1983 Citroen BX 16TRS - For the love of cars!
Discussion
Word of advice if you ever get the part where you have removed the bearing race blasted tape the metal up with duct tape.... You do not want to blast the seat area - it gives rise to quite a lot of play which can't initially be explained.
I tend to leave the seats or bearings in and then pull em out after blasting
Ps jolly good work nice to see an update
I tend to leave the seats or bearings in and then pull em out after blasting
Ps jolly good work nice to see an update
Shadow R1 said:
That bearing arrangement looks like a steering head on a R1, I use a similar puller to get the race's out of the frame.
Have to remember that one next time someone asks me where the hell I can get bearings for the front of a very early Citroen BX 
BigTom85 said:
Great update.
Keep the momentum going now chap
Cheers. I want to drive it next year to a car meet of some sort, so that's my motivation.Keep the momentum going now chap
B'stard Child said:
Word of advice if you ever get the part where you have removed the bearing race blasted tape the metal up with duct tape.... You do not want to blast the seat area - it gives rise to quite a lot of play which can't initially be explained.
I tend to leave the seats or bearings in and then pull em out after blasting
Ps jolly good work nice to see an update
Cheers for the advice. I've actually already thought along those lines, as I was worried I'd alter the tolerances when I have it dip-galvanised (I want this subframe to last forever!) The solution is actually to push the outer races back in, so they cover the section they press in to. I removed them more to make sure they'd actually come out.I tend to leave the seats or bearings in and then pull em out after blasting
Ps jolly good work nice to see an update
I'll fit some grease nipples too, and then fill the whole tube with grease once it's all painted etc.
Super interesting read as usual.
Your threads are dangerous to me though as I am a similar age to you and my dad inflicted a shed load of these wobbly Citroen on our family.
2 x 1.4 BX leaders one a C reg one a D (his and hers owned at one time!)
1 x 1.4 BX TGE on a H plate (Had leccy windows and newer interior with blinds in the back!)
A GSA when I was very young.
And finally a Diesel Xantia. Might have had two I cannot remember as I had left home by that point.
Never got a XM though which I am still sore about
One day I will get a wafty Citroen, one day...
Your threads are dangerous to me though as I am a similar age to you and my dad inflicted a shed load of these wobbly Citroen on our family.
2 x 1.4 BX leaders one a C reg one a D (his and hers owned at one time!)
1 x 1.4 BX TGE on a H plate (Had leccy windows and newer interior with blinds in the back!)
A GSA when I was very young.
And finally a Diesel Xantia. Might have had two I cannot remember as I had left home by that point.
Never got a XM though which I am still sore about
One day I will get a wafty Citroen, one day...
bungz said:
Super interesting read as usual.
Your threads are dangerous to me though as I am a similar age to you and my dad inflicted a shed load of these wobbly Citroen on our family.
2 x 1.4 BX leaders one a C reg one a D (his and hers owned at one time!)
1 x 1.4 BX TGE on a H plate (Had leccy windows and newer interior with blinds in the back!)
A GSA when I was very young.
And finally a Diesel Xantia. Might have had two I cannot remember as I had left home by that point.
Never got a XM though which I am still sore about
One day I will get a wafty Citroen, one day...
Life's too short not to Your threads are dangerous to me though as I am a similar age to you and my dad inflicted a shed load of these wobbly Citroen on our family.
2 x 1.4 BX leaders one a C reg one a D (his and hers owned at one time!)
1 x 1.4 BX TGE on a H plate (Had leccy windows and newer interior with blinds in the back!)
A GSA when I was very young.
And finally a Diesel Xantia. Might have had two I cannot remember as I had left home by that point.
Never got a XM though which I am still sore about
One day I will get a wafty Citroen, one day...
Kitchski said:
B'stard Child said:
Word of advice if you ever get the part where you have removed the bearing race blasted tape the metal up with duct tape.... You do not want to blast the seat area - it gives rise to quite a lot of play which can't initially be explained.
