E30 M52-swapped Trackday Car
Discussion
Thanks WSW. Been stalking your Escort build too, that's a very professional bit of work.
So this weekend I set out to solve niggling issues I've had with the cooling system from day 1. Although car never overheated, or even got close to overheating, it's not been quite right. The story went something like this.
1) Initial radiator install, filled cooling system, bled, hot air through heaters, fan comes on okay, job done. Then I noticed a small coolant leak from the radiator return hose after I'd driven it to the MOT centre. Put this on my list of things to fix once I got the car back.
2) Thought I'd managed to fix coolant leak, until I returned from the bodyshop to find coolant pissing out through the radiator expansion cap onto the floor.
3) Removed join that was cause of leak. T-bolt was slightly to big for the pipe joiner, which is why it was leaking under pressure, no matter how tight it was done up. Fitted a smaller t-bolt, leak fixed, re-bled system, job done take two.
4)...until after driving, I spotted another leak. A very slight weeping from the fan temperature switch on the side of the rad. Plus the system was over-pressurising again, causing the expansion cap to vent air. Of course, head gasket is always a possibility but I knew the engine was fine in the donor car and I had no other HG failure symptoms whatsoever. I thought I'd just best get the cooling system A1 first.
5) Scared to torque up the temp switch any more for fear of breaking the flimsy plastic, I decided I was going to remove this, use some PTFE tape and re-fit. Until I decided to do a bit of research on the Eis-branded radiator I'd bought (2nd hand, unused) and found they are generally considered to be a load of tosh. Throwing caution into the wind, I decided to stump up the £90 or so for a brand new Nissens radiator, in an effort to fix not only current issues, but to protect against any future ones. Radiator arrived next day and it only took 3 seconds to see that the quality is infinitely better than the Eis radiator. I went to fit this on Saturday morning.
6) Upon draining the system (again) and disconnecting all the hoses, I found that the temp switch was just turning in its boss, it wasn't unscrewing. Not good. I removed the rad to find the the plastic had cracked around the boss. Of course, no amount of PTFE would've fixed that. I had to cut around the plastic to remove the switch with the insert, then use a pair of grips to hold the insert whilst I unscrewed the switch. Pain in the *ss.
7) Fitted new radiator and re-filled the system once more. Ran the car up to temperature, hot air at vents, bled out a tiny amount of air then took it for a test drive. Bit of traffic, some back lanes, a fast dual carriageway blast then some more traffic before I returned.
All this drive did was confirm that nothing was right with that first rad! Before, the temp would typically sit just over halfway, dropping slightly at speed. In traffic it quickly rose to just below 3/4, when the fan would kick in and drop the temp. With the new radiator, the temp sits just below halfway and even sitting in traffic for a few minutes (after the dual carriageway), then idling it on return to the garage, it never got hot enough for the fan to have to come on at all. Checking things over afterwards revealed no leaks and no hissing expansion cap.
So now hopefully that's the end of my cooling maladies. Perfect demonstration of "buy cheap, buy twice". Now I just need to keep driving it until the next ugly issue raises its head...
So this weekend I set out to solve niggling issues I've had with the cooling system from day 1. Although car never overheated, or even got close to overheating, it's not been quite right. The story went something like this.
1) Initial radiator install, filled cooling system, bled, hot air through heaters, fan comes on okay, job done. Then I noticed a small coolant leak from the radiator return hose after I'd driven it to the MOT centre. Put this on my list of things to fix once I got the car back.
2) Thought I'd managed to fix coolant leak, until I returned from the bodyshop to find coolant pissing out through the radiator expansion cap onto the floor.
3) Removed join that was cause of leak. T-bolt was slightly to big for the pipe joiner, which is why it was leaking under pressure, no matter how tight it was done up. Fitted a smaller t-bolt, leak fixed, re-bled system, job done take two.
4)...until after driving, I spotted another leak. A very slight weeping from the fan temperature switch on the side of the rad. Plus the system was over-pressurising again, causing the expansion cap to vent air. Of course, head gasket is always a possibility but I knew the engine was fine in the donor car and I had no other HG failure symptoms whatsoever. I thought I'd just best get the cooling system A1 first.
