Minardi PS04B - A Season In BOSS GP (Photo Heavy!)
Discussion
dazzx10r said:
Great thread and a fantastic read, it gives a great insight into what goes into an F1 car. My cousin, Justin Wilson raced the 2003 car, he was team mate to Jos Verstappen. He was tragically killed last year in a freak accident in Indycar.
It's nice to see these cars still being used for what they were intended for, good luck with the next season.
Thank you for the well wishes. These cars are very special to us for a number of reasons but a big one is that due to the fact that Minardi used the same tub for the PS02, PS03 and PS04B one of the cars is the tub your cousin raced. The car which won last weekend at Imola was the car Justin drove in 2003. As a few of us at the "main base" worked with him in FPA and WSN it was very special to win with this car. It's nice to see these cars still being used for what they were intended for, good luck with the next season.
Deadlysub said:
A really fantastic read, it's great that F1 cars from that era can still be raced.
I take it the Avon is a control tyre which all competitors must use?
The Avon is a control tyre in so much as it is the only tyre we can get tyre support on at circuit and have in large enough numbers to support the grids. It has served us well but with the later and later cars coming together it is the limiting factor, as seen by the work we had to do in order to get it to work on the car. I take it the Avon is a control tyre which all competitors must use?
For next year we have a tyre upgrade coming and this will see the cars 2 seconds a lap quicker easily!
turboslippers said:
Great read, thoroughly enjoyed that, thanks!
I was going to ask if these cars were an iteration of the A23 Arrows that my late brother designed front suspension, hubs, uprights etc for but a google shows that the A23s bought by PS were no better than the PSO3 so your cars are the reworked PS03 chassis and not the A23 arrows which internet says were later sold and ran as the Super Aguri cars...
Amazing that you can run any 'modern' F1 car like this. Can only assume that sponsorship and prize money don't come close to running costs and much is just done of love of it. Big thumbs up!
Ben
When PS back to backed the A23 and PS03 it was found both were similar in terms of lap time but the A23 was more fragile hence developing the 03 into the 04B. The A23 did indeed become the SA05 and later the SA06. I was going to ask if these cars were an iteration of the A23 Arrows that my late brother designed front suspension, hubs, uprights etc for but a google shows that the A23s bought by PS were no better than the PSO3 so your cars are the reworked PS03 chassis and not the A23 arrows which internet says were later sold and ran as the Super Aguri cars...
Amazing that you can run any 'modern' F1 car like this. Can only assume that sponsorship and prize money don't come close to running costs and much is just done of love of it. Big thumbs up!
Ben
There is no prize money but the size of the crowds at some events means sponsorship is possible and with next years TV coverage and tyre deal it is starting to look more viable to get closer to cost neutral.
The challenge of running them gets no easier though, people often think these are "simpler" versions of the cars which raced in the day whereas actually they are identical in nearly every way, only we're doing it with a tenth of the budget and 20 rather than 120 people.... oh and pretty much no supplier support!
BOSS has huge potential right now and the team behind it are working very, very hard to get it where it belongs. It is a spectacular championship and there is honestly nothing like it - for those complaining about the lack of noise in F1 come and watch a BOSS GP race where we have everything from 3.5L V6s to 4.2L V12s with quite a few F1 V10s in there with them on the same grid..... with no silencers!
confucuis said:
How fast is the car compared to modern cars OP? Wasn't this generation the fastest ever f1 cars?
We're about 2 seconds off a current F1 due to the tyres we're running. Last weekend the STR1 tested on Pirellis and from looking at the data these tyres would put us close to current F1 times...... not bad with decade old aero! PhillipM said:
Just made the frontpage as Readers Car of the week too!
Second time this year! 
Just to be clear though as the article on the front page implies these cars are mine! These cars don't belong to me/us, I manage the team which supports, develops and races the cars.
A massive thanks should go to the guys who own these cars and race them. With so many people today purchasing rare and/or historic cars such as these and mothballing them as an investment it is beyond fantastic that there are still those who will go through the pain, heartache, fitness and work required to race one of these cars wheel to wheel in a competitive environment. It is not easy in any way and it is physically punishing at the best of times.
To all those racing in BOSS or that have made the investment to maintain a running F1 car for any other use thank you many times over for keeping the skills and the possibility of seeing these cars on circuit and in action alive.
Best Monday morning read ever!
I would have thought your team would be a prime candidate for crowd funding? I am sure there are plenty here on PH who would "chip in" to see these wonderful cars continue.