I tend to leave the seats or bearings in and then pull em out after blasting
Ps jolly good work nice to see an update
Cheers for the advice. I've actually already thought along those lines, as I was worried I'd alter the tolerances when I have it dip-galvanised (I want this subframe to last forever!) The solution is actually to push the outer races back in, so they cover the section they press in to. I removed them more to make sure they'd actually come out.I tend to leave the seats or bearings in and then pull em out after blasting
Ps jolly good work nice to see an update
I'll fit some grease nipples too, and then fill the whole tube with grease once it's all painted etc.
On my track car I got fed up with rust appearing on the very vulnerable front subframe and lower wishbones - airfield circuits (lots of stones) they get shot blasted
I had them hot zinc galvanised - even when the powder coat gets chipped off there is still no rust and it's not even that expensive to get done but 10 years and still no rust on the front arms - amazing considering most of the powder coat is now missing on the front facing side!!!!
Inside the arms and sub frame - I just used a cavity wax to coat everything
A couple of weeks ago I set about recycling this thread onto another forum, and in doing so had to go through each image and 'un-photobucket' it. So now, all done!
A renewed bout of BX enthusiasm (having watched the 'Blaze' channel last night) finds me at the computer, updating a BX thread. Last week was a momentous week, because I actually did something on the TRS! The last work pictured here was from 2016, and then I managed to do some jobs in 2017 (but not many), so I'll update those before the tiny amount of 2018 I managed last Tuesday evening.
The piffling amount of labour I managed to muster in 2017 revolved around the subframe, plus one or two other small bits. First, I'll start with the last of 2016, which was...
Wheels! If you remember (it was a long time ago, after all) I sent my wheel rims away to be acid dipped so I could work on them, and our grit blaster provided a source of amusement to the original paint coating on the BX's steel rims. I was particularly keen to save these wheels, because not only are they original (like pretty much everything on the car!), they are actually date stamped 1983. If I'm going to dick around trying to put this car back on the road while preserving as much as possible, changing the wheels would be a massive no-no.
When the wheels came back, I was informed they'd also been coated just to stop them rusting again. This was a thoughtful touch, though if I'm honest it completely screwed my plans! They did look good though:
However, up close, the pitting is plain to see, and I'll need to get creative with a welder to plug these holes up:
...because these rims will be about as air-tight as I am:
This creates a slight issue, because they've actually been powdercoated. I wanted to galvanise the rims to prevent them rusting again, and powdercoat is not going to do that. And I can't shot blast them myself, because......well, it's a bit of a circle. I'll decide what to do here, but I may just have to forgo the galvanising I ideally craved. At least the wheels have been sat upstairs for the last million years since I did anything!
I also tried a trick that I'd been reading about for just as long, but never had. A hot-air gun! Specifically, a hot-air gun pointed at some very pink bumpers in an attempt to make them less pink. 10mins on the rear corner brought about this:
I'd call that a success! And no, those wheels aren't staying on the car. They'd be a periodically correct accessory (or should that be 'accessorie') for the TRS, but alas they were borrowed from the GT to wheel it up onto the dolly. I won't do the rest of the bumpers for now, as they're pretty badly stained and need a good scrub first.
I also bought a brand new, old stock rev counter on eBay for the princely sum of £10. The rev counter in the TRS doesn't work, and while it's likely to be something wiring-related, rather than a failed 17k mile old component, I thought it'd look nice in a cabinet even if I never needed it:
So, that was the end of 2016. But what did 2017 bring?
Well, unsurprisingly it was back to the subframe. And that - even more unsurprisingly - had rusted a bit more!
Repairs were still underway though, and that was a positive not to be sniffed at. So much of getting through projects like this is about keeping your pecker up (in a manner of speaking). You have to stay happy and positive, because when you're down and grumpy, you get little done (and anything you do get done tends to be hashed and rushed). So quality over quantity, every time, and at least the repairs are going well on the subframe.
I did decide not to use the cracked 300k donor subframe, though, as I found it wasn't actually in very good condition under all the muck. A low-mileage, rust-free unit off a TZD Turbo popped up on a BX forum for £50 (that crucially, had been steam cleaned, which was worth the £50 alone!):
I set about harvesting the required bits from that instead:
And shot-blasted the various bits I needed so they could be fitted to the TRS subframe:
There's no way I could have made that single piece in less than 3 attempts and 3 months!
