2013 Ferrari FF
Discussion
Bright Halo said:
That tyre shape is very strange and I can’t think what would have caused it. Any alignment issue would result in uneven wear not misshapen?
Hopefully new tyres will sort it out.
Great car!
VW Passats have a habit of making their rear tyres wear in a castle turret shape. Up - down - up - down across the width of the tyre. It's very odd!Hopefully new tyres will sort it out.
Great car!
Lovely car OP, especially the colour combination. Good luck with getting it just how you want it!
This is good for preventing your nuts from going rusty: https://xcp-protection.com/product/rust-blocker/
It's on Amazon and Ebay.
Just found this thread, Fonzey and I'm loving it. that's a beautiful car in a stunning colour combo - I bet you're a very happy man!
As to the 4WD warning, it sounds like you need to adopt the attitude that I, and thousands of other Range Rover owners, have developed over the years. Namely, when a warning light or message pops up, give it a few days to change its mind. If it's still there after a week, only then do you need to look into it!
As to the 4WD warning, it sounds like you need to adopt the attitude that I, and thousands of other Range Rover owners, have developed over the years. Namely, when a warning light or message pops up, give it a few days to change its mind. If it's still there after a week, only then do you need to look into it!
This is an excellent thread and really well written, thanks OP.
With respect to the ‘blown’ tyre, the carcass of a tyre on my Range Rover, inherited with the purchase, became rusted and failed — it ballooned and was convex in shape. I think that it’s due to the rim seal finish corroding and water entering and penetrating the tyre.
With respect to the ‘blown’ tyre, the carcass of a tyre on my Range Rover, inherited with the purchase, became rusted and failed — it ballooned and was convex in shape. I think that it’s due to the rim seal finish corroding and water entering and penetrating the tyre.
A great thread and a very brave purchase OP, but I’m sure the experience will be worth it! You are, after all, driving a V12 Ferrari, and one that you can actually take the family out in!
I think we’ve all been there with a ‘Oh my God, what have I done?!’ purchase, but I think you might got lucky with this one if some paint and tyres mostly sorts it. If the fuel consumption didn’t terrify you on your journey back North then I think it’s going to be fine.
Interesting comments about the auction platform. I can see how it can work for buyers at the right price but I do not see the value in paying someone 7% to put pictures of your car on the internet and then having no accountability whatsoever…..each to their own. I get that the buyer pays the fees, but the seller does really, indirectly.
A nicely balanced garage by the way - every garage needs a Lotus!
I look forward to reading more about your adventures, good luck!
I think we’ve all been there with a ‘Oh my God, what have I done?!’ purchase, but I think you might got lucky with this one if some paint and tyres mostly sorts it. If the fuel consumption didn’t terrify you on your journey back North then I think it’s going to be fine.
Interesting comments about the auction platform. I can see how it can work for buyers at the right price but I do not see the value in paying someone 7% to put pictures of your car on the internet and then having no accountability whatsoever…..each to their own. I get that the buyer pays the fees, but the seller does really, indirectly.
A nicely balanced garage by the way - every garage needs a Lotus!
I look forward to reading more about your adventures, good luck!
Lovely car- I think the FF is my money no object upgrade on the Granturismo I am currently (mostly) enjoying.
Would be interested in your experiences of getting your paint work sorted at the Motorist. I’m not too far from them and I need to find somewhere to repair the front bumper on my car which came off second best when I needed to mount a kerb to take evasive action to avoid a head on collision with a white van (on the wrong side of the road).
Would be interested in your experiences of getting your paint work sorted at the Motorist. I’m not too far from them and I need to find somewhere to repair the front bumper on my car which came off second best when I needed to mount a kerb to take evasive action to avoid a head on collision with a white van (on the wrong side of the road).
Thanks All, some very kind comments. Wasn't expecting/planning on this being a project so if a handful of people on PH enjoy the journey then it helps cushion the blow a bit 
djgritt said:
You’ve progressed a long way in car ownership since the excellent project Impreza I was following over on the CS Forums!
<3 I miss that Subaru AND I miss CS. Good times.Paintshop update.
