K20a DC2 Type R - The road to #sub8btg
Discussion
Morning guys.
It's been around for a while now, but as the B18c grew more tired I took the plunge and invested in a new engine for my DC2.
The engine is quite simply a DC5 engine from the later Integra, which makes around 220ps in standard form. Mine has an upgraded intake manifold from a Civic FD2 (RRC), a 3" exhaust system and has been tuned with Hondata. Power is around 240bhp, up from 200 or so from the B18c.
The immediate response from most is just how expensive that 40bhp cost me. You get your Golf GTI remapped and you'll probably enjoy a 40bhp increase for around £300. The conversion all together was around £5k, which when you do the old man maths of £/bhp, it's a cool £125 per horsepower.
So was it worth it? Most definitely.
I didn't take many pictures along the way, I chose to make a little video on the swap instead, of which you can see here if you're interested: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=18lD85lrSLo
Here are a few pictures that I did get, my engine bay before we pulled it to pieces:
Engine out:
The engine bay was a right state due to me painting it with underseal a few years ago. As the engine was out it was time to get it painted.
Better.
New engine:
(you'll have to excuse the Instagram filters on the next few)
The car was finished just a day before I was due to leave for the Nurburgring. When I say finished, it was brought to a state where it would work, but there were a few cosmetic things that I didn't get to finish in time and a bit of wiring that could have done with tidying up, but it worked!
The first test drive was incredible. I couldn't believe the pace in which the car now had. We weighed the car and it was 1020kg, with about a quarter tank of fuel. The BHP/tonne figure then had now gone from around 200bhp/tonne to 240bhp/tonne. This now gives me the straight line pace of something like an M3 or an RS4, but with the added benefit of being lightweight, I should be able to easily outpace on one a circuit. Before the swap these kind of cars would leave me on the straights, but I'd always catch them pretty easily around the bends. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ibwB2OfpOsc first drive video
So, off we went to the Nurburgring. I drove the car there without a problem. When I went to do my first lap, this is how I finished it.
Integra Bongard by Kurt Blythman, on Flickr
Integra Bongard by Kurt Blythman, on Flickr
Yeah, that sucked.
In short (that's a pun but we'll get to that), my O2 sensor wiring had snagged on the chassis where it enters the car and grounded the wire out, blowing the fuse.
My fault entirely, but oh well. An oversight, and hindsight is a wonderful thing. 366 euros later I had the car back and got it fixed.
The rest of the weekend was manic. The 'ring was the busiest I'd ever seen. The queue to get off...
When Monday came, our day to leave, the weather was clear and the track was reportedly great. I'd put my road tyres back on and packed up ready to go home (our ferry was at 2pm). My best lap before the morning was around 8:30, which I wasn't at all happy with. I thought to hell with it, and stayed for the morning. After a few laps, I was able to put in a 8:04!
Honda Integra by Kurt Blythman, on Flickr
Honda Integra by Kurt Blythman, on Flickr
Not quite under 8, but now I know it can definitely be done!
Here's the video for anyone interested: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pTpTxGyVUJc
The drive home was interesting... see the thread asking about speeding fines in France.
750 euro, b
ds!
It was an expensive trip, but the car did very well, and I'm more than happy with the swap.
The car is now going under a bit of a make over, as you can see from the above pictures the exterior is mighty scabby now. New bonnet, wings, bumper, headlights, and a bit of paint are going to be added.
I'll get some pictures up when all that's done.
Cheers.
Dan
It's been around for a while now, but as the B18c grew more tired I took the plunge and invested in a new engine for my DC2.
The engine is quite simply a DC5 engine from the later Integra, which makes around 220ps in standard form. Mine has an upgraded intake manifold from a Civic FD2 (RRC), a 3" exhaust system and has been tuned with Hondata. Power is around 240bhp, up from 200 or so from the B18c.
The immediate response from most is just how expensive that 40bhp cost me. You get your Golf GTI remapped and you'll probably enjoy a 40bhp increase for around £300. The conversion all together was around £5k, which when you do the old man maths of £/bhp, it's a cool £125 per horsepower.
So was it worth it? Most definitely.