Now, some of you will be asking "That's all very well and good you BX-loving freak, but how are you going to maintain the alignment?!" Ah, I'm one step ahead of the question I just imagined you asking there!
I made a jig:
Which when fitted to a subframe, looks like:
Other than taking this picture....:
...and moving the TRS to the other side of the workshop, I did nothing else on it in 2017. Slow times!
2018 hasn't started with much gusto, either! However, on Tuesday, I continued with the subframe rebuild, and when I get 5 mins, I'll upload the pics and hoist them up
A renewed bout of BX enthusiasm (having watched the 'Blaze' channel last night) finds me at the computer, updating a BX thread. Last week was a momentous week, because I actually did something on the TRS! The last work pictured here was from 2016, and then I managed to do some jobs in 2017 (but not many), so I'll update those before the tiny amount of 2018 I managed last Tuesday evening.
The piffling amount of labour I managed to muster in 2017 revolved around the subframe, plus one or two other small bits. First, I'll start with the last of 2016, which was...
Wheels! If you remember (it was a long time ago, after all) I sent my wheel rims away to be acid dipped so I could work on them, and our grit blaster provided a source of amusement to the original paint coating on the BX's steel rims. I was particularly keen to save these wheels, because not only are they original (like pretty much everything on the car!), they are actually date stamped 1983. If I'm going to dick around trying to put this car back on the road while preserving as much as possible, changing the wheels would be a massive no-no.
When the wheels came back, I was informed they'd also been coated just to stop them rusting again. This was a thoughtful touch, though if I'm honest it completely screwed my plans! They did look good though:
However, up close, the pitting is plain to see, and I'll need to get creative with a welder to plug these holes up:
...because these rims will be about as air-tight as I am:
This creates a slight issue, because they've actually been powdercoated. I wanted to galvanise the rims to prevent them rusting again, and powdercoat is not going to do that. And I can't shot blast them myself, because......well, it's a bit of a circle. I'll decide what to do here, but I may just have to forgo the galvanising I ideally craved. At least the wheels have been sat upstairs for the last million years since I did anything!
I also tried a trick that I'd been reading about for just as long, but never had. A hot-air gun! Specifically, a hot-air gun pointed at some very pink bumpers in an attempt to make them less pink. 10mins on the rear corner brought about this:
I'd call that a success! And no, those wheels aren't staying on the car. They'd be a periodically correct accessory (or should that be 'accessorie') for the TRS, but alas they were borrowed from the GT to wheel it up onto the dolly. I won't do the rest of the bumpers for now, as they're pretty badly stained and need a good scrub first.
I also bought a brand new, old stock rev counter on eBay for the princely sum of £10. The rev counter in the TRS doesn't work, and while it's likely to be something wiring-related, rather than a failed 17k mile old component, I thought it'd look nice in a cabinet even if I never needed it:
So, that was the end of 2016. But what did 2017 bring?
Well, unsurprisingly it was back to the subframe. And that - even more unsurprisingly - had rusted a bit more!
Repairs were still underway though, and that was a positive not to be sniffed at. So much of getting through projects like this is about keeping your pecker up (in a manner of speaking). You have to stay happy and positive, because when you're down and grumpy, you get little done (and anything you do get done tends to be hashed and rushed). So quality over quantity, every time, and at least the repairs are going well on the subframe.
I did decide not to use the cracked 300k donor subframe, though, as I found it wasn't actually in very good condition under all the muck. A low-mileage, rust-free unit off a TZD Turbo popped up on a BX forum for £50 (that crucially, had been steam cleaned, which was worth the £50 alone!):
I set about harvesting the required bits from that instead:
And shot-blasted the various bits I needed so they could be fitted to the TRS subframe:
There's no way I could have made that single piece in less than 3 attempts and 3 months!
Now, some of you will be asking "That's all very well and good you BX-loving freak, but how are you going to maintain the alignment?!" Ah, I'm one step ahead of the question I just imagined you asking there!
I made a jig:
Which when fitted to a subframe, looks like:
Other than taking this picture....:
...and moving the TRS to the other side of the workshop, I did nothing else on it in 2017. Slow times!