I dropped off at the Motorist as planned and other than popping in once midweek on the 'way to work' I just left them to it.
Prior to starting bodywork on it, the workshop stuck the car on the alignment rack and reported back that everything was in spec. I absolutely intend to get it re-checked after the new tyres go on, because the distortion I'd seen with the tyres would surely negatively influence an alignment reading.
When I did pop in, they were more than happy to show me round the car and the progress so far.
They did take a few photos though, which I'll share here:
The extent of the paintwork would be:
Full front bumper
Full Bonnet
Front wings but blending back towards the door, allowing them to fix the chipped paint on the inner arches
Rear tailgate with a small corrosion repair
Obviously colour match is always a concern when getting a partial respray, but they absolutely smashed it IMO. Always subjective, and a paint-pro would probably be able to spot something but to my eye, even under the harsh light of a detailing garage it was excellent.
Prior to collection it probably got its first ever real clean too in my ownership! I'm convinced they whizzed around it with some sort of polish/glaze as the swirling on the other body panels was well hidden too. For the first time, I looked at the car got that warm fuzzy tingling you get when you have an awesome looking car.
In addition to doing what I asked, they 'stretched' the paintwork a bit to cover a couple other blemishes that would be borderline of whether a detail could polish them out - so I was very happy and appreciative of that.
I'd been out of the car for a week at this point, so was giddy to drive it home and see if the handling was magically better. It wasn't.
Car still liked a drink though.
I had a couple of days just walking around the car and looking at it. FINALLY I had a car that I couldn't take my eyes off, used every opportunity to just peek out of the window and see how it looked. Wiping bird muck off within 30 seconds of it landing and the other weird stuff you do on a new car. I have to be honest, I did spot a couple of niggles related to the rebuild of the car after paint, but already been in touch and once the wheels are back on the car I'll pop it down. I'm sure we can sort it, Motorist have been excellent so far and have no reason to think their aftercare won't also be brilliant.
I dropped off at the Motorist as planned and other than popping in once midweek on the 'way to work' I just left them to it.
Prior to starting bodywork on it, the workshop stuck the car on the alignment rack and reported back that everything was in spec. I absolutely intend to get it re-checked after the new tyres go on, because the distortion I'd seen with the tyres would surely negatively influence an alignment reading.
When I did pop in, they were more than happy to show me round the car and the progress so far.
They did take a few photos though, which I'll share here:
The extent of the paintwork would be:
Full front bumper
Full Bonnet
Front wings but blending back towards the door, allowing them to fix the chipped paint on the inner arches
Rear tailgate with a small corrosion repair
Obviously colour match is always a concern when getting a partial respray, but they absolutely smashed it IMO. Always subjective, and a paint-pro would probably be able to spot something but to my eye, even under the harsh light of a detailing garage it was excellent.
Prior to collection it probably got its first ever real clean too in my ownership! I'm convinced they whizzed around it with some sort of polish/glaze as the swirling on the other body panels was well hidden too. For the first time, I looked at the car got that warm fuzzy tingling you get when you have an awesome looking car.
In addition to doing what I asked, they 'stretched' the paintwork a bit to cover a couple other blemishes that would be borderline of whether a detail could polish them out - so I was very happy and appreciative of that.
I'd been out of the car for a week at this point, so was giddy to drive it home and see if the handling was magically better. It wasn't.
Car still liked a drink though.
I had a couple of days just walking around the car and looking at it. FINALLY I had a car that I couldn't take my eyes off, used every opportunity to just peek out of the window and see how it looked. Wiping bird muck off within 30 seconds of it landing and the other weird stuff you do on a new car. I have to be honest, I did spot a couple of niggles related to the rebuild of the car after paint, but already been in touch and once the wheels are back on the car I'll pop it down. I'm sure we can sort it, Motorist have been excellent so far and have no reason to think their aftercare won't also be brilliant.
What a stunning car OP.
Love the colour combo; I think the FF is a very very handsome thing indeed.
Your ownership has been a rollercoaster for sure, but it sounds like it’s well on the way to smoothing out and it’ll be worth it for the iconic Ferrari V12.