I didn't take many pictures along the way, I chose to make a little video on the swap instead, of which you can see here if you're interested: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=18lD85lrSLo
Here are a few pictures that I did get, my engine bay before we pulled it to pieces:
Engine out:
The engine bay was a right state due to me painting it with underseal a few years ago. As the engine was out it was time to get it painted.
Better.
New engine:
(you'll have to excuse the Instagram filters on the next few)
The car was finished just a day before I was due to leave for the Nurburgring. When I say finished, it was brought to a state where it would work, but there were a few cosmetic things that I didn't get to finish in time and a bit of wiring that could have done with tidying up, but it worked!
The first test drive was incredible. I couldn't believe the pace in which the car now had. We weighed the car and it was 1020kg, with about a quarter tank of fuel. The BHP/tonne figure then had now gone from around 200bhp/tonne to 240bhp/tonne. This now gives me the straight line pace of something like an M3 or an RS4, but with the added benefit of being lightweight, I should be able to easily outpace on one a circuit. Before the swap these kind of cars would leave me on the straights, but I'd always catch them pretty easily around the bends. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ibwB2OfpOsc first drive video
So, off we went to the Nurburgring. I drove the car there without a problem. When I went to do my first lap, this is how I finished it.
Integra Bongard by Kurt Blythman, on FlickrIntegra Bongard by Kurt Blythman, on FlickrYeah, that sucked.
In short (that's a pun but we'll get to that), my O2 sensor wiring had snagged on the chassis where it enters the car and grounded the wire out, blowing the fuse.
My fault entirely, but oh well. An oversight, and hindsight is a wonderful thing. 366 euros later I had the car back and got it fixed.
The rest of the weekend was manic. The 'ring was the busiest I'd ever seen. The queue to get off...
When Monday came, our day to leave, the weather was clear and the track was reportedly great. I'd put my road tyres back on and packed up ready to go home (our ferry was at 2pm). My best lap before the morning was around 8:30, which I wasn't at all happy with. I thought to hell with it, and stayed for the morning. After a few laps, I was able to put in a 8:04!
Honda Integra by Kurt Blythman, on FlickrHonda Integra by Kurt Blythman, on FlickrNot quite under 8, but now I know it can definitely be done!
Here's the video for anyone interested: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pTpTxGyVUJc
The drive home was interesting... see the thread asking about speeding fines in France.
750 euro, b
ds! It was an expensive trip, but the car did very well, and I'm more than happy with the swap.
The car is now going under a bit of a make over, as you can see from the above pictures the exterior is mighty scabby now. New bonnet, wings, bumper, headlights, and a bit of paint are going to be added.
I'll get some pictures up when all that's done.
Cheers.
Dan
Edited by dannyDC2 on Friday 30th October 09:48
Do they let you on normal days with a cage? Thought I heard somewhere about a rule change last year and that they only let Porsches with factory fit ones on.
Impressive save at 5:45, good it didn't phase you and reduce pace afterwards. Wonder what the Ferrari driver must be thinking about being harried by a Renault Clio then you walking him straight after.
Impressive save at 5:45, good it didn't phase you and reduce pace afterwards. Wonder what the Ferrari driver must be thinking about being harried by a Renault Clio then you walking him straight after.
untakenname said:
Do they let you on normal days with a cage? Thought I heard somewhere about a rule change last year and that they only let Porsches with factory fit ones on.
Impressive save at 5:45, good it didn't phase you and reduce pace afterwards. Wonder what the Ferrari driver must be thinking about being harried by a Renault Clio then you walking him straight after.
Cages are no problem, they have known to be particular about double door bars though but my mate got away with it this time. Impressive save at 5:45, good it didn't phase you and reduce pace afterwards. Wonder what the Ferrari driver must be thinking about being harried by a Renault Clio then you walking him straight after.
One of my friends got turned away due to his large rear spoiler on an Integra which the marshalls didn't like. Interestingly enough a 350z with the same spoiler was allowed on...
The rules are supposed to be German road rules, but they seem to be very grey areas.