2018 hasn't started with much gusto, either! However, on Tuesday, I continued with the subframe rebuild, and when I get 5 mins, I'll upload the pics and hoist them up
The latest update brings us bang up-to-date with unloved-by-my-family-and-friends-but-two-s
ts-I-give-not-because-I-love-it BX proceedings.
I bought a DSLR camera. How canz u tel?:
It's a continuation on the theme, and the theme is subframe! Progress is progress though, and this is how the subframe currently sits...clamped up and ready to start rebuilding:
And, erm, three puddle welds later:
Hey, at least it's starting to look like a subframe again:
OK, I didn't say I got loads done. I did take some pics of future work though...
Yeeeeaaahhh! Loads of work. Love it! Honestly, I don't really want the free time anyway....
Subframe continues this week, amongst loads of other jobs. I reckon I could get it done and ready for coating by the end of the week. Reckon I'll do it?
I don't...
ts-I-give-not-because-I-love-it BX proceedings.I bought a DSLR camera. How canz u tel?:
It's a continuation on the theme, and the theme is subframe! Progress is progress though, and this is how the subframe currently sits...clamped up and ready to start rebuilding:
And, erm, three puddle welds later:
Hey, at least it's starting to look like a subframe again:
OK, I didn't say I got loads done. I did take some pics of future work though...
Yeeeeaaahhh! Loads of work. Love it! Honestly, I don't really want the free time anyway....
Subframe continues this week, amongst loads of other jobs. I reckon I could get it done and ready for coating by the end of the week. Reckon I'll do it?
I don't...
No progress on the freakishy-low mileage BX to speak of. Not physical progress anyway.
But there is progress of a mental-variety. "Such as what?".....asked no one.
Well, a guy I know posts Youtube videos under the channel name 'Hub Nut'. You can find the channel here:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCfxlBQnvNXX6o-2Kb...
One of the more recent videos he did was a mini-series on taking a broken Invacar (yup....an actual Invacar) and fixing it up so it can be returned to the road. The finishing line for this project to cross, was to complete the work and drive the car to the 'Festival of the Unexceptional' (which is a festival I REALLY should have gone to by now). Bearing in mind that he lives in Wales, and the festival near Northampton (I think), that's quite the effort in itself.
(He did manage it BTW: https://youtu.be/eM7q3uYkxnI)
I've always enjoyed the idea of heaping even more pressure and time-constraints on my already time-sapping lifestyle (nothing exciting, just a business and a young family), so it seems like the ideal challenge! I want to get the BX TRS ready for next year's FOTU. And I already have confirmation that such a BX would be acceptable, as this very car here....
....was present this year (though it didn't feature in Ian's video).
I've also decided - sorry, there are no pictures to share here, this is just rambling - that I want to try and keep the BX as original as possible. It's so painfully unaltered from 1983 that I think it'd be a shame to take it to bits to renew anything that isn't completely necessary. It does mean it's going to look slightly on the 'dogged' side more than I'd intended, but I think these days with so much motors from the 80s coming out of the woodwork, that trying to preserve one as it actually was in the 80's is the way forwards, so to that end, I'll only change what actually needs changing. Ripped seats, bubbled wheel arches, faded parcel shelf.....it'll likely all stay. I want it driving mechanically well, and for the most part it'll still look OK enough, as the paint is surprisingly un-faded. The car in the show above, while very nice, didn't look original to my eyes (because it isn't, as the owner would freely admit! He's put a lot into it).
So yeah, work will continue (along with the GT, which is painfully behind schedule) and I'm now aiming for the Festival of the Unexceptional 2019 as the deadline for it.
That's if they host one, of course....
But there is progress of a mental-variety. "Such as what?".....asked no one.
Well, a guy I know posts Youtube videos under the channel name 'Hub Nut'. You can find the channel here:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCfxlBQnvNXX6o-2Kb...
One of the more recent videos he did was a mini-series on taking a broken Invacar (yup....an actual Invacar) and fixing it up so it can be returned to the road. The finishing line for this project to cross, was to complete the work and drive the car to the 'Festival of the Unexceptional' (which is a festival I REALLY should have gone to by now). Bearing in mind that he lives in Wales, and the festival near Northampton (I think), that's quite the effort in itself.
