My Bavarian barge - long term report
Discussion
That is a really nice write up and has spurred me into action again. Seeing what price these cars have got down to is amazing. The main thing I am thinking about though is which engine to go for, when I do eventually go down this route. In the past, the bigger petrol engines (especially in the "L" cars) were best specced. It doesn't appear to be the case in the E65/E66 so I wonder if there is any benefit for going for the 750 or 760 over say a 730d or 745.
Do you know if there are any common faults which only appear on certain engines? On the E38 generation, the nikasil liners were the main one which only bothered some of the V8 engined cars.
Thanks again for the photos and write up! Lovely car.
Do you know if there are any common faults which only appear on certain engines? On the E38 generation, the nikasil liners were the main one which only bothered some of the V8 engined cars.
Thanks again for the photos and write up! Lovely car.
WC, engine choice is a matter of taste I guess; as you say the engine size has little bearing on standard equipment on these so it really depends on you. For some a diesel engine in a barge like this is just wrong and having driven a 650i myself last week I can see their point. As wonderfully insulated and un-dieselly as it is, a 730d just can't deliver the kind of aural satisfaction you'd get from a 750i or 760li. Although my E65 can show the wife's Z4 a clean pair of tyres if required it doesn't sound like it's particularly enjoying the experience and there's also the age and mileage consideration of running a diesel in that you've got turbos, swirl flaps and other bits under high stress that can quite ruinously go pop. Arguably a petrol *could* have less to to go wrong at higher mileages.
That said, in the real world the 730d is the only model that delivers realistic fuel economy as a daily driver. A decent run can deliver you 40+ mpg and even around town you'd be going some to see under 30mpg most of the time. For a 3.0 with this level of performance, weighing this much and delivering this level of comfort that's pretty darn good. The other thing to bear in mind is that 90% of the E65s knocking about are diesel. Petrol 730is are like hens teeth and the tasty 750i and 760i models tend to be the 'L' stretched wheelbase versions. As I said in the write up, the width of the thing in standard form is enough to deal with in a tight city centre car park so I personally wouldn't want it to be any longer than it is! You'd also look even more like a chauffeur/airport taxi service in the 'L' as well....
If I had to buy an E65 again and fuel wasn't an issue my dream spec would be a standard wheelbase 750i in Sport trim with 20-inch wheels, comfort seats, soft close doors, powered bootlid, Logic 7 stereo, comfort access, DAB and TV. I'd stick with black and cream oyster leather but I'd find one with the matt dark grain wood that looks a bit more youthful than the high gloss in my car. If fuel was an issue then the above with the derv engine would be just fine!
That said, in the real world the 730d is the only model that delivers realistic fuel economy as a daily driver. A decent run can deliver you 40+ mpg and even around town you'd be going some to see under 30mpg most of the time. For a 3.0 with this level of performance, weighing this much and delivering this level of comfort that's pretty darn good. The other thing to bear in mind is that 90% of the E65s knocking about are diesel. Petrol 730is are like hens teeth and the tasty 750i and 760i models tend to be the 'L' stretched wheelbase versions. As I said in the write up, the width of the thing in standard form is enough to deal with in a tight city centre car park so I personally wouldn't want it to be any longer than it is! You'd also look even more like a chauffeur/airport taxi service in the 'L' as well....
If I had to buy an E65 again and fuel wasn't an issue my dream spec would be a standard wheelbase 750i in Sport trim with 20-inch wheels, comfort seats, soft close doors, powered bootlid, Logic 7 stereo, comfort access, DAB and TV. I'd stick with black and cream oyster leather but I'd find one with the matt dark grain wood that looks a bit more youthful than the high gloss in my car. If fuel was an issue then the above with the derv engine would be just fine!
Edited by bennyboydurham on Monday 5th December 17:18
bennyboydurham....Im sure i recognise this bmw from you tube,and you mentioning your wifes z4 also thats in the youtube video,am i correct?
video was called bmw 730d features..by bennyboy also lol
heres the link http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XS3MmJTCRj8
for a gadget freak like me looking to make a 730d my next barge i say thank you for making the video,great to see all the toys!
video was called bmw 730d features..by bennyboy also lol
heres the link http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XS3MmJTCRj8
for a gadget freak like me looking to make a 730d my next barge i say thank you for making the video,great to see all the toys!
Me again - am still looking around for my ideal E65 760Li and have a few contenders, like this:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/2003-BMW-7-SERIES-760Li-Auto...
or this:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/BMW-760Li-Saloon-AUTO-REAR-T...
I notice you say you have your iPod hooked up. Is this something that was factory? I have heard that earlier cars didn't have the option for iPod connectivity...
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/2003-BMW-7-SERIES-760Li-Auto...
or this:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/BMW-760Li-Saloon-AUTO-REAR-T...