With regards to alignment might be worth trying to get it booked in with someone like Centre Gravity who will realky go to town in it. It’s nothing that local to you, but I have a friend who lives in Knaresborough and he’d travel to them.
Love the colour combo; I think the FF is a very very handsome thing indeed.
Your ownership has been a rollercoaster for sure, but it sounds like it’s well on the way to smoothing out and it’ll be worth it for the iconic Ferrari V12.
With regards to alignment might be worth trying to get it booked in with someone like Centre Gravity who will realky go to town in it. It’s nothing that local to you, but I have a friend who lives in Knaresborough and he’d travel to them.
Fantastic purchase OP.
And also a fantastic colour combo - which proves to be quite rare. I'm a long time lurker on the FF owners thread - i've been looking for an FF to replace my E63s as nothing else tickles my fancy after the AMG but im holding out for a later car with a pano roof. I've missed out on two cars in 12 months, one i 'really' wanted and the other was in Rosso Corsa which i'm not sure this car suits - you've defo demonstrated it suits a darker colour.
the pool of cars for sale at any one time is literally tiny - which although i assume is down to low numbers that were purchased when new, its also i assume a testament to how much owners value these by keeping hold of them.
With regards to the PTU being changed by Ferrari before you bought it- would it be a fair assumption to think that at some point the same PTU issues will arise, or have Ferrari upgraded or changed anything when fitting the new PTU?
How are you getting on with the infotainment too - is it as cumbersome to use as other owners have made out? I understand upgrades are simple enough, albeit not as OEM looking.
Anyway.. watching with great interest - Enjoy ownership!
And also a fantastic colour combo - which proves to be quite rare. I'm a long time lurker on the FF owners thread - i've been looking for an FF to replace my E63s as nothing else tickles my fancy after the AMG but im holding out for a later car with a pano roof. I've missed out on two cars in 12 months, one i 'really' wanted and the other was in Rosso Corsa which i'm not sure this car suits - you've defo demonstrated it suits a darker colour.
the pool of cars for sale at any one time is literally tiny - which although i assume is down to low numbers that were purchased when new, its also i assume a testament to how much owners value these by keeping hold of them.
With regards to the PTU being changed by Ferrari before you bought it- would it be a fair assumption to think that at some point the same PTU issues will arise, or have Ferrari upgraded or changed anything when fitting the new PTU?
How are you getting on with the infotainment too - is it as cumbersome to use as other owners have made out? I understand upgrades are simple enough, albeit not as OEM looking.
Anyway.. watching with great interest - Enjoy ownership!
Court_S said:
With regards to alignment might be worth trying to get it booked in with someone like Centre Gravity who will realky go to town in it. It’s nothing that local to you, but I have a friend who lives in Knaresborough and he’d travel to them.
Thank you, yes a good alignment place is definitely on the cards. I have some people that I trust very much in the Lotus world, so I have some options locally. I'm also a bit of a dabbler of it myself, I've been slowly building up a garage full of kit to do DIY alignments, it's just a shame the FF won't fit in the garage yet 
irfan1712 said:
Fantastic purchase OP.
And also a fantastic colour combo - which proves to be quite rare. I'm a long time lurker on the FF owners thread - i've been looking for an FF to replace my E63s as nothing else tickles my fancy after the AMG but im holding out for a later car with a pano roof. I've missed out on two cars in 12 months, one i 'really' wanted and the other was in Rosso Corsa which i'm not sure this car suits - you've defo demonstrated it suits a darker colour.
the pool of cars for sale at any one time is literally tiny - which although i assume is down to low numbers that were purchased when new, its also i assume a testament to how much owners value these by keeping hold of them.
With regards to the PTU being changed by Ferrari before you bought it- would it be a fair assumption to think that at some point the same PTU issues will arise, or have Ferrari upgraded or changed anything when fitting the new PTU?
How are you getting on with the infotainment too - is it as cumbersome to use as other owners have made out? I understand upgrades are simple enough, albeit not as OEM looking.