(He did manage it BTW: https://youtu.be/eM7q3uYkxnI)
I've always enjoyed the idea of heaping even more pressure and time-constraints on my already time-sapping lifestyle (nothing exciting, just a business and a young family), so it seems like the ideal challenge! I want to get the BX TRS ready for next year's FOTU. And I already have confirmation that such a BX would be acceptable, as this very car here....
....was present this year (though it didn't feature in Ian's video).
I've also decided - sorry, there are no pictures to share here, this is just rambling - that I want to try and keep the BX as original as possible. It's so painfully unaltered from 1983 that I think it'd be a shame to take it to bits to renew anything that isn't completely necessary. It does mean it's going to look slightly on the 'dogged' side more than I'd intended, but I think these days with so much motors from the 80s coming out of the woodwork, that trying to preserve one as it actually was in the 80's is the way forwards, so to that end, I'll only change what actually needs changing. Ripped seats, bubbled wheel arches, faded parcel shelf.....it'll likely all stay. I want it driving mechanically well, and for the most part it'll still look OK enough, as the paint is surprisingly un-faded. The car in the show above, while very nice, didn't look original to my eyes (because it isn't, as the owner would freely admit! He's put a lot into it).
So yeah, work will continue (along with the GT, which is painfully behind schedule) and I'm now aiming for the Festival of the Unexceptional 2019 as the deadline for it.
That's if they host one, of course....
Edited by Kitchski on Thursday 13th September 13:36
I get what you mean about having a car that looks honest. Some cars loose that bit of magic after a respray and refurb.
Mechanically sound and largely original is a completely different thing to as new and had its own appeal.
Although I hate rust and bubbling arches but I guess you are in a position to nip that in the bud if it ever looks to be taking liberties.
Mechanically sound and largely original is a completely different thing to as new and had its own appeal.
Although I hate rust and bubbling arches but I guess you are in a position to nip that in the bud if it ever looks to be taking liberties.
bungz said:
I get what you mean about having a car that looks honest. Some cars loose that bit of magic after a respray and refurb.
Mechanically sound and largely original is a completely different thing to as new and had its own appeal.
Although I hate rust and bubbling arches but I guess you are in a position to nip that in the bud if it ever looks to be taking liberties.
Absolutely. Really don't want to lose the factory-fresh appeal of it, so will be removing as little as possible. I'll have to address the rust though!Mechanically sound and largely original is a completely different thing to as new and had its own appeal.
Although I hate rust and bubbling arches but I guess you are in a position to nip that in the bud if it ever looks to be taking liberties.
BigTrak79 said:
My first car was a B reg BX back in 1996. It leaked hydraulic fluid, had a weird speedo and people laughed but I bloody loved that car. Good read, thanks 
Yeah, I love them too! They were a bit of a laughing stock back in the 90s admittedly. My first car was also a BX (I know, quelle surprise). A cream-coloured 14RE from 1989.W00DY said:
I love an early BX and yours will be great! Keep up the good work.
I hope so, and I'll try!Happy to report the BX TRS is trickling along. I wouldn't go as far as to say it's beating along at a decent rate of knots, but nor is it a static exhibit. Well....the car is, but the subframe - which I've been working on since what feels like the Bronze Age - isn't.
Following on from my pics above, the new O/S spar was grafted in from the donor subframe (a turbodiesel model...I think. It's a mk2, anyway).
Originally I wanted to get it dip-galvanised, but I've not found anywhere willing to touch it, because they're all concerned it'll be full of oil and grease (and, oddly enough, it only serves to raise their concerns further when they learn that it's from a 1983 Citroen. Weird!) So I'll be forgoing the zinc, and just going with some heavy-duty protection. To that end, I gave the innards a dusting of paint before assembling/welding. It'll be awhile before it's all painted and sealed inside, so I wanted the raw surfaces to be protected. It'll all burn up in parts, but it's better than nothing.
Then I began putting all the skills collected in Yr2 at school to good use, and started cutting out more card:
....which was then transferred to cutting out metal:
Probably looks a slightly odd shape to be cutting out, but there is method in the madness:
Then it was time to get my Hamster to chew some holes in it...