One question, how do you forsee you coping with the lack of parts, as many of those used are one offs, or limited supply?
Thanks again.
I would have thought your team would be a prime candidate for crowd funding? I am sure there are plenty here on PH who would "chip in" to see these wonderful cars continue.
One question, how do you forsee you coping with the lack of parts, as many of those used are one offs, or limited supply?
Thanks again.
Another great write up Pop, I really enjoy the posts you make.
Do you ever get the chance to have a go in these? Or are the operating costs, or ability required to do so prohibitive?
Like others, I'd love to see the BOSS GP championship come to the UK. I've been to the FIA Historic Masters at Brands Hatch for the last few years. Though this is for earlier cars from the mid 60's to the mid 80's. This is worth a visit, the racing is committed and the access to the pits/cars is excellent.
I look forward to updates!
Do you ever get the chance to have a go in these? Or are the operating costs, or ability required to do so prohibitive?
Like others, I'd love to see the BOSS GP championship come to the UK. I've been to the FIA Historic Masters at Brands Hatch for the last few years. Though this is for earlier cars from the mid 60's to the mid 80's. This is worth a visit, the racing is committed and the access to the pits/cars is excellent.
I look forward to updates!
Fantastically interesting thread. To me the V10 era was the pinnacle of F1: power, revs, noise, driver aids limited to TC and ABS. Don't you just think they look better than the current ones too? I do.
Unlike F1 this series is not much about making money, or 'the business'. Yes paid teams are essential but its about people with the love of it first and foremost. I can't imagine that the recent hybrid cars will be possible to run in the same way in the future due to their inherent complexity so enjoy these now! We should all be grateful that these beasts are still run for the purpose that they were intended.
My F1 V10 race experience is limited to just 11 laps in Spain but I can say that the memory and experience of the first time that rear end bit at full throttle in 2nd is with me almost every day ...in fact I watched the vids again just yesterday! Make no mistake these cars are monsters, and the challenge of running these without the backing of the large operations/budgets of the day cannot be overstated. I think this really comes out in the thread - thanks for sharing.
RD
Unlike F1 this series is not much about making money, or 'the business'. Yes paid teams are essential but its about people with the love of it first and foremost. I can't imagine that the recent hybrid cars will be possible to run in the same way in the future due to their inherent complexity so enjoy these now! We should all be grateful that these beasts are still run for the purpose that they were intended.
My F1 V10 race experience is limited to just 11 laps in Spain but I can say that the memory and experience of the first time that rear end bit at full throttle in 2nd is with me almost every day ...in fact I watched the vids again just yesterday! Make no mistake these cars are monsters, and the challenge of running these without the backing of the large operations/budgets of the day cannot be overstated. I think this really comes out in the thread - thanks for sharing.
RD
Here's a bit of onboard from Quali: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yjl7orvj5IQ bit of slow traffic hurts the laptime but sounding strong at 17.8K none the less 
Unfortunately no race footage as due to delays going to the grid the camera systems had turned itself off by the time moved
Unfortunately no race footage as due to delays going to the grid the camera systems had turned itself off by the time moved
daltonr said:
Fantastically interesting thread. To me the V10 era was the pinnacle of F1: power, revs, noise, driver aids limited to TC and ABS. Don't you just think they look better than the current ones too? I do.
Unlike F1 this series is not much about making money, or 'the business'. Yes paid teams are essential but its about people with the love of it first and foremost. I can't imagine that the recent hybrid cars will be possible to run in the same way in the future due to their inherent complexity so enjoy these now! We should all be grateful that these beasts are still run for the purpose that they were intended.
My F1 V10 race experience is limited to just 11 laps in Spain but I can say that the memory and experience of the first time that rear end bit at full throttle in 2nd is with me almost every day ...in fact I watched the vids again just yesterday! Make no mistake these cars are monsters, and the challenge of running these without the backing of the large operations/budgets of the day cannot be overstated. I think this really comes out in the thread - thanks for sharing.
RD
For me the 2004 cars are the pinacle of F1. They were after all capable of setting the fastest lap times which is rather the point! They are still around a second a lap faster than this years cars even with the far less complex aero and the last or last but one evolution of the V10s was something to behold. Just look at Klaus's R5 on a warmup up: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIx3Cv69reQ or even our old back marker: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5-hYpZDlwDk not only that they were to my eye far pretier too! Unlike F1 this series is not much about making money, or 'the business'. Yes paid teams are essential but its about people with the love of it first and foremost. I can't imagine that the recent hybrid cars will be possible to run in the same way in the future due to their inherent complexity so enjoy these now! We should all be grateful that these beasts are still run for the purpose that they were intended.
