able to do it at that level (although my talent is probably far from near) but don't have the funds. It's a tough world but just because I can't do it, doesn't mean that I begrudge others who are more fortunate.
What do you suggest, that Mansell funds somebody elses kids just because they might have more talent ?
Edited by lazyitus on Wednesday 14th November 14:01
Agree that the junior Mansells haven't really shone at all. It's this off their name [that I guess attracts sponsors]. Is that off their name primarily or money secondarily?!
Anyway, I think Nige got it wrong. He should've bought Leo a Kart as soon as he turned 5yo (a bit like our Nige himself), rather than denying them the chance to get into motorspot because he figured it was too dangerous.
What you are is a result of what you have learned. Genetics has a much smaller part to play than is generally accepted...
Anyway, I think Nige got it wrong. He should've bought Leo a Kart as soon as he turned 5yo (a bit like our Nige himself), rather than denying them the chance to get into motorspot because he figured it was too dangerous.
What you are is a result of what you have learned. Genetics has a much smaller part to play than is generally accepted...
lazyitus said:
Hang on a minute.
These lads obviously want to race cars and are fortunate to have the family money to enable them to do it at their chosen level.
Who are we to dictate whether or not they are deserving of a place on any grid ?
They might not be front runners but they're doing something that they want to do.
It's an expensive sport and always will be. I'd love to be able to do it at that level (although my talent is probably far from near) but don't have the funds. It's a tough world but just because I can't do it, doesn't mean that I begrudge others who are more fortunate.
What do you suggest, that Mansell funds somebody elses kids just because they might have more talent ?
Nige' should be telling his kids they just don't cut it and to get a real job - what happens when they fianlly realise when he does finally get pissed off with bank rolling them and they have achived nothing - what do they do then - oh yes just go back to dad for more cash............These lads obviously want to race cars and are fortunate to have the family money to enable them to do it at their chosen level.
Who are we to dictate whether or not they are deserving of a place on any grid ?
They might not be front runners but they're doing something that they want to do.
It's an expensive sport and always will be. I'd love to be able to do it at that level (although my talent is probably far from near) but don't have the funds. It's a tough world but just because I can't do it, doesn't mean that I begrudge others who are more fortunate.
What do you suggest, that Mansell funds somebody elses kids just because they might have more talent ?
Edited by lazyitus on Wednesday 14th November 14:01
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