2006 Porsche 987 Cayman 3.4 S Bore Score Edition
Discussion
anonymous said:
[redacted]
As I said J, too low.... 
They've got previous too :
https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/996-turbo-gt2/...
Tell the supplier they're having them back and buy another product (KW, OR&T) and as others have said, go social media if the retailer doesn't play ball.
Having been down the same route with the Ohlins, I concur with your view that trying to spec a set of custom springs is just too much of a PITA. Sure when (if) you find the sweet spot, it's very rewarding, but the pile of discarded springs in the corner of your garage will always be there to remind you of the many hours and £'s wasted getting there.
A correctly specified and engineered, off the shelf kit should be perfect, and whilst you're not a fan of KW's (neither am I really) they're properly developed and do what they say on the tin.
The Cayman R set up is good, but the more I drive it, the more you realise it too is a compromise. Excellent most of the time in the dry, but ultimately just a little bit too stiff for our bumpier B roads, the front end is definitely too stiff in the wet.
anonymous said:
[redacted]
That may be right in terms of what they are willing initially to cough up. But, on the face of it, they're liable for the replacement and refitting costs. If you're relying on a goodwill gesture, though, the manufacturer is the best bet (as they have the reputation to uphold).
Lessons learned for everyone about buying kits, I expect.
I spoke to the Citzens advice bureau about a set of tyres that wore ridiculously quickly. The legal stand point was the the supplying and fitting garage had the responsibility in the first instance and then they could take it up with the manufacturer.
I went down this route and got the replacement set at cost (compromise as I had got some use out of them) with free fitting.
The garage then dealt with the manufacturer to resolve their expenses.
I went down this route and got the replacement set at cost (compromise as I had got some use out of them) with free fitting.
The garage then dealt with the manufacturer to resolve their expenses.
E36 sounds like my ideal spec - what BMWs "clubsport" E46 should have been
If E36s weren't pretty much all nedded / rusted to death, I'd consider. That or a 9*6 of some bargain persuasion, season with tweaks and use as intended (i.e. extensively, enthusiastically but with care) =
All that said, the 987 Croc still represents the best of all worlds as a daily usable sports car for tin-top fans...
Very sad, as Jeremy says, it would be a prime opportunity for Bilstein or Eibach to go "noooo, this never happens, but let's get it in and take a look on the off chance".
You're probably right about Gaz - they're not perfect products, but were a damn sight more helpful to my MX5 driving friend who bought a second hand (albeit never actually used) set of coil overs with incorrectly specced front springs. We did end up getting them made elsewhere in the end, but they didn't dismiss the whole thing out of hand. And for the price, you cannot complain.
What you need now, is Öhlins to sense a PR coup and take pity upon you, and fire a set of nice R&T in your direction. I'm sure you'd not be too downhearted then!
You're probably right about Gaz - they're not perfect products, but were a damn sight more helpful to my MX5 driving friend who bought a second hand (albeit never actually used) set of coil overs with incorrectly specced front springs. We did end up getting them made elsewhere in the end, but they didn't dismiss the whole thing out of hand. And for the price, you cannot complain.
What you need now, is Öhlins to sense a PR coup and take pity upon you, and fire a set of nice R&T in your direction. I'm sure you'd not be too downhearted then!
bgunn said:
What you need now, is Öhlins to sense a PR coup and take pity upon you, and fire a set of nice R&T in your direction. I'm sure you'd not be too downhearted then!
Was that an airborne schwein I just saw ..... ????I suggested speaking to Chris F at CG with good reason. Firstly to establish whether this is a problem he's experienced previously (and thus doesn't use said kit anymore) but also because he has close links to both Bilstein and Eibach. Both are a stone's throw from his workplace and he does a decent amount of business with them. If he considered the product or it's specifications incorrect, rest assured he'd notify one or both the companies (t's in his/the company's nature, this despite him being a very busy individual) and I'd suggest, he'd get a salient response to any such query, rather than being fobbed off.
Furthermore I'm pretty sure they (Bilstein/Eibach) would take the necessary steps to address any issues he'd notified them of. Whether this would ultimately help the OP is a moot point, but if I were in his situation, I'd be pursuing ALL the available options.