5) Scared to torque up the temp switch any more for fear of breaking the flimsy plastic, I decided I was going to remove this, use some PTFE tape and re-fit. Until I decided to do a bit of research on the Eis-branded radiator I'd bought (2nd hand, unused) and found they are generally considered to be a load of tosh. Throwing caution into the wind, I decided to stump up the £90 or so for a brand new Nissens radiator, in an effort to fix not only current issues, but to protect against any future ones. Radiator arrived next day and it only took 3 seconds to see that the quality is infinitely better than the Eis radiator. I went to fit this on Saturday morning.
6) Upon draining the system (again) and disconnecting all the hoses, I found that the temp switch was just turning in its boss, it wasn't unscrewing. Not good. I removed the rad to find the the plastic had cracked around the boss. Of course, no amount of PTFE would've fixed that. I had to cut around the plastic to remove the switch with the insert, then use a pair of grips to hold the insert whilst I unscrewed the switch. Pain in the *ss.
7) Fitted new radiator and re-filled the system once more. Ran the car up to temperature, hot air at vents, bled out a tiny amount of air then took it for a test drive. Bit of traffic, some back lanes, a fast dual carriageway blast then some more traffic before I returned.
All this drive did was confirm that nothing was right with that first rad! Before, the temp would typically sit just over halfway, dropping slightly at speed. In traffic it quickly rose to just below 3/4, when the fan would kick in and drop the temp. With the new radiator, the temp sits just below halfway and even sitting in traffic for a few minutes (after the dual carriageway), then idling it on return to the garage, it never got hot enough for the fan to have to come on at all. Checking things over afterwards revealed no leaks and no hissing expansion cap.
So now hopefully that's the end of my cooling maladies. Perfect demonstration of "buy cheap, buy twice". Now I just need to keep driving it until the next ugly issue raises its head...
motorhole said:
Thanks WSW. Been stalking your Escort build too, that's a very professional bit of work.
Hahaa Great! Fancy a E30 project myself!Been slobbering all over this since breakfast, http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-E30-M3-GROUP-N-PRODU...
Good luck with the new rad!
Work-Shy-Wanabe said:
Hahaa Great! Fancy a E30 project myself!
Been slobbering all over this since breakfast, http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-E30-M3-GROUP-N-PRODU...
Good luck with the new rad!
Ha, that's just begging for a V8! Been slobbering all over this since breakfast, http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-E30-M3-GROUP-N-PRODU...
Good luck with the new rad!
Hi motorhole, nice thread!
Just stumbled on it while researching an e30 track/fastroad car I'm looking to build myself. Ironically I had a literally the same 318 LUX as yours that I ended up letting go to some nice chap in a black audi IIRC... for around £800 too.. on a H plate.. In West Yorkshire!!
Can't believe you have my old car and nice to see your putting "Clifford" to good use! Would be great to see the car in action again after so If your hitting any trackdays this year please PM me as i'd love to see the car in action!
Just stumbled on it while researching an e30 track/fastroad car I'm looking to build myself. Ironically I had a literally the same 318 LUX as yours that I ended up letting go to some nice chap in a black audi IIRC... for around £800 too.. on a H plate.. In West Yorkshire!!
Can't believe you have my old car and nice to see your putting "Clifford" to good use! Would be great to see the car in action again after so If your hitting any trackdays this year please PM me as i'd love to see the car in action!
FASTaD13 said:
Hi motorhole, nice thread!
Just stumbled on it while researching an e30 track/fastroad car I'm looking to build myself. Ironically I had a literally the same 318 LUX as yours that I ended up letting go to some nice chap in a black audi IIRC... for around £800 too.. on a H plate.. In West Yorkshire!!
Can't believe you have my old car and nice to see your putting "Clifford" to good use! Would be great to see the car in action again after so If your hitting any trackdays this year please PM me as i'd love to see the car in action!
Hi FASTaD13, thanks for your comments. If this is really your old car, it's a small world!Just stumbled on it while researching an e30 track/fastroad car I'm looking to build myself. Ironically I had a literally the same 318 LUX as yours that I ended up letting go to some nice chap in a black audi IIRC... for around £800 too.. on a H plate.. In West Yorkshire!!
Can't believe you have my old car and nice to see your putting "Clifford" to good use! Would be great to see the car in action again after so If your hitting any trackdays this year please PM me as i'd love to see the car in action!
