More Hamilton Humility
Discussion
I can't remember who originally said it but I do remember a very successfull F1 champion saying something along the lines of...
"The second you start to think your not the fastest man out there, your not"
I think all the drivers on the grid have a huge self belief in their own ability with a distinct lack of fear/imagination. They are all supremely confident and even those at the back will always blame the car if they don't do well (afterall, it would never have anything to do with their own talent). you can see this 'self belief' in every single driver out there if you look for it.
I don't think 'arrogance' is the correct term to use for this as away from the track the guy seems pretty normal, he is in his early twenties remember, so he's not going to be the wisest at times (his "rollin on 22's" stlye comment on Top Gear for example).
He's a kid... all be it an extremely talented one. Occasionally he will say...erm... "young things"
"The second you start to think your not the fastest man out there, your not"
I think all the drivers on the grid have a huge self belief in their own ability with a distinct lack of fear/imagination. They are all supremely confident and even those at the back will always blame the car if they don't do well (afterall, it would never have anything to do with their own talent). you can see this 'self belief' in every single driver out there if you look for it.
I don't think 'arrogance' is the correct term to use for this as away from the track the guy seems pretty normal, he is in his early twenties remember, so he's not going to be the wisest at times (his "rollin on 22's" stlye comment on Top Gear for example).
He's a kid... all be it an extremely talented one. Occasionally he will say...erm... "young things"
brayash said:
but he's starting to get swept up in the lifestyle now: Naomi Cambell, moving abroad etc... he's a star and he knows it - bring on real racers like Kimi and Fernando who avoid the cameras and get on and race.
Kimi and Fernando - you mean the two drivers who moved to Switzerland before Hamilton did? 
This point has been made before, but loads of people seem to ignore it: It's not Hamilton's fault that journalists and PR flunkies are all over him. He doesn't write his own headlines, he doesn't put words in James Allen's jabbering mouth.
If one has objections to what he says or does, then fair enough. It's not fair to criticise him for his profile, because he's not the one who's creating it.
I love the the LH bashers are still at it. Hating someone, pretty unreasonably especially given how short his limelight has been, is the pinacle of delusion though fear. Yoda "Fear lead to hate" /Yoda. Schoolboy mentality. It's funny.
I wonder if the LH bashers ever saw Senna race and more importantly, heard his comments? He even had Jackie Stewart come in to interrogate him at one point. Yet, now that he isn't racing, this seems to be forgotten and he's now regarded a legend.
LH is nowhere near that level, and even so it's only confidence. Any sportsman, not just in F1, always wants to play against the best, just to see how good they are. There's no harm in that. You can never possibly know if they believe it or not - that your perception, not theirs. (think about that for a moment).
Comparing the two while they don't compete, and catagorically stating that one is definitely better than the other is moronic. You can't compare Pele to Maradonna, you're only left with an opinion and if it's ranted, no-one will listen to you, ever.
I want to see Schumi on TG in a reasonably priced car. Now THAT would be interesting...
I wonder if the LH bashers ever saw Senna race and more importantly, heard his comments? He even had Jackie Stewart come in to interrogate him at one point. Yet, now that he isn't racing, this seems to be forgotten and he's now regarded a legend.
LH is nowhere near that level, and even so it's only confidence. Any sportsman, not just in F1, always wants to play against the best, just to see how good they are. There's no harm in that. You can never possibly know if they believe it or not - that your perception, not theirs. (think about that for a moment).
Comparing the two while they don't compete, and catagorically stating that one is definitely better than the other is moronic. You can't compare Pele to Maradonna, you're only left with an opinion and if it's ranted, no-one will listen to you, ever.
I want to see Schumi on TG in a reasonably priced car. Now THAT would be interesting...
On Top Gear I thought Lewis Hamilton did a preety good job in his interview with Clarkson.
However James Blunt left him standing in this respect.
Therefore I propose that Hamilton be sacked and Blunt given his McLaren for next season.
On the basis of some of the arguments below I'm sure many will see this as a perfectly reasonable suggestion.
However James Blunt left him standing in this respect.
Therefore I propose that Hamilton be sacked and Blunt given his McLaren for next season.
On the basis of some of the arguments below I'm sure many will see this as a perfectly reasonable suggestion.
Ecurie Ecosse said:
http://sport.guardian.co.uk/motorsport/story/0,,22...
"I was disappointed when Schumacher left formula one as it meant I never got the chance to race against him. He was a phenomenal driver. When I joined, Fernando Alonso was the champion and I beat him in a few races. That was a great feeling but I'm sure beating Schumacher would be even better. I would love to race against him, it would be a great challenge and a great test for any driver."
It think that the bit I've highlighted in the quote show his real intent and give a glimpse into the mind of a sportsman."I was disappointed when Schumacher left formula one as it meant I never got the chance to race against him. He was a phenomenal driver. When I joined, Fernando Alonso was the champion and I beat him in a few races. That was a great feeling but I'm sure beating Schumacher would be even better. I would love to race against him, it would be a great challenge and a great test for any driver."
They want to win but first and formost they want to compete against the best.
We know Schumi came accross as an arrogant git (and with some justification!), why would it be wrong to Hamilton to hold his own skills in high regard?
Even so, I don't see how the article can be read to show LH to be an arrogant chap. Competative and with a desire to win but arrogant?
Hardly.
I accept all drivers needs to believe that they're the best, and I understand why. I also understand we will never know Hamilton's true view of himself at this moment in time.