Slippydiff said:
Was that an airborne schwein I just saw ..... ????
Ja!Slippydiff said:
I suggested speaking to Chris F at CG with good reason. Firstly to establish whether this is a problem he's experienced previously (and thus doesn't use said kit anymore) but also because he has close links to both Bilstein and Eibach. Both are a stone's throw from his workplace and he does a decent amount of business with them. If he considered the product or it's specifications incorrect, rest assured he'd notify one or both the companies (t's in his/the company's nature, this despite him being a very busy individual) and I'd suggest, he'd get a salient response to any such query, rather than being fobbed off.
Furthermore I'm pretty sure they (Bilstein/Eibach) would take the necessary steps to address any issues he'd notified them of. Whether this would ultimately help the OP is a moot point, but if I were in his situation, I'd be pursuing ALL the available options.
Probably not a bad punt. Good guys there, I'm sure they'd make stuff happen, and/or would have seen things go wrong like that before.Furthermore I'm pretty sure they (Bilstein/Eibach) would take the necessary steps to address any issues he'd notified them of. Whether this would ultimately help the OP is a moot point, but if I were in his situation, I'd be pursuing ALL the available options.
I know when I was up there just before Chrimbo getting my geo done after replacing ALL of my suspension arms, and discussing the future direction of my 996, Pete said "Öhlins - you'd love them" when I was mooting Bilstein PSS10 kits, even. Whether that's personal bias, or good experience, I don't know as I don't know them well enough.
Surprised companies like themselves haven't yet realised the power of good customer services in the days of twitter/facebook and powerful owner group forums.
Recently on 911uk someboddy had major problems with their Dansk back boxes and Dansk were useless, topgear exhausts stepped in with new units for free and gained untold good will and new customers for doing so, cheapest bit of advertising they'll ever get.
Recently on 911uk someboddy had major problems with their Dansk back boxes and Dansk were useless, topgear exhausts stepped in with new units for free and gained untold good will and new customers for doing so, cheapest bit of advertising they'll ever get.
lewisf182 said:
Surprised companies like themselves haven't yet realised the power of good customer services in the days of twitter/facebook and powerful owner group forums.
Recently on 911uk someboddy had major problems with their Dansk back boxes and Dansk were useless, topgear exhausts stepped in with new units for free and gained untold good will and new customers for doing so, cheapest bit of advertising they'll ever get.
This is a good call. Switch all communications to Twitter Moose. Larger Companies get a bit nervous when bad feedback arrives publicly via Twitter. I had an air miles query with Delta which was proving problematic. One tweet and it was sorted.Recently on 911uk someboddy had major problems with their Dansk back boxes and Dansk were useless, topgear exhausts stepped in with new units for free and gained untold good will and new customers for doing so, cheapest bit of advertising they'll ever get.
anonymous said:
[redacted]
As mentioned you've got much more chance of going via the retailer. Send them pics, explain the situation and ask what they suggest.It may be this retailer is Bilsteins biggest, therefore they will have more leverage in getting a solution rather than you bringing Bilstein direct. I work for an Auto component manufacturer and if one of our big retailers ring up with an issue we try and find a solution quick.
bgunn said:
Probably not a bad punt. Good guys there, I'm sure they'd make stuff happen, and/or would have seen things go wrong like that before.
I know when I was up there just before Chrimbo getting my geo done after replacing ALL of my suspension arms, and discussing the future direction of my 996, Pete said "Öhlins - you'd love them" when I was mooting Bilstein PSS10 kits, even. Whether that's personal bias, or good experience, I don't know as I don't know them well enough.
Even at the same price point, I suspect the Ohlins will be a superior product to the Bilsteins PSS10's.I know when I was up there just before Chrimbo getting my geo done after replacing ALL of my suspension arms, and discussing the future direction of my 996, Pete said "Öhlins - you'd love them" when I was mooting Bilstein PSS10 kits, even. Whether that's personal bias, or good experience, I don't know as I don't know them well enough.
Having run the PSS9's on a Mk 1 GT3 (which the OP has driven) albeit a rather custom built kit using off the shelf PSS9 dampers with spring rates better suited to the slightly heavier GT2, they were definitely an improvement over the standard fit Bilsteins.