Anyway.. watching with great interest - Enjoy ownership!
Thank you! There are rumours that more recent PTU replacements take learnings from the GTC4Lusso etc, and that it might be more robust - but I've heard nothing factual. I think I'd always plan on spending the ~£10k on getting an independent rebuild and future proofing of the PTU, but I consider the 'clock reset' on a 10 year old car by having a recent replacement.And also a fantastic colour combo - which proves to be quite rare. I'm a long time lurker on the FF owners thread - i've been looking for an FF to replace my E63s as nothing else tickles my fancy after the AMG but im holding out for a later car with a pano roof. I've missed out on two cars in 12 months, one i 'really' wanted and the other was in Rosso Corsa which i'm not sure this car suits - you've defo demonstrated it suits a darker colour.
the pool of cars for sale at any one time is literally tiny - which although i assume is down to low numbers that were purchased when new, its also i assume a testament to how much owners value these by keeping hold of them.
With regards to the PTU being changed by Ferrari before you bought it- would it be a fair assumption to think that at some point the same PTU issues will arise, or have Ferrari upgraded or changed anything when fitting the new PTU?
How are you getting on with the infotainment too - is it as cumbersome to use as other owners have made out? I understand upgrades are simple enough, albeit not as OEM looking.
Anyway.. watching with great interest - Enjoy ownership!
The Infotainment is.... comical. It's both amazing in its simplicity and terrible in its era. Sat Nav is laughable, but it integrates nicely into the dials/clocks and I'm actually feeling a little reluctant to swap it. A Good quality phone holder that doesn't block the vents or offend my eyes too much would pretty much eliminate my desire to swap the head unit, but failing that - I do have my eyes on a few Android Auto capable modern head units.
This final retrospective update will bring the thread up to speed!
With the car back from paint, I took it back to my detailer to let him inspect it under the lights and he was as impressed as I was. Some bits to 'correct' when he gets his hands on it in a few weeks' time, but impressed.
Getting the car off the ground was daunting, but actually the jacking positions are well thought out and big enough to take a jack and axle stand.
I loaded the Volvo up with 4x tyres and 4x tyred rims. Beast of a car.
I dropped the wheels off at a place I've not used before, but came highly recommended as somewhere that 'repairs wheels first, and powdercoats second' rather than what is usually the other way around. I wanted an expert in wheel repairs to investigate the NSF wheel which had been called out in a previous MOT as being 'distorted'.
To my eye, the wheel looks fine, balances is up nicely with minimal weight and other than a bit of curb rash it looked great - but once they get the paint off of it, they may be able to see more. If it's had a repair previously, I want to be sure it's a good one - otherwise it's off to eBay to replace the wheel.
They'll dispose of the old Pirelli's and give me them back with the nice new PS4S on them. Can't wait, but to date - I still don't have them back.
In the meantime I bought some Ferrari parts, my first purchase and it was surprisingly cheap!
My old Lotus had a habit of spitting its centre caps out on a trackday, and I spent a fortune over the years @ £30 a pop. Was pleasantly surprised to find the official Ferrari ones at almost half that price!
With a bit of time to burn, I turned my attention to something that a few thread posters have called out already. Rusty brake disc bolts.
My rears are fine:
Fronts looked like the nuts were very rusty, but the bolts underneath seemed fine:
The danger is that the nut/bolt corrodes, swells, seizes in the disc and in extreme cases actually cracks the friction material.
I made the call to undo one corner, and make sure they weren't seized in. Measure all the hardware up, clean up, and research some replacements whilst hopefully rebuilding with the cleaned up and rust protected originals.
To my relief, all ten came out absolutely fine. I left two opposites in place whilst cleaning up the other 8, then rotated... or that was the plan.
With the two refitted, I got on with cleaning up the other 8. Bilt Hamber Deox Gel to strip the rust off, followed by a good soaking in XCP. Ideally in the long run I source new hardware and maybe get it cerakoted(?).
The BH stuff is genius, 24 after dunking you get something like this:
Wipe/rinse off and you're left with:
I was all set to rebuild the corner, I had a load of measurements for sourcing new stuff.