Have made a few more mods in the past few weeks. First up the heater valve died. By the looks of it, it was on its way out before I took the car off the road, so its demise was inevitable once I put 2-bar of coolant pressure (as opposed to the 1.4 bar it originally dealt with) through it. I replaced that and bled the coolant AGAIN. So far, so good.
The home-made drop links I made had to go too. Basically, the tabs on the Koni struts don't appear man enough for the thicker ARB and had bent and deformed. I got a pair of Mondeo front drop links instead - these are identical to standard E30 ones, save for a rose jointed bottom link rather than a pin and rubber bush arrangement- and used the standard wishbone pickup points instead. I dropped the front about 15 mm and it looks about there. Hopefully going to see its first action this month.
Well the BMW had its first on track outing yesterday at Oulton park. Was a mixed bag to be honest.
Track was damp starting off so not knowing/being comfortable with the car and not knowing how much grip was available, I drove very conservatively. Did 2 sessions of warmup lap, 2 fast (ish) laps, cooldown lap to break things in and those went okay. Once the track started to dry though and I started driving a little faster and braking harder, I started getting horrific vibration through the brake pedal when the brakes were hot and I was slowing from speed. Enough to frighten me!
So I pulled off the front wheels and noticed on the nearside there were signs of slight caliper-wheel contact. Filed off a mm or so from the offending extremities of the caliper and tried it again, with the same result. At this point, as braking from 'normal' speeds and when the brakes weren't stinking hot was okay, I decided to call it a day and drive home before I broke something properly. A shame, because I never really got anywhere close to figuring out the car's capabilities, but at least it got there and back under it's own steam.
So what did I learn?
1) It is fairly quick. Even driving as conservatively as I was, I could still nudge 105mph before having to brake for lodge corner.
2) I may need stiffer springs as at least once, the undertray bottomed out on the tarmac on the dip at the exit of lodge.
3) It's actually quite chuckable and grips very well - my confidence in the car in the respect has improved a lot. Never felt lairy or about to spit me off - but then I never got the opportunity to increase commitment from 5 tenths to 9.5 tenths!
4) Similarly, drivetrain and engine wise, it was bang on. Temperature never rose above halfway. No nasty noises.
I don't have time to do much work on it in the coming weeks, but when I do, I'm going to pull apart the brakes to check for uneven wear and swap out the front wheel bearings. As the wheel was only contacting the caliper on one side, when hot and under high g, there may be enough give in the bearing on the nearside for contact to occur, given the marginal clearances between caliper and wheel. Only Christ knows what the mileage was on the bearings was when I acquired the hubs. If anyone has any other ideas, do let me know
Track was damp starting off so not knowing/being comfortable with the car and not knowing how much grip was available, I drove very conservatively. Did 2 sessions of warmup lap, 2 fast (ish) laps, cooldown lap to break things in and those went okay. Once the track started to dry though and I started driving a little faster and braking harder, I started getting horrific vibration through the brake pedal when the brakes were hot and I was slowing from speed. Enough to frighten me!
So I pulled off the front wheels and noticed on the nearside there were signs of slight caliper-wheel contact. Filed off a mm or so from the offending extremities of the caliper and tried it again, with the same result. At this point, as braking from 'normal' speeds and when the brakes weren't stinking hot was okay, I decided to call it a day and drive home before I broke something properly. A shame, because I never really got anywhere close to figuring out the car's capabilities, but at least it got there and back under it's own steam.
So what did I learn?
1) It is fairly quick. Even driving as conservatively as I was, I could still nudge 105mph before having to brake for lodge corner.
2) I may need stiffer springs as at least once, the undertray bottomed out on the tarmac on the dip at the exit of lodge.
3) It's actually quite chuckable and grips very well - my confidence in the car in the respect has improved a lot. Never felt lairy or about to spit me off - but then I never got the opportunity to increase commitment from 5 tenths to 9.5 tenths!
4) Similarly, drivetrain and engine wise, it was bang on. Temperature never rose above halfway. No nasty noises.
