Discussion
Actus Reus said:
Beautiful car OP - great combination of colours.
I hadn't given these much thought having, at the time of launch, preferred the prancing horse's offering, but actually, in hindsight, these look wonderful. If, and it's a mighty big if, my business grows as I want it to, one of these will be on my list. Either in this blue, or that red metallic.
I think the 12C is finally coming round to being appreciated by the supercar fanboy community. Of course, it helps that pre-owned examples are currently on the market for typically 65k less than when they were new. Let's keep it our little secret I hadn't given these much thought having, at the time of launch, preferred the prancing horse's offering, but actually, in hindsight, these look wonderful. If, and it's a mighty big if, my business grows as I want it to, one of these will be on my list. Either in this blue, or that red metallic.
Honestly, I would buy one soon because I can only see them appreciating over time. I mean how many other supercars are out there with the 12C's performance retailing at the same price? But then I would say that wouldn't I! PS McLaren Ascot have a nice Volcano Red example...
baronbennyt said:
Beefmeister said:
culpz said:
One of my fav super cars the 12C. I actually think it looks better than all the other models that proceeded it. They just look a bit too try-hard to me. These just looks purposeful and like a super car should in my eyes. Lovely example OP 
I was fairly surprised at Chris Harris' review of one, to which he reckoned they are perfectly usable day-to-day. Obviously, this is a raging debate as to what a supercar should be but i think they should be used as much as they can.
How often do you use yours and would you agree with the above? I'm just curious to see if others would agree.
I've done many miles in 12C/650s and they are by far the comfiest to drive when in their Normal settings. Easily the equal of a 5-Series or E-Class. Decent front boot for luggage/shopping too.I was fairly surprised at Chris Harris' review of one, to which he reckoned they are perfectly usable day-to-day. Obviously, this is a raging debate as to what a supercar should be but i think they should be used as much as they can.
How often do you use yours and would you agree with the above? I'm just curious to see if others would agree.
The 12C stays at my home in Surrey but I also live and work in Brussels, Belgium so I don't get to use it as much as I would like. However, I have lots of trips planned for it in the UK, France and Germany this summer. Can't wait!
baronbennyt said:
I think the 12C is finally coming round to being appreciated by the supercar fanboy community. Of course, it helps that pre-owned examples are currently on the market for typically 65k less than when they were new. Let's keep it our little secret Honestly, I would buy one soon because I can only see them appreciating over time. I mean how many other supercars are out there with the 12C's performance retailing at the same price? But then I would say that wouldn't I!
PS McLaren Ascot have a nice Volcano Red example...
Beyond my means for now (or at least so says the wife) - which is a great shame. As to the values - maybe, but with the arrival of the cheaper 540 there's not that much room for appreciation is there? I can't see big drops, but I think significant appreciation might be a bit optimistic. Honestly, I would buy one soon because I can only see them appreciating over time. I mean how many other supercars are out there with the 12C's performance retailing at the same price? But then I would say that wouldn't I! PS McLaren Ascot have a nice Volcano Red example...
Actus Reus said:
Beyond my means for now (or at least so says the wife) - which is a great shame. As to the values - maybe, but with the arrival of the cheaper 540 there's not that much room for appreciation is there? I can't see big drops, but I think significant appreciation might be a bit optimistic.
Sure but the 12C was the first modern McLaren and is one "class" up from the 540 so comes with superior horsepower and performance figures, although I appreciate the differential is not vast and that the 540 is the newer car (even though the 12C's trick suspension is technically more advanced). Nevertheless, both are epic pieces of kit. I've never made any money buying and selling performance cars but I hope the 12C will, at the very least, hold its value. Maybe a bit of wishful thinking (again) on my part!
Took the 12C for a blast to my local Porsche dealership last weekend..
...I went in convoy with my brother (lukelovescars) and his six-figure mileage Porsche 997 GT3 (Gen I) of PH fame:
http://www.pistonheads.com/regulars/ph-spottedykyw...
I was once a Porsche fanboy, having been lucky enough to have owned (and regularly track) a 997 GT3RS, 997 GT2 and Cayman R, but after being mucked around by my local centre for too long I decided to turn my back on Stuttgart and welcome Woking. It's a decision I have not regretted one bit. As I walked around the dealership I certainly appreciated but didn't lust after any of their stock. Indeed, I noticed that their 2014 Turbo S is on the market for quite a bit more than what I paid for my 12C and their 911 GTS is on for only a bit less. I appreciate these are very different performance cars which appeal to different buyers, but it was no contest as far as I was concerned!
...I went in convoy with my brother (lukelovescars) and his six-figure mileage Porsche 997 GT3 (Gen I) of PH fame:
http://www.pistonheads.com/regulars/ph-spottedykyw...