I notice you say you have your iPod hooked up. Is this something that was factory? I have heard that earlier cars didn't have the option for iPod connectivity...
WC, iPod connectivity has three options. USB on the late model cars (post '07), cable fooling the idrive into controlling the iPod instead of the OEM CD changer on the facelift cars (like mine, stealer will charge around £250) or you're looking at a specialist install on the early models. I have no idea on the cost of this I'm afraid.
Couple of things I'd add; I'd go post facelift if the budget allows. The improvements to the idrive are worth the price of admission alone and the old styling really dates the car. Bang a private reg on a facelift and it could be a 58 plate for all anyone would know.
The Li is really long. I never struggle to park the E65 as the width rather than the length is usually the limiting factor in a car park, but you'd be sticking out at the back in most standard UK spaces. Worth a thought.
The two you've picked out are both good spec but the first is knocking onto 200k miles and even as a hardened E65 fan I'd need a lot of brave pills to buy one with that kind of mileage. The second is a better bet (if the miles are genuine) but looks to be very strong money for a 2003 pre-facelift gas guzzler. My own car, a diesel which gives sensible MPG and is a mint early '06 model with mostly dealer history and having a charmed life in the main would realistically only be worth around the money they want for a much older petrol model.
All IMHO and all that, obviously. Any more you need to know, just holler.
Couple of things I'd add; I'd go post facelift if the budget allows. The improvements to the idrive are worth the price of admission alone and the old styling really dates the car. Bang a private reg on a facelift and it could be a 58 plate for all anyone would know.
The Li is really long. I never struggle to park the E65 as the width rather than the length is usually the limiting factor in a car park, but you'd be sticking out at the back in most standard UK spaces. Worth a thought.
The two you've picked out are both good spec but the first is knocking onto 200k miles and even as a hardened E65 fan I'd need a lot of brave pills to buy one with that kind of mileage. The second is a better bet (if the miles are genuine) but looks to be very strong money for a 2003 pre-facelift gas guzzler. My own car, a diesel which gives sensible MPG and is a mint early '06 model with mostly dealer history and having a charmed life in the main would realistically only be worth around the money they want for a much older petrol model.
All IMHO and all that, obviously. Any more you need to know, just holler.
Wing Commander said:
Do you know if there are any common faults which only appear on certain engines? On the E38 generation, the nikasil liners were the main one which only bothered some of the V8 engined cars.
http://www.meeknet.co.uk/E32/Nikasil.htmEdited by PJ S on Friday 1st July 11:58
Pickled Piper said:
Excellent thread chaps. As a long term E39 owner I have struggled to line up a worthy successor. I dislike the ride of modern BMWs and just don't buy into the "runflat" era cars.
Definitely going to look into a 7.
pp
Yep all E65's come with a nice fat spare wheel under the carpet in the boot, no problems there! Definitely going to look into a 7.
pp
Love barges
sports cars and hot hatches have their place, but come on for 90% of the time you're driving somewhere for a reason. The driving is just a means to an end. In that case might as well be comfortable while you're nose to tailing it on the M6!
I had a Skoda Superb. Long long long car, crap turning circle, nightmare in NCP car parks. But everyone wanted to ride in it whenever we went on a long trip thanks to acres of leg room, big comfy seats and a soft comforting ride. Its all about barge's!!!
sports cars and hot hatches have their place, but come on for 90% of the time you're driving somewhere for a reason. The driving is just a means to an end. In that case might as well be comfortable while you're nose to tailing it on the M6!
I had a Skoda Superb. Long long long car, crap turning circle, nightmare in NCP car parks. But everyone wanted to ride in it whenever we went on a long trip thanks to acres of leg room, big comfy seats and a soft comforting ride. Its all about barge's!!!
Hi Benyboy,
What colour is your car? Is that Saphire black? Can you share the rest of the spec, wheels etc.
I'm in much the same position as you were when you bought your car. I've been considering spending £30K on a F10, but the car is just not doing anything for me. Cheaper grade of leather than in my E39 and those dreaded runflats. Spending £15 to £20K on an E65 is far more palatable and like my E39 I would probably keep it for a good number of years.
pp
What colour is your car? Is that Saphire black? Can you share the rest of the spec, wheels etc.
I'm in much the same position as you were when you bought your car. I've been considering spending £30K on a F10, but the car is just not doing anything for me. Cheaper grade of leather than in my E39 and those dreaded runflats. Spending £15 to £20K on an E65 is far more palatable and like my E39 I would probably keep it for a good number of years.
pp
Yep Sapphire black, that's the one. It's a pretty standard SE to be honest. The wheels are 19" Star design and the interior is oyster/black. The wood is high gloss grain. Equipment levels are high although mine doesn't have any tasty options like soft close doors, powered bootlid, TV, DAB, comfort seats, rear entertainment, dynamic cruise control etc.