What was noticeable when I came to tweak the settings, was how little diffference there was in compression and rebound from full stiff to full soft, in fact disappointingly so.
My contact at Ohlins tells me this isn't the case with the R&T kit.
The OP had every reason to think that the kit he purchased would be pretty much the perfect compromise from a cost/usability/performance perspective. It's only a shame the damper manufacturer and/or the spring manufacturer aren't willing to address his concerns in a professional manner.
I'd be livid, and tell them I'm not going away until the issue has been properly sorted, AND that I'm hiring a loan car (which they'll be billed for until the car is returned with the correct springs at a sensible ride height) but then I CAN be a belligerent git when it suits me...
Bilstein have their own workshop facilities (or certainly used to) to enable them to remove and fit kits to their development cars, they need to use it...
I found the TÜV approval bumf that accompany's the 987 3.4L B12 kit on the Eibach website and it references the EW 72 12 001 VA front springs that are supposed to be rated to support a front axle loading up to 785kg (which compares to the true front axle loading on your car is probably in the 650-700kg? ballpark).
http://www.dvsegmbh.info/PDF/einbau/22017/2299/TU-...
Your picture clearly shows the "72 12 001 VA" code so the logical conclusion must be that Eibach has f****d-up somewhere along the production line and released (a batch of?) springs that were either incorrectly coded, or incorrectly manufactured to the wrong specification.
This batch of under-specced springs will have been sent off down through their distribution channels and it should now be a cause for concern (for Eibach, for Bilstein, their distribution partners/retailers and not least, their end customers!) as the problem is simply not going to go away and highly unlikely to be limited to the single set of springs that you were unlucky enough to get lumbered with.
Eibach need to own this and think about a recall.
http://www.dvsegmbh.info/PDF/einbau/22017/2299/TU-...
Your picture clearly shows the "72 12 001 VA" code so the logical conclusion must be that Eibach has f****d-up somewhere along the production line and released (a batch of?) springs that were either incorrectly coded, or incorrectly manufactured to the wrong specification.
This batch of under-specced springs will have been sent off down through their distribution channels and it should now be a cause for concern (for Eibach, for Bilstein, their distribution partners/retailers and not least, their end customers!) as the problem is simply not going to go away and highly unlikely to be limited to the single set of springs that you were unlucky enough to get lumbered with.
Eibach need to own this and think about a recall.
Mogul said:
I found the TÜV approval bumf that accompany's the 987 3.4L B12 kit on the Eibach website and it references the EW 72 12 001 VA front springs that are supposed to be rated to support a front axle loading up to 785kg (which compares to the true front axle loading on your car is probably in the 650-700kg? ballpark).
http://www.dvsegmbh.info/PDF/einbau/22017/2299/TU-...
Your picture clearly shows the "72 12 001 VA" code so the logical conclusion must be that Eibach has f****d-up somewhere along the production line and released (a batch of?) springs that were either incorrectly coded, or incorrectly manufactured to the wrong specification.
This batch of under-specced springs will have been sent off down through their distribution channels and it should now be a cause for concern (for Eibach, for Bilstein, their distribution partners/retailers and not least, their end customers!) as the problem is simply not going to go away and highly unlikely to be limited to the single set of springs that you were unlucky enough to get lumbered with.
Eibach need to own this and think about a recall.
1000 times this.http://www.dvsegmbh.info/PDF/einbau/22017/2299/TU-...
Your picture clearly shows the "72 12 001 VA" code so the logical conclusion must be that Eibach has f****d-up somewhere along the production line and released (a batch of?) springs that were either incorrectly coded, or incorrectly manufactured to the wrong specification.
This batch of under-specced springs will have been sent off down through their distribution channels and it should now be a cause for concern (for Eibach, for Bilstein, their distribution partners/retailers and not least, their end customers!) as the problem is simply not going to go away and highly unlikely to be limited to the single set of springs that you were unlucky enough to get lumbered with.
Eibach need to own this and think about a recall.
As much as my own situation is a cautionary tale , you should not let this drop moose. Either or the B12 kit is complete tosh (hard to believe) or your kit is part of an incorrectly-labelled batch or run of batches (more likely). Quality control absent, manufacturer culpable. Simple as.
Either way, good luck and don't let them get away with it!
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