My F1 V10 race experience is limited to just 11 laps in Spain but I can say that the memory and experience of the first time that rear end bit at full throttle in 2nd is with me almost every day ...in fact I watched the vids again just yesterday! Make no mistake these cars are monsters, and the challenge of running these without the backing of the large operations/budgets of the day cannot be overstated. I think this really comes out in the thread - thanks for sharing.
RD
It should really be impossible to run these cars privately but a small "core" of ex F1 guys chose to do this once they left F1 and that small batch of people, many of whom are working together across teams, keep these cars running despite the lack of any factory or supplier support. Really we are taking on far more now in terms of component maintenance than the teams did, we're servicing our own electronics, rebuilidng our own hyds pumps etc. etc. these items would have just been swapped out in the day for 0KM or new parts. We just don't have that option these days.
It's a challenge but a very, very rewarding one!
For anyone interested in seeing these cars in action have a look at www.bossgp.com the galleries on the website are great and BOSS hire in some amazing photographers to capture the cars in action. It's well worth a browse
Amazing you get them to run at all with 20 people! Lots of bespoke manufacturing of parts required as well no doubt.
Fascinating insite. Again, thanks for sharing!
There is no prize money but the size of the crowds at some events means sponsorship is possible and with next years TV coverage and tyre deal it is starting to look more viable to get closer to cost neutral.
The challenge of running them gets no easier though, people often think these are "simpler" versions of the cars which raced in the day whereas actually they are identical in nearly every way, only we're doing it with a tenth of the budget and 20 rather than 120 people.... oh and pretty much no supplier support!
BOSS has huge potential right now and the team behind it are working very, very hard to get it where it belongs. It is a spectacular championship and there is honestly nothing like it - for those complaining about the lack of noise in F1 come and watch a BOSS GP race where we have everything from 3.5L V6s to 4.2L V12s with quite a few F1 V10s in there with them on the same grid..... with no silencers!
Fascinating insite. Again, thanks for sharing!
poppopbangbang said:
turboslippers said:
Great read, thoroughly enjoyed that, thanks!
I was going to ask if these cars were an iteration of the A23 Arrows that my late brother designed front suspension, hubs, uprights etc for but a google shows that the A23s bought by PS were no better than the PSO3 so your cars are the reworked PS03 chassis and not the A23 arrows which internet says were later sold and ran as the Super Aguri cars...
Amazing that you can run any 'modern' F1 car like this. Can only assume that sponsorship and prize money don't come close to running costs and much is just done of love of it. Big thumbs up!
Ben
When PS back to backed the A23 and PS03 it was found both were similar in terms of lap time but the A23 was more fragile hence developing the 03 into the 04B. The A23 did indeed become the SA05 and later the SA06. I was going to ask if these cars were an iteration of the A23 Arrows that my late brother designed front suspension, hubs, uprights etc for but a google shows that the A23s bought by PS were no better than the PSO3 so your cars are the reworked PS03 chassis and not the A23 arrows which internet says were later sold and ran as the Super Aguri cars...
Amazing that you can run any 'modern' F1 car like this. Can only assume that sponsorship and prize money don't come close to running costs and much is just done of love of it. Big thumbs up!
Ben
There is no prize money but the size of the crowds at some events means sponsorship is possible and with next years TV coverage and tyre deal it is starting to look more viable to get closer to cost neutral.
The challenge of running them gets no easier though, people often think these are "simpler" versions of the cars which raced in the day whereas actually they are identical in nearly every way, only we're doing it with a tenth of the budget and 20 rather than 120 people.... oh and pretty much no supplier support!
BOSS has huge potential right now and the team behind it are working very, very hard to get it where it belongs. It is a spectacular championship and there is honestly nothing like it - for those complaining about the lack of noise in F1 come and watch a BOSS GP race where we have everything from 3.5L V6s to 4.2L V12s with quite a few F1 V10s in there with them on the same grid..... with no silencers!
poppopbangbang said:
- for those complaining about the lack of noise in F1 come and watch a BOSS GP race where we have everything from 3.5L V6s to 4.2L V12s with quite a few F1 V10s in there with them on the same grid..... with no silencers!
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