If I bought another I'd go for the 20" sport alloys with oyster/black interior again but go for the matt grain wood instead which is a bit more contemporary than the wood I've got.
Pity you don't like the F01. I had a dealer demo for 24 hours and although I don't think the handling is as sorted as the E65, everything else is a leap forward - IMHO, of course. 20k however gives the pick of late model E65s. Get the latest and best spec model you can find and you'll be a very happy man.
I've had mine three years and no plans to get rid for another two at least as frankly unless the 740d drops onto the price radar there's nothing that can touch it in the metal for money stakes.
If I bought another I'd go for the 20" sport alloys with oyster/black interior again but go for the matt grain wood instead which is a bit more contemporary than the wood I've got.
Pity you don't like the F01. I had a dealer demo for 24 hours and although I don't think the handling is as sorted as the E65, everything else is a leap forward - IMHO, of course. 20k however gives the pick of late model E65s. Get the latest and best spec model you can find and you'll be a very happy man.
I've had mine three years and no plans to get rid for another two at least as frankly unless the 740d drops onto the price radar there's nothing that can touch it in the metal for money stakes.
Edited by bennyboydurham on Sunday 3rd July 04:47
PP, I also keep an eye on the AUC site to see what's passing through and there's not much right now. The F01 is taking a long time to float down to the kind of money that similar aged E65s cost when I got mine and also the steady stream of E65s from BMW, like mine has dried up too. That essentially means you've got a handful of boggo spec E65s knocking about and then a big jump in price up to the F01. When I was looking there were literally dozens to choose from. Be patient though, the right one will appear!
Chaps, bit of an update three years on!
The car is still with me, having outlived three car changes for my wife since it arrived in December 2007 - a BINI One, a Z4 and now a 325i E92 M Sport. In fact, we're already talking about moving on the E92 yet the trusty 7er is proving impossible to replace as it's just so damn good. It'll be 9 in December and a few years ago, if someone told me I'd be running around in a near-decade old motor I'd have laughed in their face but inside it doesn't squeak or rattle, it drives exactly the way it did when I rolled out of the BMW stealer when it was 23 months old and even now almost 8 years after first sliding behind that big steering wheel (which retracts out of your way, of course) it still feels like a special place to spend time.
With that in mind, the only car I hanker after is an F01 7er and bearing in mind I'd need to pony up £25k for one that's sufficiently new and toyed up to want to make the jump, the trigger so far has not been pulled while the E65 supplies such effortless, fully paid up, and by now fully depreciated motoring.
It's not been an expensive car to run, either. As a December '05 car, it sneaks into the lower tax bracket and although the 30-35mpg mixed fuel consumption isn't that stellar compared with the F car's efforts, it's perfectly acceptable for the low miles I do these days and can still give me up to 40mpg on a decent run. Parts are not expensive. Oil service with filters is about £150. Brake pads are the same price as as those on my mum's Peugeot and the discs on the back lasted 100k miles.
There've been a few repairs:
97k miles the boot started leaking. After a few attempts at diagnosis (which involved my indie climbing in the boot while his pal hosed the car with water!) it turned out to be a perished rubber grommet in the spare wheel well. £5 of sealant later, fixed.
100k was a big milestone, celebrated by the starter motor dying shortly after. £150 for a new one, fitted by my friendly indie. The only time in nearly years of ownership it went off on a low loader...
103k both rear PDC sensors died. Here's where an indie really comes into his own - the stealers charge around £150 for each one, plus fitting and VAT. My bloke got them on eBay (he says exactly the same ones, but not in a BMW box) for £20, plus £15 to paint and a tenner to fit. They've worked perfectly.
104k the driver side fog lamp misted up. Indie suspected water had got in from perhaps driving through a flood and nothing we did fixed it so I replaced the whole unit (non OEM part from ECP £37 plus £15 fitting, fitted perfectly.)
Tyres are what you make them. I use OEM P Zeros and got some new ones on the back 18 months ago. As I'm self-building a new house I didn't want to spank £600 for new ones on the front around Xmas last year so found two part worns on eBay (no repairs though, just worn - that was a must) for £99 each. Despite the dire warnings of death from PHers they've been on since then and have barely worn at all so I'm very happy.
The car is now on 118k miles and is still pretty much perfect. It has lived on a farm for the last year while our house is being built and I've given up trying to keep her tiptop cosmetically as the track in is full of muddy potholes and crap. When we complete later this year and funds allow I will spend a bit to get her up to speed including:
-paint repair under the driver side door mirror where the paint has peeled off.
-wheel refurb as all of them look okay from a distance but have corroded inside the wheel/curbing etc.
-sort out the oxidised bright work around the windows.