I was once a Porsche fanboy, having been lucky enough to have owned (and regularly track) a 997 GT3RS, 997 GT2 and Cayman R, but after being mucked around by my local centre for too long I decided to turn my back on Stuttgart and welcome Woking. It's a decision I have not regretted one bit. As I walked around the dealership I certainly appreciated but didn't lust after any of their stock. Indeed, I noticed that their 2014 Turbo S is on the market for quite a bit more than what I paid for my 12C and their 911 GTS is on for only a bit less. I appreciate these are very different performance cars which appeal to different buyers, but it was no contest as far as I was concerned!
t didn't realise these were so powerful or indeed so light!
Very nice car- I would love a 12C or a 570s for the future.
For now I'm loving my Evora S and have similar opinions about protecting the paint- how are you finding the suntek? This and 'xpel' appear to be self-healing/non-yellowing film which although expensive is the best. I have some normal film on the rest of the car which seems to 'dull' the bright blue paint somewhat but none on he front and I was considering fitting some. Considering the high cost (£800-1000) of just getting the front done was interested in your opinions?
For now I'm loving my Evora S and have similar opinions about protecting the paint- how are you finding the suntek? This and 'xpel' appear to be self-healing/non-yellowing film which although expensive is the best. I have some normal film on the rest of the car which seems to 'dull' the bright blue paint somewhat but none on he front and I was considering fitting some. Considering the high cost (£800-1000) of just getting the front done was interested in your opinions?
I had the chance to drive one of those (briefly) on a track day experience. A little frustrating when I was held up by a Lamborghini Huracan, but what an extraordinary car! When you are a passenger in a car and it is accelerated you feel a push in the back which you don't feel in the same way as when you are a driver - well I did in that car. The handling and the feel was beautiful too. Enjoy!
Si_man306 said:
Very nice car- I would love a 12C or a 570s for the future.
For now I'm loving my Evora S and have similar opinions about protecting the paint- how are you finding the suntek? This and 'xpel' appear to be self-healing/non-yellowing film which although expensive is the best. I have some normal film on the rest of the car which seems to 'dull' the bright blue paint somewhat but none on he front and I was considering fitting some. Considering the high cost (£800-1000) of just getting the front done was interested in your opinions?
Lotus Evora S. Very nice. Honestly, whenever I buy a new sports / supercar I get a 3/4 or full paint protection film applied because I go on regular road trips through France and Germany, and participate in a number of track days every year, Spa and Nurburgring included. It's not cheap but the piece of mind is immense and I want to keep my pride and joys in tip-top condition. Stone chips send me into deep despair. Think I might have mild OCD!For now I'm loving my Evora S and have similar opinions about protecting the paint- how are you finding the suntek? This and 'xpel' appear to be self-healing/non-yellowing film which although expensive is the best. I have some normal film on the rest of the car which seems to 'dull' the bright blue paint somewhat but none on he front and I was considering fitting some. Considering the high cost (£800-1000) of just getting the front done was interested in your opinions?
I traditionally had a '3M Ventureshield' film applied (which was absolutely fine, looked good and did the job), but I understand PPFs have moved on. So McLaren Ascot recommended 'SunTek' and I had that applied to my 12C - no issues whatsoever to date, but I only had it applied last week. You can't even see it!
I've also ordered a Lotus 3-Eleven from Bell & Colvill, Surrey (delivery expected on 18th March) and Race-by-Design will apply a complete body Xpel film to that.
I'll let you know how I get on.
I always liked these - miles better than the "look at me" range McLaren currently have on the go. Classic, classy colour combination too - is the paint quality up to scratch on these cars? Looks great in the photos.
I'll be interested to hear how running costs are - I've read too many terrifying numbers regarding this car.. McLaren (understandably) had no idea how to make a production car when they made this, and everything seems to cost thousands!!
I'll be interested to hear how running costs are - I've read too many terrifying numbers regarding this car.. McLaren (understandably) had no idea how to make a production car when they made this, and everything seems to cost thousands!!
PunterCam said:
I always liked these - miles better than the "look at me" range McLaren currently have on the go. Classic, classy colour combination too - is the paint quality up to scratch on these cars? Looks great in the photos.
I'll be interested to hear how running costs are - I've read too many terrifying numbers regarding this car.. McLaren (understandably) had no idea how to make a production car when they made this, and everything seems to cost thousands!!
The paint on my 12C is of excellent quality; certainly I've has no issues with it whatsoever. I'll be interested to hear how running costs are - I've read too many terrifying numbers regarding this car.. McLaren (understandably) had no idea how to make a production car when they made this, and everything seems to cost thousands!!
Re. running costs, see below the 12C buyers' guide from Alastair Bols, ex-McLaren Knightsbridge, now an Essex-based independent:
- The M838T engine is so far proving extremely reliable with no serious recurring issues, even with cars that have covered over 30,000 miles.