And then time to start melting it on (Hamster was unable to assist with this):
You'd never know! (Apart from the ground-down welds, difference in finish of the two metals and 'hand-made' nature of what I'd made):
For the second stage of this (because these pics were taken weeks apart!) we're leaving the relative warmth and satisfaction of DSLR-sourced images, and switching to my phone. Yeah....sorry about that!:
I needed to source further sections from the donor subframe. This piece isn't actually in brilliant condition on the surface, but I just can't fabricate something like that myself, so the aim is to make good with this one:
The chosen piece fits! It's almost like I measured it, or something...:
Once I'd shot-blasted it, it was clear that the corrosion was only lightly on the surface, and that it looked worse than it really was because of the gaping holes I had to drill into it to release it from the big piece of metal Citroen had spot-welded it to (using something slightly more advanced than my MIG welder!):
I'm using the original spot-weld points to assemble the new spar, but the reality is that my puddle welds can't be proven to be as strong as the factory spot-welds (they may well be even stronger, but the issue is that I just don't know). So, belt & braces....I seam-weld around the edge once it's all in place. I can grind this down later so that visually it's no different to the other side (other than the fact it's got bits of mk2 subframe in it, but unless you're a total BX geek, you wouldn't spot that!)
Subframe is really coming along. I've got one more little bit to fabricate and weld in, and then I'll go around the seam on the other side looking for trouble. I may well just seam weld all the way around it for added strength.
Once the metalwork is finished, I'll be ready to paint it before building it back up with new/renewed versions of everything that went on it before. Oh yes, I haven't done any of that yet either....
Following on from my pics above, the new O/S spar was grafted in from the donor subframe (a turbodiesel model...I think. It's a mk2, anyway).
Originally I wanted to get it dip-galvanised, but I've not found anywhere willing to touch it, because they're all concerned it'll be full of oil and grease (and, oddly enough, it only serves to raise their concerns further when they learn that it's from a 1983 Citroen. Weird!) So I'll be forgoing the zinc, and just going with some heavy-duty protection. To that end, I gave the innards a dusting of paint before assembling/welding. It'll be awhile before it's all painted and sealed inside, so I wanted the raw surfaces to be protected. It'll all burn up in parts, but it's better than nothing.
Then I began putting all the skills collected in Yr2 at school to good use, and started cutting out more card:
....which was then transferred to cutting out metal:
Probably looks a slightly odd shape to be cutting out, but there is method in the madness:
Then it was time to get my Hamster to chew some holes in it...
And then time to start melting it on (Hamster was unable to assist with this):
You'd never know! (Apart from the ground-down welds, difference in finish of the two metals and 'hand-made' nature of what I'd made):
For the second stage of this (because these pics were taken weeks apart!) we're leaving the relative warmth and satisfaction of DSLR-sourced images, and switching to my phone. Yeah....sorry about that!:
I needed to source further sections from the donor subframe. This piece isn't actually in brilliant condition on the surface, but I just can't fabricate something like that myself, so the aim is to make good with this one:
The chosen piece fits! It's almost like I measured it, or something...:
Once I'd shot-blasted it, it was clear that the corrosion was only lightly on the surface, and that it looked worse than it really was because of the gaping holes I had to drill into it to release it from the big piece of metal Citroen had spot-welded it to (using something slightly more advanced than my MIG welder!):
I'm using the original spot-weld points to assemble the new spar, but the reality is that my puddle welds can't be proven to be as strong as the factory spot-welds (they may well be even stronger, but the issue is that I just don't know). So, belt & braces....I seam-weld around the edge once it's all in place. I can grind this down later so that visually it's no different to the other side (other than the fact it's got bits of mk2 subframe in it, but unless you're a total BX geek, you wouldn't spot that!)
Subframe is really coming along. I've got one more little bit to fabricate and weld in, and then I'll go around the seam on the other side looking for trouble. I may well just seam weld all the way around it for added strength.
Once the metalwork is finished, I'll be ready to paint it before building it back up with new/renewed versions of everything that went on it before. Oh yes, I haven't done any of that yet either....
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