I don't have time to do much work on it in the coming weeks, but when I do, I'm going to pull apart the brakes to check for uneven wear and swap out the front wheel bearings. As the wheel was only contacting the caliper on one side, when hot and under high g, there may be enough give in the bearing on the nearside for contact to occur, given the marginal clearances between caliper and wheel. Only Christ knows what the mileage was on the bearings was when I acquired the hubs. If anyone has any other ideas, do let me know
Just read the whole thread - you've done a nice job of the car. It's always really interesting to see how people put together their 'race cars' from a normal car, and you've done lots of jobs better than I've done on mine.
Hope your brakes turn out to be nothing major. :-)
(p.s. wish my car's body was as straight as yours!!)
Slightly off topic - but this is what a sticking caliper and Blyton park did to my rear brakes on the Impreza (I got warned by a marshall about a griding noise going into Bishops, and a few laps later some sparks!)
Also got my money's worth out of those Eagle F1s
I love Blyton, must go back.
Also got my money's worth out of those Eagle F1s
I love Blyton, must go back.Thanks for the comments again guys! Must say though, the photos make the car look cleaner than it is - it's straight and solid alright, but the mismatching harnesses & bucket seats, slightly mismatching sections of paint under the bonnet where I've patched it up and whatnot do give away that it's certainly not a no-expenses spared build. With regards to rust, the areas ahead of the front arches where the front panel bolts to the inner wings are starting to look frilly - but it's not structural and it's the only real point of concern on the car now. I'll get this sorted in due course.
So here's the evidence of the braking issues:
Definite contact on inside of wheel rim! So I have the following systematic approach to remedy it:
1) I could get slightly larger wheel spacers, but I don't really want any less offset as rear wheel-inner arch clearance is already marginal under compression. So...
2)...I'm going to fit new wheel bearings on the front and take 1 mm or so off the corners of the casting ribs on the calipers with the grinder. Then try again...
3) If that doesn't fix it, I'll get a brass guide pin bushing set for the calipers, to rule out caliper movement as the culprit.
Then it'll be trackday test take 2. Probably Blyton, Donnington or Oulton Park again at end of March/April.
So here's the evidence of the braking issues:
Definite contact on inside of wheel rim! So I have the following systematic approach to remedy it:
1) I could get slightly larger wheel spacers, but I don't really want any less offset as rear wheel-inner arch clearance is already marginal under compression. So...
2)...I'm going to fit new wheel bearings on the front and take 1 mm or so off the corners of the casting ribs on the calipers with the grinder. Then try again...
3) If that doesn't fix it, I'll get a brass guide pin bushing set for the calipers, to rule out caliper movement as the culprit.
Then it'll be trackday test take 2. Probably Blyton, Donnington or Oulton Park again at end of March/April.
Okay, so today I set about Phase 1 of the brake vibration resolution project: replacing front wheel bearings.
Although it was only the nearside that was causing issues, I went about replacing both bearings anyway out of good practice and to prevent any future wheel bearing issues from arising. So I had two complete FAG wheel bearing kits to fit.
I set about the problematic nearside first and everything went exactly to plan. Hubnut freed up no problems, thanks to the world-moving leverage exerted by my 2.5m washing pole-turned-breaker bar. Bearing pulled off cleanly, as did the old dustcaps. A clean up and light grease of the spindle and the new bearing drove on nicely. The end product:
I should add that my car isn‘t suspended by that bottle jack under the lower arm, that‘s purely an auxiliary jack to stop the car (potentially) rocking around when undoing/torquing up the carrier nuts. I did the hubnuts through the wheel with the car on the ground for added safety
It turns out that this was indeed a likely culprit. I‘m not sure wheel bearings should be doing this for a start:
http://youtu.be/ddS3Q2B1Z7k
And the wheel bearings that were on the hubs were not OEM items. They‘d been replaced before and the ones that were there were of the cheap and nasty variety.
The other side was a little more problematic due to half the bearing staying on the spindle, but it still wasn‘t too much of a ballache.
After all this I made a minor mod to the pedal box. If you‘ve been bored enough to stay with my build thread this far, you‘ll know I put a spreader plate under the floorpan for the pedal box. I wasn‘t entirely happy with this on its own though, so to spread the force a little more when really leaning on the brake pedal, I fitted some bigger skirted nuts below some thick washers. Just for added confidence Then I took the thing for a test drive.
Repeated hard braking from speed is difficult to do on the road safely and legally. But I did the best I could within the limits of the law and so far, so good. No nasty vibrations. But I really need another trackday to be certain. Hoping to get something for early April.