- There were early gremlins with various aspects of the car, but McLaren worked hard to eradicate them. The biggest update was at the end of 2012, when there was a free performance upgrade from 592 to 616bhp, along with upgrades to gearbox mapping, throttle mapping and the Intake Sound Generator. There really shouldn’t be any cars now that haven’t had these upgrades.
- The M838T is dry-sumped, but there’s no faff with checking the oil level – it’s displayed on the dash. Servicing isn’t cheap, averaging £1500-2000 per year.
- The other outlay you might want to consider is a warranty. A McLaren warranty is £3400 a year (the first year is included if you buy through ‘McLaren Qualified’). As an independent, Bols can provide a year’s comprehensive warranty for £2000 a year; all his cars come with a six-month warranty included.
- The Graziano twin-clutch gearbox is generally resilient, but a few cars have suffered leaking internal seals, necessitating a new ’box, so look underneath for leaks.
- Clutches don’t wear out like old automated systems. The dealerships don’t even have a measuring system for clutch wear. It’s simply not an issue.
- The hydraulic suspension system works brilliantly, and suffers very, very few faults. On a test drive you might hear a thump through the carbon tub when wheels hit potholes, but it’s a characteristic rather than a fault.
- Because of Brake Steer, the front and rear pads and discs all wear at a similar rate. Carbon brakes look great, but are very pricey. Only 10 to 15 per cent of UK cars had them. Combined with the air brake, the steel brakes do everything and more that you would want.
- Tyres should be Pirelli P Zero MC1s, specifically developed for the car and stickier than standard P Zeros but no more expensive. The car really should have them.
- The bonnet and front wings are aluminium, other panels SMC (sheet-moulded composite). Check for poor panel alignment or paint mismatching. Also check for scrapes under the chin and chipping on the side intakes.
- Inside, leather and Alcantara was the most popular trim (part leather was standard, full leather another option). All wear well.
- The original IRIS had software updates at the end of 2012, but at the same time IRIS 2 was introduced on new cars, and (crucially) this included a hardware change, offering fully functioning satnav and Bluetooth. It’s a big improvement and can be retrofitted for around £2700.
- If a car isn’t used weekly, it must be kept on a trickle charger.
My 2011 spec 12C has the McLaren blue paint; ceramic brakes; IRIS 2.0 (upgrade); reversing camera (upgrade); but, not the sports exhaust, hence the silver exhaust surrounds. It's done 17,000 miles, had two previous owners and I bought it from McLaren Ascot in December 2016 with one year's official warranty for £113,000.
baronbennyt said:
I saw a lovely looking blue 12C (albeit a lighter shade) at Prodrive SS a couple of weeks ago. That's when I realised how classy these cars look in a subtle colour.
OP, your dark blue looks fantastic also, congrats on a great spec. I'd call it the 'gentleman spec' supercar.
One question regarding trackdays. It's good to hear you're using it as intended, but how do you go about insurance whilst on track and at the Nurburgring?
I have track day cover as part of my road policy but an excess equal to 10% of the car's value has put me off going anywhere near a track.
OP, your dark blue looks fantastic also, congrats on a great spec. I'd call it the 'gentleman spec' supercar.
One question regarding trackdays. It's good to hear you're using it as intended, but how do you go about insurance whilst on track and at the Nurburgring?
I have track day cover as part of my road policy but an excess equal to 10% of the car's value has put me off going anywhere near a track.
topless360 said:
I saw a lovely looking blue 12C (albeit a lighter shade) at Prodrive SS a couple of weeks ago. That's when I realised how classy these cars look in a subtle colour.
OP, your dark blue looks fantastic also, congrats on a great spec. I'd call it the 'gentleman spec' supercar.
One question regarding trackdays. It's good to hear you're using it as intended, but how do you go about insurance whilst on track and at the Nurburgring?
I have track day cover as part of my road policy but an excess equal to 10% of the car's value has put me off going anywhere near a track.
Thank you for your kind words; although I'm not over the hill just yet, I've always tented to go for sober exterior and interior colour combinations for my cars. Dark blue and tan seems to be an obsession! OP, your dark blue looks fantastic also, congrats on a great spec. I'd call it the 'gentleman spec' supercar.
One question regarding trackdays. It's good to hear you're using it as intended, but how do you go about insurance whilst on track and at the Nurburgring?
I have track day cover as part of my road policy but an excess equal to 10% of the car's value has put me off going anywhere near a track.
My insurance policy covers me for track days with the exception of the Nurburgring but the excess is significant. Although there is no guarantee it will never happen, in the 10 years I've been enjoying track days I have only had one spin (and that was into the grassy infield at Bedford). No contact, ever. It helps that I only do track days with specialist clubs, have my cars regularly inspected and prepared, and always leave something in reserve
If I worried about it too much, I'd never get out there which would be a crying shame since it's my no.1 passion.
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