The nuts look to be M6 K-Nuts, and turn out to be common fitment across most AP/Brembo floating kits so easy to replace.
The bolts were more difficult to track down, in fact - I still haven't. They're very odd headless bolts, almost more like threaded rivets. The 'heads' are flat, thin and round with two flats ground on to allow you to grip them with a 14mm spanner.
I wrote down all my measurements and went to the garage to prepare to rebuild the corner... then I noticed something.
The shoulder of one of the bolts had some pinprick holes in the metal.... weird. Picked another up, the same, another, the same. Picked one up and it had a gaping hole in the metalwork - and I could gently rock the head back and forth!
Uh-oh. I made the call to sacrifice that one for a look:
Not Good... The heads were ripe for popping off all of them, despite no heavy signs of external corrosion. I don't know how these rivet/bolt things are made - but they're pisspoor quality and at some point I fear would have failed on the car.
I did some research, and turned out this was very common. For most people, they only discover this after it's too late for the disc - the bolt gets seized in, expands, cracks the carbon. Game over. For me, I'm hoping I've caught this early... they all slid out easily, and from what I can see the disc is fine.
But it does leave me with a problem, Brembo don't list/sell these crappy things anywhere. Ferrari only list the complete disc/hub assembly (£3k+ per corner) and no other floating disc setup I can find uses this type of hardware... so this is half a thread update, and half an appeal for help.
I've spoken to a few firms this morning, a couple have offered to talk to Brembo for me and see what they can find - but expectations feel tamed. A local Ferrari Indy has explained to me that this is a very common issue on all 2009+ later Ferrari models, but he normally only ever sees it after it's too late and the disc just gets swapped. He has offered to take a look for me though, check my discs over and see if he can help with getting some new hardware made up.
That pretty much brings us up to speed. I've had a look at the workshop manual for disc removal, and the bloody caliper is connected to the upright with a solid pipe which means disconnecting that and losing some fluid - which is damn annoying, but at this point I'm already saturated on that front.
If anyone has anything to suggest, even if it comes down to material advise for getting new hardware made up. What's appropriate? These are non-magnetic, so I'm guessing a cheap grade of stainless. Would 12.9 and some external rust protection be more appropriate? Titanium?
With the car back from paint, I took it back to my detailer to let him inspect it under the lights and he was as impressed as I was. Some bits to 'correct' when he gets his hands on it in a few weeks' time, but impressed.
Getting the car off the ground was daunting, but actually the jacking positions are well thought out and big enough to take a jack and axle stand.
I loaded the Volvo up with 4x tyres and 4x tyred rims. Beast of a car.
I dropped the wheels off at a place I've not used before, but came highly recommended as somewhere that 'repairs wheels first, and powdercoats second' rather than what is usually the other way around. I wanted an expert in wheel repairs to investigate the NSF wheel which had been called out in a previous MOT as being 'distorted'.
To my eye, the wheel looks fine, balances is up nicely with minimal weight and other than a bit of curb rash it looked great - but once they get the paint off of it, they may be able to see more. If it's had a repair previously, I want to be sure it's a good one - otherwise it's off to eBay to replace the wheel.
They'll dispose of the old Pirelli's and give me them back with the nice new PS4S on them. Can't wait, but to date - I still don't have them back.
In the meantime I bought some Ferrari parts, my first purchase and it was surprisingly cheap!
My old Lotus had a habit of spitting its centre caps out on a trackday, and I spent a fortune over the years @ £30 a pop. Was pleasantly surprised to find the official Ferrari ones at almost half that price!
With a bit of time to burn, I turned my attention to something that a few thread posters have called out already. Rusty brake disc bolts.
My rears are fine:
Fronts looked like the nuts were very rusty, but the bolts underneath seemed fine:
The danger is that the nut/bolt corrodes, swells, seizes in the disc and in extreme cases actually cracks the friction material.
I made the call to undo one corner, and make sure they weren't seized in. Measure all the hardware up, clean up, and research some replacements whilst hopefully rebuilding with the cleaned up and rust protected originals.
