Can Vettel "race"?
Discussion
I thought he did rather well in the last 20 laps of the race today. Some good aggressive stuff and created some entertainment. Ok, he was hardly in the same league as Hamilton of late (or ever), but then, who is?
Did this race put to bed his lack of overtaking prowess (or opportunities)?
Discuss.
Did this race put to bed his lack of overtaking prowess (or opportunities)?
Discuss.
Mazda Baiter said:
No. He is still the most over-rated driver on the grid imho.
+1He can run off into the distance if he starts at the front and doesn't try to push his team mate off the road, but seems to be a clumsy
if anyone is close to him. I missed most of the race, but from accounts seems like he resorted to bully tactics to get past Sutil - not big, not clever - that will likely come back to haunt him.Jasandjules said:
I still love the fact that he has gone out and done one lap per quali session and got pole.
BUT, I am now getting a bit peeved with his attempts at shoving people out of the way.
Agree that the car is making him look better than he really is. Also agree that he has a "win at any cost" mentality, which would be OK, if it didn't include shoving people out of the way. Another Schumacher in the making ??BUT, I am now getting a bit peeved with his attempts at shoving people out of the way.
Agree with all that has been said. Can you imagine what Hamilton or Shumacher would have done in that car coming from the back? They would have scythed through the back markers with ease.
I used to really like Vettel but his antics lately (and those of C Horner Esq.) have turned me against him. I was so wanting Webbo to lap Vettel yesterday, he almost did, at one point Webbo could see Vettel in front.
I used to really like Vettel but his antics lately (and those of C Horner Esq.) have turned me against him. I was so wanting Webbo to lap Vettel yesterday, he almost did, at one point Webbo could see Vettel in front.
llewop said:
Mazda Baiter said:
No. He is still the most over-rated driver on the grid imho.
+1He can run off into the distance if he starts at the front and doesn't try to push his team mate off the road, but seems to be a clumsy
if anyone is close to him. I missed most of the race, but from accounts seems like he resorted to bully tactics to get past Sutil - not big, not clever - that will likely come back to haunt him.Personally I think if he worked on behaving and driving a bit more maturely he could be one of the greats, unfortunately everyone seems to be treating him as a finished article already so I can't see where he is being given the motivation to improve on those areas.
Hamilton is a good comparision, like Vettel he had his path into F1 smoothed by being picked up by one of the big players early and he too showed a lack of maturity when he first started (although IMO he handled it better than Vettel) but he has grown up massively over the last couple of years, possibly down in part to the dog he had to drive last year and maybe even partly due to Jenson's influence and as a result I think he is having a fantastic season - Seb would do well to look to his example.
Edited by KaraK on Monday 12th July 09:37
Glad to see more and more people are realiusing this, when I first said it early last year everyone thought I was crazy...being stuck behind Sutil proved it yet again, first he outbraked himself, then he went on the grass and then he barged passed when there was no opening like they do in BTCC.
He's young, give it time, It's certainly no reason for all the hate he seems to attract, don't forget he draped the England flag over his car last race. It's all a bit too DM in here sometimes.
As for Horner, well the reason he supported Vettel after his tangle with Webbo was explained yesterday, he supports whoever is ahead on points, that's all. He admitted that, now Webbo is ahead, he would get the choice of spoilers etc next time around.
As for Horner, well the reason he supported Vettel after his tangle with Webbo was explained yesterday, he supports whoever is ahead on points, that's all. He admitted that, now Webbo is ahead, he would get the choice of spoilers etc next time around.
Seeing as it took him a million laps to get past Sutil (and even then that pass was horrid) who was in a slower car Sfettel really doesn't seem a racer. I remember earlier this year when the two RBR's got lunched in traffic he couldn't do too much about it then either. Part of it may be down to the RB6 being utterly hopeless in heavy traffic but I remember Webber at China doing very well until he got pushed way wide!
Bombjack on April 27th said:
...I'm starting to wonder what's wrong with me that I can't see this greatness in Vettel. He strikes me as a more consistent version of Massa - very good when out front in the best a well-balanced car, average otherwise.
I'm starting to think I was too generous. His "go-to" overtaking move against a competitive car appears to be to hit them.I think he's fast in a single lap quali and a very good driver however I don't think he is a great driver.
Silverstone suited Redbull's clear performance advantage and Vettel was well out of position behind some average drivers in average cars (to differing degrees of both) so I think his overtaking there isn't a strictly true reflection.
Sadly the more I see his antics, both on and off the track, the more he irritates me.
Silverstone suited Redbull's clear performance advantage and Vettel was well out of position behind some average drivers in average cars (to differing degrees of both) so I think his overtaking there isn't a strictly true reflection.
Sadly the more I see his antics, both on and off the track, the more he irritates me.
As much as I'm a fan of McLaren, Hamilton and Button, seeing and reading about Vettels and RedBulls behaviour recently has made me start to cheer Webber on for the drivers championship, just so he can stick two fingers up to RedBull. If he can do that with McLaren still winning the constructors championship I think that would be a very good season!
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