RE: Sprinting & Hillclimbing
Discussion
maybe im mistaken, but we have been told (by the MSA) that we can run a championship that has list 1a only for roadgoing, although as an event organiser if you run an all comers MSA Roadgoing class (classes 1a,1b,1c), then both 1A & B would have to be allowed.
as i say maybe im wrong but for the original poster, if any doubt call the organisers of youre championship for details.
as i say maybe im wrong but for the original poster, if any doubt call the organisers of youre championship for details.
I think the following should clarify the position, comes from the HSA website and dated February..
[i] We are in receipt of the following statement from the MSA, which directly affects the Richard Egger/HSA Speed Championship classes A1, A2, A2.1 and A3. For clarity, the full text of the statement is reproduced here.
"23rd February 2010; Roadgoing Classes and Tyres.
It has been brought to our attention that the tyres specified within the Road-going Category (GR (S)11.) of your Championship Regulations are restricted to List 1A only.
We request that you amend your Regulations to add list 1B in order to comply with (S)11.6.2. which states that tyres must be to 'list 1A and list 1B'.
This matter has been discussed at the Sprint & Hill Climb Sub-Committee today and consequently no exceptions to 2010 Championships in this respect will be permitted."
It is therefore now clear that the REI/HSA Championship draft regulations need to be amended to allow the use of list 1B tyres across the Road-going Categories. It is further confirmed that the amendment applies across the UK to any Championship which has restricted the use of 1A tyres within the Category.
It has also been necessary to make other minor changes to the Championship Class structure in order to comply with the required MSA categories. We are hopeful these will be agreed by the MSA within the next week when they will be published to the website. [/i]
[i] We are in receipt of the following statement from the MSA, which directly affects the Richard Egger/HSA Speed Championship classes A1, A2, A2.1 and A3. For clarity, the full text of the statement is reproduced here.
"23rd February 2010; Roadgoing Classes and Tyres.
It has been brought to our attention that the tyres specified within the Road-going Category (GR (S)11.) of your Championship Regulations are restricted to List 1A only.
We request that you amend your Regulations to add list 1B in order to comply with (S)11.6.2. which states that tyres must be to 'list 1A and list 1B'.
This matter has been discussed at the Sprint & Hill Climb Sub-Committee today and consequently no exceptions to 2010 Championships in this respect will be permitted."
It is therefore now clear that the REI/HSA Championship draft regulations need to be amended to allow the use of list 1B tyres across the Road-going Categories. It is further confirmed that the amendment applies across the UK to any Championship which has restricted the use of 1A tyres within the Category.
It has also been necessary to make other minor changes to the Championship Class structure in order to comply with the required MSA categories. We are hopeful these will be agreed by the MSA within the next week when they will be published to the website. [/i]
I've seen an E-mail from the MSA clarifying this point.
It states 'Championship/event organisers are then free, within these categories, by means of class regulation to specify tyre choice to being either (L) List LA, (L) List 1B or any specific tyre from either list. In order to do so appropriate regulation must be incorporated into the specific championship/Event regulations'
So I'm guessing from the above the MSA wanted to leave it as open as possible and let the clubs decide, I suppose the only issue is where event's count towards 2 or more championships.
It states 'Championship/event organisers are then free, within these categories, by means of class regulation to specify tyre choice to being either (L) List LA, (L) List 1B or any specific tyre from either list. In order to do so appropriate regulation must be incorporated into the specific championship/Event regulations'
So I'm guessing from the above the MSA wanted to leave it as open as possible and let the clubs decide, I suppose the only issue is where event's count towards 2 or more championships.
The last two posts seem to contradict each other. The first says that a championship has said they want to restrict their classes to only 1a tyres and the MSA has said they can't and the second one says Championship organisers are allowed to specify class restrictions within road going, according to the MSA???
Luckily it seems to have passed us by in the SW since we have always been able to use 1b anyway
Luckily it seems to have passed us by in the SW since we have always been able to use 1b anyway
We are told by the MSA we should encourage new people into motor sport
of which the roadgoing class in speed events has to be one of the best
ways of doing this, and then they say to be competitive you will need
more expensive tyres than standard.
Surely the whole point of entry level motor sport is to keep it as cheap as possible.
of which the roadgoing class in speed events has to be one of the best
ways of doing this, and then they say to be competitive you will need
more expensive tyres than standard.
Surely the whole point of entry level motor sport is to keep it as cheap as possible.
Edited by eglf on Monday 19th April 21:15
The March MSA clarification is here: http://www.msauk.org/site/cms/newsarticle.asp?chap...
That seems to supersede the February posting. Nothing like clear decision making!
It seems a lot of the northern series have added additional classes, and would help resolve the problem.