To my relief, all ten came out absolutely fine. I left two opposites in place whilst cleaning up the other 8, then rotated... or that was the plan.
With the two refitted, I got on with cleaning up the other 8. Bilt Hamber Deox Gel to strip the rust off, followed by a good soaking in XCP. Ideally in the long run I source new hardware and maybe get it cerakoted(?).
The BH stuff is genius, 24 after dunking you get something like this:
Wipe/rinse off and you're left with:
I was all set to rebuild the corner, I had a load of measurements for sourcing new stuff.
The nuts look to be M6 K-Nuts, and turn out to be common fitment across most AP/Brembo floating kits so easy to replace.
The bolts were more difficult to track down, in fact - I still haven't. They're very odd headless bolts, almost more like threaded rivets. The 'heads' are flat, thin and round with two flats ground on to allow you to grip them with a 14mm spanner.
I wrote down all my measurements and went to the garage to prepare to rebuild the corner... then I noticed something.
The shoulder of one of the bolts had some pinprick holes in the metal.... weird. Picked another up, the same, another, the same. Picked one up and it had a gaping hole in the metalwork - and I could gently rock the head back and forth!
Uh-oh. I made the call to sacrifice that one for a look:
Not Good... The heads were ripe for popping off all of them, despite no heavy signs of external corrosion. I don't know how these rivet/bolt things are made - but they're pisspoor quality and at some point I fear would have failed on the car.
I did some research, and turned out this was very common. For most people, they only discover this after it's too late for the disc - the bolt gets seized in, expands, cracks the carbon. Game over. For me, I'm hoping I've caught this early... they all slid out easily, and from what I can see the disc is fine.
But it does leave me with a problem, Brembo don't list/sell these crappy things anywhere. Ferrari only list the complete disc/hub assembly (£3k+ per corner) and no other floating disc setup I can find uses this type of hardware... so this is half a thread update, and half an appeal for help.
I've spoken to a few firms this morning, a couple have offered to talk to Brembo for me and see what they can find - but expectations feel tamed. A local Ferrari Indy has explained to me that this is a very common issue on all 2009+ later Ferrari models, but he normally only ever sees it after it's too late and the disc just gets swapped. He has offered to take a look for me though, check my discs over and see if he can help with getting some new hardware made up.
That pretty much brings us up to speed. I've had a look at the workshop manual for disc removal, and the bloody caliper is connected to the upright with a solid pipe which means disconnecting that and losing some fluid - which is damn annoying, but at this point I'm already saturated on that front.
If anyone has anything to suggest, even if it comes down to material advise for getting new hardware made up. What's appropriate? These are non-magnetic, so I'm guessing a cheap grade of stainless. Would 12.9 and some external rust protection be more appropriate? Titanium?
Try the parts team at Autofficina for your unobtanium bolts. I know they have had success in sourcing parts from all over the world previously.
Fonzey said:
Court_S said:
With regards to alignment might be worth trying to get it booked in with someone like Centre Gravity who will realky go to town in it. It’s nothing that local to you, but I have a friend who lives in Knaresborough and he’d travel to them.
Thank you, yes a good alignment place is definitely on the cards. I have some people that I trust very much in the Lotus world, so I have some options locally. I'm also a bit of a dabbler of it myself, I've been slowly building up a garage full of kit to do DIY alignments, it's just a shame the FF won't fit in the garage yet Those bolts look like a really pain in the arse especially if you can’t buy them separately.
Without wanting to sound like the ill-educated, mechanically-inept oaf that I am... it doesn't look a particularly complicated item? Surely a machine shop would be able to turn something up from a suitable material and then harden them as appropriate?
(Although now I'm writing this, perhaps obtaining the necessary specification may be harder than obtaining the actual bolts!).
EDIT: Just seen your final, final paragraph. Ignore me! As you were...
(Although now I'm writing this, perhaps obtaining the necessary specification may be harder than obtaining the actual bolts!).
EDIT: Just seen your final, final paragraph. Ignore me! As you were...
Edited by MDifficult on Monday 31st July 13:50
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