But I actually prefer the arrogant git attitude to hiding behind this veil of 'modesty'. It's probably not his fault and he's been groomed by McLaren to be their real little star, but all his overly modest comments invite even more praise and both Lewis and McLaren know it. I guess you could see it as a catch-22 in that if they're nice they get jibed for it, but then none of the other drivers seem to bother. They say relatively little and race, with everyone knowing they're a cocky git.
Again, very little of this is Hamilton's own fault, and it's a shame for him (in my opinion) that things have gone this way. It's resulted in vast numbers of the British public who have previously had very little insight into motorsport hailing him a hero, and a large chunk (not everyone of course) of people with F1 close to their hearts not being overly impressed. And I think there's the rub - who's more important to him?
He couldn't really have done a better job this year, but I feel he's just gained too much respect before he's earned it.
PS I hope the post about hating Hamilton wasn't aimed at me... I've tried to make it very clear that he's obviously a nice guy and much of my disillusionment isn't directly his fault
But I actually prefer the arrogant git attitude to hiding behind this veil of 'modesty'. It's probably not his fault and he's been groomed by McLaren to be their real little star, but all his overly modest comments invite even more praise and both Lewis and McLaren know it. I guess you could see it as a catch-22 in that if they're nice they get jibed for it, but then none of the other drivers seem to bother. They say relatively little and race, with everyone knowing they're a cocky git.
Again, very little of this is Hamilton's own fault, and it's a shame for him (in my opinion) that things have gone this way. It's resulted in vast numbers of the British public who have previously had very little insight into motorsport hailing him a hero, and a large chunk (not everyone of course) of people with F1 close to their hearts not being overly impressed. And I think there's the rub - who's more important to him?
He couldn't really have done a better job this year, but I feel he's just gained too much respect before he's earned it.
PS I hope the post about hating Hamilton wasn't aimed at me... I've tried to make it very clear that he's obviously a nice guy and much of my disillusionment isn't directly his fault
brayash said:
Have they found a cure for narcolepsy yet? If not you really have my sympathies man...
No, unfortunately sleep brought on by the tedious repetition of the same old shite in an otherwise excellent motor sport forum has no cure.Hasn't anyone else realised that damning Hamilton as a future nearly man is just as stupid as saying that he will never become an F1 great?
Evidently not.
I completely fail to understand where all this 'Hamilton hatred' is coming from, there seems to be a completely irrational desire to criticise a man who, as far as I can tell, has done nothing wrong.
I think it's 'because he is blick.'
I'm not sure I recall discussing Hamilton's future at all, I'm sure he's a potential world champion (along with half the grid, given the right circumstances).
And surely Hamilton 'Hatred' is exaggerating somewhat - I for one wouldn't be compelled to spit in his face if I saw him. I can't, because he's blick, and I'd go to prison.
Finally I humbly apologise for bringing down the level of this otherwise excellent motorsport forum - in future I shall comply by saying Lewis is the most talented driver out there. And there was me thinking forums are used for debate...
And surely Hamilton 'Hatred' is exaggerating somewhat - I for one wouldn't be compelled to spit in his face if I saw him. I can't, because he's blick, and I'd go to prison.
Finally I humbly apologise for bringing down the level of this otherwise excellent motorsport forum - in future I shall comply by saying Lewis is the most talented driver out there. And there was me thinking forums are used for debate...
brayash said:
Finally I humbly apologise for bringing down the level of this otherwise excellent motorsport forum - in future I shall comply by saying Lewis is the most talented driver out there. And there was me thinking forums are used for debate...
Sorry, the comment wasn't directed specifically at you.Forums are for debate - check my responses to 'Will Hamilton Win the 2008 World Championship' thread.
I'm just getting a bit tired of people slagging off Hamilton for now apparent reason.
MrKipling43 said:
I completely fail to understand where all this 'Hamilton hatred' is coming from, there seems to be a completely irrational desire to criticise a man who, as far as I can tell, has done nothing wrong.
I think it's 'because he is blick.'
Completely agree. I think it's 'because he is blick.'
Again not pointing the finger at any poster here.
I know several individuals (not PHers) who would be upset to be called racists yet apply different standards to individuals depending on that person's origins.
Congratulations MrKipling on venturing such a contentious comment!
Ecurie Ecosse said:
Guys
You misunderstand, I wasn't bashing Hamilton in this post. Why do you think I was - are his comments less than modest after all? ; )
That's what I thought you meant.You misunderstand, I wasn't bashing Hamilton in this post. Why do you think I was - are his comments less than modest after all? ; )
I don't think I'm alone in wishing that we had got to see Schumacher and Senna in machines of equal ability duking it out on track and I for one would love to see Hamilton up against MS.
I wonder just how likely it would be if Mateschitz were to tempt MS with a huge offer to drive a Red Bull next year?...Imagine the publicity for Red Bull? If Todt is indeed marginalised at the Scuderia,it's not as if MS would feel any duty of loyalty to Mosley's beeatch Montezemolo would he?
MrKipling43 said:
I think it's 'because he is blick.'
not such a daft post, and not at all getting at anyone on this forum.But our latest tennis protege wasn't treated in quite this hated way instantly, despite being crowned king of tennis before even walking out onto the court.
Then again Walcott received a hell of alot of bashing for being included into the England Football team by Sven,
These are the three most notable newcomers I can think of in sport recently. Which one didn't get slated, and what do you think the difference was?
anyway
Hamilton is a top guy, and drives great.
Of course he's confident, he's a sportsman, but that doesn't make him arrogant. If i'm one of the best at something in my field, then i'll say it. That makes me confident- not arrogant.
even if he is arrogant - who cares??
Edited by fb902350 on Wednesday 5th December 14:52
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