The Ferraris are never fast at the 'ring, you can kinda understand but then again theres 4.0 GT3RS's blasting around at daft pace too
stuart-b said:
I'm so jealous, only in a Honda is this possible.
My N54T is up to 130c oil temp after not a lot of effort...
The K20a runs so cool compared to the B18c I had previously. I think this is partly down to running a Spoon cool thermostat (opens at 70c). On the motorway my oil temperature barely hits 70c, on the B18 it would sit at around 95c. Oil usage is way down too, probably due to this! My N54T is up to 130c oil temp after not a lot of effort...
I run a 19 row Mocal oil cooler too that opens its thermostat at around 70c.
Awesome car! I totally agree the K20 is worth the outlay, a great high RPM engine coupled with a sublime 6 speed box! I am currently just trying to decide what chassis to put one in. I did a K20 supercharged Prelude a few years back, it was great but I totally miss the induction roar and especially the sound of the VTEC transition! I am currently considering a DC2 build like yours or a second gen CRX (not the rounded one).
I see a lot of people build these with the off the shelf engine mounts, are they rock solid? I had a 'soft' aftermarket rubber mount on one of my custom engine mounts and it was enough to shake the car at idle and rattle anything just a little on the lose side! In the end I remade the engine mounts using all the OEM rubbers.
What are you doing about your lack of power steering and the MOT?
I see a lot of people build these with the off the shelf engine mounts, are they rock solid? I had a 'soft' aftermarket rubber mount on one of my custom engine mounts and it was enough to shake the car at idle and rattle anything just a little on the lose side! In the end I remade the engine mounts using all the OEM rubbers.
What are you doing about your lack of power steering and the MOT?
Mudgey said:
Awesome car! I totally agree the K20 is worth the outlay, a great high RPM engine coupled with a sublime 6 speed box! I am currently just trying to decide what chassis to put one in. I did a K20 supercharged Prelude a few years back, it was great but I totally miss the induction roar and especially the sound of the VTEC transition! I am currently considering a DC2 build like yours or a second gen CRX (not the rounded one).
I see a lot of people build these with the off the shelf engine mounts, are they rock solid? I had a 'soft' aftermarket rubber mount on one of my custom engine mounts and it was enough to shake the car at idle and rattle anything just a little on the lose side! In the end I remade the engine mounts using all the OEM rubbers.
What are you doing about your lack of power steering and the MOT?
My engine mounts are 62a, which to be honest isn't really enough. My old B series mounts were 75a and they were fairly perfect. 62a is still stiff don't get me wrong, but I do think I'll be putting stiffer ones in. I see a lot of people build these with the off the shelf engine mounts, are they rock solid? I had a 'soft' aftermarket rubber mount on one of my custom engine mounts and it was enough to shake the car at idle and rattle anything just a little on the lose side! In the end I remade the engine mounts using all the OEM rubbers.
What are you doing about your lack of power steering and the MOT?
Is power steering an MOT requirement? I've never had a problem. That said it passed with a lot of things that were not strictly legal last time..
Mudgey said:
Awesome car! I totally agree the K20 is worth the outlay, a great high RPM engine coupled with a sublime 6 speed box! I am currently just trying to decide what chassis to put one in. I did a K20 supercharged Prelude a few years back, it was great but I totally miss the induction roar and especially the sound of the VTEC transition! I am currently considering a DC2 build like yours or a second gen CRX (not the rounded one).
I see a lot of people build these with the off the shelf engine mounts, are they rock solid? I had a 'soft' aftermarket rubber mount on one of my custom engine mounts and it was enough to shake the car at idle and rattle anything just a little on the lose side! In the end I remade the engine mounts using all the OEM rubbers.
What are you doing about your lack of power steering and the MOT?
Rover 45. It's a DC2 underneath that can be bought for a couple of hundred pounds.I see a lot of people build these with the off the shelf engine mounts, are they rock solid? I had a 'soft' aftermarket rubber mount on one of my custom engine mounts and it was enough to shake the car at idle and rattle anything just a little on the lose side! In the end I remade the engine mounts using all the OEM rubbers.
What are you doing about your lack of power steering and the MOT?
You will be my hero if you do this.
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