The Land and Water Speed Records Thread

[Life Saab Itch]

dr_gn said:

Shkval:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VA-111_Shkval

http://www.popsci.com/scitech/article/2004-06/supe...

So does a WSR craft have to be 'on' water, or could it be 'in' water?

This is a very interesting idea as a safety feature for a WSR craft.

[Life Saab Itch]

dr_gn said:

I think - at speed - rather than centre of gravity it's the centre of aerodynamic pressure that's the essential problem, and the fact that (as far as I'm aware) regulations sate that you can't adjust it through conventional aerodynamic means.

Centre of gravity is pretty much fixed in the time frames we're talking about, and would be very difficult to move quickly enough to be used as a control method. For example, pumping fuel to and from trim tanks would take far too long to counter any transient instability during a run.

All IMHO of course.

I have told DJC my idea for this...

[Life Saab Itch]

DJC said:

Trust me...your CofG moves.

And is movable...

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DJC said:

Ive no problem with K7 running again so long as its not some 30knt de-caf, lightweight poncy "tribute" run.

If you are going to do it at least have the bks to honour the dead and slam the throttles wide open.

Apparently they have "signed up" a guy called Ted Walsh to run Bluebird. He is a well known powerboat racer.

So that gives you some hope.

But they are also saying that they think Bluebird will start to plane at about 65mph...

And that doesn't.

[Life Saab Itch]

Fossilface said:

This whole thing does trouble me tbh.

It's difficult to describe how I see it, but here goes.

If the boat and DC had been rescued from the lake back in 1967, I think my feelings on it would be different, but for me, he and it sitting on the bottom for 34 years made it for me their final resting place, and there they should hve stayed and disolved away to nothing.

The sight of him, as you say, with his jester hat, stood on the back of the boat as it was drawn from the water made my blood boil tbh.
It reminded of a child showing off what he had found in the undergrowth to his friends.
This is a boat that killed a man ffs.
Taking the boat from the lake should have been a solemn thing, not a look at me opportunity.

Here was a famous WSR boat that he felt was up for grabs and so he went about doing so, and for me, conned Gina C into green lighting the project by convincing her that it and his resting places were in peril.

Does anyone know what will become of the boat after these "trials" are completed?
Is it going to start doing celebrity appearances?
I hope that no one is going to make any personal profit from it that's for sure.

I could be right, I could be wrong. I don't know.
I just can't kick this awful feeking in my stomach whenever I think about it.
It all just seems wrong to me.
I think I just find it all a bit vulgar and disrspectful.

I'd forgotten how much I felt about this. Please forgive my ramblings.

From what I have read on the Bluebird website, the craft will be kept in a local museum (sorry, I can't remember which) but will be kept in full working order ie: run up every so often to keep all the systems lubricated etc.

It will be kept so that it "could" be run on water with a couple of weeks notice.

I agree with the 'taste' aspect of the lifting of DMC and Bluebird. It could have been handled better.

But....as the boat is out of the water and they are doing a superb job restoring it, it would be a shame for it not to do some "medium speed" runs.

[Life Saab Itch]

FourWheelDrift said:

Bluebird was at the bottom of a cold fresh water lake and hardly changed after 34 years and unlikely to ever change much if left there, to see Babs restored after 40 years of being buried in salt water soaked sand was quite an achievement. I do also wonder how much of Babs is original. Or if it's a typical "triggers broom" restoration like many classic cars or wrecked aircraft where only the bare minimum of the original is kept to maintain it's originality and the rest is new metalwork.

This is the reason (the more I read into it, possibly the only reason) why I am supportive of the Bluebird restoration. Currently, they have two shoeboxes of bits that are unsalvageable from the whole boat. The level of care that they have taken to ensure that every last bit is reused is astounding.

The restoration will be the original Bluebird.

From what I have heard, Babs was quite badly corroded and a lot of new metal had to be "let in" over a substantial amount of the car. Whether that classes as a "Trigger's broom", I'm not sure. But the conditions that they were respectively exposed to were totally different.

[Life Saab Itch]

jonnylayze said:

DJC said:

The difference to me is that Babs time has come and gone. K7 could still cut it.

Therefore if raised and restored...put thy ego where thy wallet is.

interesting.....

Genuinely - do you think the technology would still be up to breaking the record?

That aside, there would surely be other questions about metal fatigue etc.

According to the Bluebird website and other sources, DMC was going faster than Ken Warby's record when he flipped.

K7 could go for a record, but how much of a suicide bid would it be considering the history of the boat? Would you want to modify certain parts of the boat to make it more stable?

On the Quicksilver website it says they designed stability with up to a 10 degree angle of lift at the front. It also says that K7 was beyond the point of no return at 3 degrees.

I fully agree with running K7 at "speed". Get her up on her planing shoes and make her look right. But I think that going for a record in that boat would not be right. No matter how much any paperwork says that it is Bill Smith's boat, no matter what laws say who's "salvage rights" the boat comes under, that boat will always be Donald's boat.

[Life Saab Itch]

dr_gn said:

So there is nothing stopping a "Ground Effect" vehicle being used with a vestigial water vane being used? Surely not?

So an Ekranoplan with a following skvarm (sp) torpedo.

[Life Saab Itch]

dr_gn said:

Doubt it: A sailing boat is not a "vessel used in powerboating".

It doesn't say (unless it does elsewhere in the regs) that you can't have aero controls as well as hydro controls.

[Life Saab Itch]

Sam_68 has mentioned before about an existing design aiming at the 400mph target if I recall correctly.

[Life Saab Itch]

When you two make this boat, can I suggest the name "Miss England"?

[Life Saab Itch]

Sam_68 said:

Not the luckiest name in powerboating history...

We were torn between 'Infinity' (from the symbol traditionally used for unlimited class WWSR boats) and 'White Rose' ('cos we were from Yorkshire, so it would have been a two-fingered salute to the red rose of the Windermere Motorboat Racing Club).

Fair play.

As I have said in a previous thread, if you want a fabricator/mechanic, let me know.