SA: Standard Saloon & Sportscars up to 1400cc
SB: Standard Saloon & Sportscars 1401cc up to 2000cc
SC: Standard Saloon & Sportscars over 2000cc
Classes SA, SB & SC
These classes are intended for near-standard cars with very few modifications (as listed), to encourage low-cost entry into the sport. All cars running in the above classes must remain in totally road legal form at all times.
All cars must have a current Vehicle Registration Document, Road Tax Disc & insurance in the name of the main driver, with a current MOT if age requires it. Note: Trade plates and traders or company group insurance policies will not be accepted.
No modifications (optional or otherwise) are permitted which are likely to improve the performance and handling of the car with the following exceptions: Wheels & Tyres: The standard wheel rim width may be increased by a maximum of one inch and fitted with tyres to suit. Tyres must be from MSA list 1A and be road legal.
Engine & Exhaust: The air cleaner and exhaust system must remain as production or pattern replacement including catalyst if fitted. Electronic ignition may be fitted. Suspension & Steering: the steering wheel may be replaced by a non- standard item. Uprated dampers may be fitted.
Body: In the interest of safety the front seats may be replaced by a competition version which must be fully trimmed, not a bare shell.
Pyrotechnic safety devices such as airbags and seatbelt pretensioners may be disconnected or removed. General: No other modifications, except the fitting of a roll cage, are allowed in classes SA, SB & SC. Kit cars, limited production cars, space framed or non-ferrous chassis construction road cars and one-off road-going cars are not permitted in Classes SA, SB & SC.
In the event of an unresolved eligibility issue, the driver of the car concerned may be required to produce within four weeks of the event in question, a manufacturer’s catalogue to substantiate any queried modifications / specifications and allow championship points to stand. Any modifications not specifically permitted are, by definition, not allowed.
That seems to supersede the February posting. Nothing like clear decision making!
It seems a lot of the northern series have added additional classes, and would help resolve the problem.
SA: Standard Saloon & Sportscars up to 1400cc
SB: Standard Saloon & Sportscars 1401cc up to 2000cc
SC: Standard Saloon & Sportscars over 2000cc
Classes SA, SB & SC
These classes are intended for near-standard cars with very few modifications (as listed), to encourage low-cost entry into the sport. All cars running in the above classes must remain in totally road legal form at all times.
All cars must have a current Vehicle Registration Document, Road Tax Disc & insurance in the name of the main driver, with a current MOT if age requires it. Note: Trade plates and traders or company group insurance policies will not be accepted.
No modifications (optional or otherwise) are permitted which are likely to improve the performance and handling of the car with the following exceptions: Wheels & Tyres: The standard wheel rim width may be increased by a maximum of one inch and fitted with tyres to suit. Tyres must be from MSA list 1A and be road legal.
Engine & Exhaust: The air cleaner and exhaust system must remain as production or pattern replacement including catalyst if fitted. Electronic ignition may be fitted. Suspension & Steering: the steering wheel may be replaced by a non- standard item. Uprated dampers may be fitted.
Body: In the interest of safety the front seats may be replaced by a competition version which must be fully trimmed, not a bare shell.
Pyrotechnic safety devices such as airbags and seatbelt pretensioners may be disconnected or removed. General: No other modifications, except the fitting of a roll cage, are allowed in classes SA, SB & SC. Kit cars, limited production cars, space framed or non-ferrous chassis construction road cars and one-off road-going cars are not permitted in Classes SA, SB & SC.
In the event of an unresolved eligibility issue, the driver of the car concerned may be required to produce within four weeks of the event in question, a manufacturer’s catalogue to substantiate any queried modifications / specifications and allow championship points to stand. Any modifications not specifically permitted are, by definition, not allowed.
Edited by Dan Friel on Monday 19th April 21:19
andye30m3 said:
davenorman555 said:
anybody suggest the best way to mount a timing strut on the front of a Clio preferably without drilling holes in the bumper?
I took my front number plate off a screwed it to the bumper where the holes wouldn't be seen well the Clio has now completed its 1st weekends hillclimbing, competing @ Wiscombe Park on both saturday & sunday in Novice Class 'W' - managed to achieve 1st in Class on saturday hard pushed by an MR2 who then managed to squeeze ahead by a slim margin on sunday - congrats to Pete who pushed as hard as he could! It was a very small class (max. 4 cars, down to 2 by the last run on sunday). Ideally need to replace the rattly exhaust before it competes again, otherwise it should be fine. Still considering the whole minefield of tyres but I do have a spare set of wheels so who knows what will happen...! Thanks to everybody who has offered advice/suggestions, most of it helped! See you at the next one...
PS For those of you that are interested I have posted an 'in-car' video of my fastest run on You Tube, just search for Wiscombe 2010
PS For those of you that are interested I have posted an 'in-car' video of my fastest run on You Tube, just search for Wiscombe 2010
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