Although it was only the nearside that was causing issues, I went about replacing both bearings anyway out of good practice and to prevent any future wheel bearing issues from arising. So I had two complete FAG wheel bearing kits to fit.
I set about the problematic nearside first and everything went exactly to plan. Hubnut freed up no problems, thanks to the world-moving leverage exerted by my 2.5m washing pole-turned-breaker bar. Bearing pulled off cleanly, as did the old dustcaps. A clean up and light grease of the spindle and the new bearing drove on nicely. The end product:
I should add that my car isn‘t suspended by that bottle jack under the lower arm, that‘s purely an auxiliary jack to stop the car (potentially) rocking around when undoing/torquing up the carrier nuts. I did the hubnuts through the wheel with the car on the ground for added safety
It turns out that this was indeed a likely culprit. I‘m not sure wheel bearings should be doing this for a start:
http://youtu.be/ddS3Q2B1Z7k
And the wheel bearings that were on the hubs were not OEM items. They‘d been replaced before and the ones that were there were of the cheap and nasty variety.
The other side was a little more problematic due to half the bearing staying on the spindle, but it still wasn‘t too much of a ballache.
After all this I made a minor mod to the pedal box. If you‘ve been bored enough to stay with my build thread this far, you‘ll know I put a spreader plate under the floorpan for the pedal box. I wasn‘t entirely happy with this on its own though, so to spread the force a little more when really leaning on the brake pedal, I fitted some bigger skirted nuts below some thick washers. Just for added confidence
Then I took the thing for a test drive.Repeated hard braking from speed is difficult to do on the road safely and legally. But I did the best I could within the limits of the law and so far, so good. No nasty vibrations. But I really need another trackday to be certain. Hoping to get something for early April.
So last Monday, I took a long lunch from work with a few to test driving my car, prior to booking a trackday.
I turned up at the garage, rolled it out, frowned as I remembered how much it needed a wash then started checking it over. Only to find the rubber boot on the clutch master cylinder was full of brake fluid. B*ll*cks. I was especially disappointed as it was a new one too - albeit fitted over a year ago. Car went back in the garage, I didn't get my test-drive and I didn't book a trackday.
I ordered a replacement and as the weather was nice on Sunday, I set about replacing it. Drained the system, removed offending item, replaced it and did a one-man bleed using a piece of pipe and a lot of running around the car. The new m/s, despite being identical to the old one, feels different. Clutch is lighter and bite point is lower. Makes me wonder if the old one had been faulty from the off. I checked that the pushrod was entering the cylinder square and that appeared to be the case, so I can't see any other obvious reason for failure. I may take the old one apart to investigate.
I'm sure I can still hear some friction somewhere when turning right too. I've replaced the wheel bearings - so I'm ruling that out - there is now comfortable wheel/caliper clearance, but it sounds metallic so certainly not tyres on bodywork. I wonder if due to the p/s reservoir being mounted at an angle, the pump is drawing air on right hand turns? That's the next potential culprit to investigate.
One day, it will be reliable. I hope.
I turned up at the garage, rolled it out, frowned as I remembered how much it needed a wash then started checking it over. Only to find the rubber boot on the clutch master cylinder was full of brake fluid. B*ll*cks. I was especially disappointed as it was a new one too - albeit fitted over a year ago. Car went back in the garage, I didn't get my test-drive and I didn't book a trackday.
I ordered a replacement and as the weather was nice on Sunday, I set about replacing it. Drained the system, removed offending item, replaced it and did a one-man bleed using a piece of pipe and a lot of running around the car. The new m/s, despite being identical to the old one, feels different. Clutch is lighter and bite point is lower. Makes me wonder if the old one had been faulty from the off. I checked that the pushrod was entering the cylinder square and that appeared to be the case, so I can't see any other obvious reason for failure. I may take the old one apart to investigate.
I'm sure I can still hear some friction somewhere when turning right too. I've replaced the wheel bearings - so I'm ruling that out - there is now comfortable wheel/caliper clearance, but it sounds metallic so certainly not tyres on bodywork. I wonder if due to the p/s reservoir being mounted at an angle, the pump is drawing air on right hand turns? That's the next potential culprit to investigate.
One day, it will be reliable. I hope.
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