-leather feed and new carpet mats (self build is a muddy thing)
-steering wheel retracts but won't go up or down (usually needs a strip down and new teeth on the cog as you can hear the motor running, according to my wise indie)
-front driver side PDC occasionally thinks something is in the way when it isn't. Needs replacing.
-DPF will need doing next year - will worry about that when it happens.
-all round machine polish and paint correction to rectify 9 years of Polish hand washes and the crap paint job done to the front wing by a local coachworks when I thumped a bollard at our local Sainsburys.
Not a peep out of her in the depths of winter:
And in the height of summer (pictured here on my drive-to-be)
I'm 40 next year, and I plan to reward myself with an F01 on the 14th December. If you want a well looked after, one owner plus BMW management car looked after by the most knowledgable ex-BMW Master Technician in the country then you'll er, have to wait a bit longer
The car is still with me, having outlived three car changes for my wife since it arrived in December 2007 - a BINI One, a Z4 and now a 325i E92 M Sport. In fact, we're already talking about moving on the E92 yet the trusty 7er is proving impossible to replace as it's just so damn good. It'll be 9 in December and a few years ago, if someone told me I'd be running around in a near-decade old motor I'd have laughed in their face but inside it doesn't squeak or rattle, it drives exactly the way it did when I rolled out of the BMW stealer when it was 23 months old and even now almost 8 years after first sliding behind that big steering wheel (which retracts out of your way, of course) it still feels like a special place to spend time.
With that in mind, the only car I hanker after is an F01 7er and bearing in mind I'd need to pony up £25k for one that's sufficiently new and toyed up to want to make the jump, the trigger so far has not been pulled while the E65 supplies such effortless, fully paid up, and by now fully depreciated motoring.
It's not been an expensive car to run, either. As a December '05 car, it sneaks into the lower tax bracket and although the 30-35mpg mixed fuel consumption isn't that stellar compared with the F car's efforts, it's perfectly acceptable for the low miles I do these days and can still give me up to 40mpg on a decent run. Parts are not expensive. Oil service with filters is about £150. Brake pads are the same price as as those on my mum's Peugeot and the discs on the back lasted 100k miles.
There've been a few repairs:
97k miles the boot started leaking. After a few attempts at diagnosis (which involved my indie climbing in the boot while his pal hosed the car with water!) it turned out to be a perished rubber grommet in the spare wheel well. £5 of sealant later, fixed.
100k was a big milestone, celebrated by the starter motor dying shortly after. £150 for a new one, fitted by my friendly indie. The only time in nearly years of ownership it went off on a low loader...
103k both rear PDC sensors died. Here's where an indie really comes into his own - the stealers charge around £150 for each one, plus fitting and VAT. My bloke got them on eBay (he says exactly the same ones, but not in a BMW box) for £20, plus £15 to paint and a tenner to fit. They've worked perfectly.
104k the driver side fog lamp misted up. Indie suspected water had got in from perhaps driving through a flood and nothing we did fixed it so I replaced the whole unit (non OEM part from ECP £37 plus £15 fitting, fitted perfectly.)
Tyres are what you make them. I use OEM P Zeros and got some new ones on the back 18 months ago. As I'm self-building a new house I didn't want to spank £600 for new ones on the front around Xmas last year so found two part worns on eBay (no repairs though, just worn - that was a must) for £99 each. Despite the dire warnings of death from PHers they've been on since then and have barely worn at all so I'm very happy.
The car is now on 118k miles and is still pretty much perfect. It has lived on a farm for the last year while our house is being built and I've given up trying to keep her tiptop cosmetically as the track in is full of muddy potholes and crap. When we complete later this year and funds allow I will spend a bit to get her up to speed including:
-paint repair under the driver side door mirror where the paint has peeled off.
-wheel refurb as all of them look okay from a distance but have corroded inside the wheel/curbing etc.
-sort out the oxidised bright work around the windows.
-leather feed and new carpet mats (self build is a muddy thing)
-steering wheel retracts but won't go up or down (usually needs a strip down and new teeth on the cog as you can hear the motor running, according to my wise indie)
-front driver side PDC occasionally thinks something is in the way when it isn't. Needs replacing.
-DPF will need doing next year - will worry about that when it happens.
-all round machine polish and paint correction to rectify 9 years of Polish hand washes and the crap paint job done to the front wing by a local coachworks when I thumped a bollard at our local Sainsburys.
Not a peep out of her in the depths of winter:
And in the height of summer (pictured here on my drive-to-be)
I'm 40 next year, and I plan to reward myself with an F01 on the 14th December. If you want a well looked after, one owner plus BMW management car looked after by the most knowledgable ex-BMW Master Technician in the country then you'll er, have to wait a bit longer
Edited by bennyboydurham on Monday 16th June 19:43
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