Caymen gen 2 - white smoke on start up - HELP!!!
Discussion
Dear PH
Just bought a gen2 09 plate Cayman, 6.5k miles on the clock and running amazing - apart from white smoke sometimes spewing from the exhaust on start up!!
The smoke seems to come out when i start from warm (rather than hot or cold) and its definitely smoke not vapour. Its intermitent and does not smoke when i'm driving, just on start up - but it looks bad!!
The car was just serviced before i picked it up and when i took it back they thought they had probably overfilled the oil and drained some out, but it got confusing when they said that they had done an oil flush and the oil level would show low for now until the oil was fully circulated - its still showing low even after a 20 mile journey.
I've read some pretty scary threads about piston rings etc, anyone heard of this problem and did it get resolved??
Any help appreciated.
Premio
Just bought a gen2 09 plate Cayman, 6.5k miles on the clock and running amazing - apart from white smoke sometimes spewing from the exhaust on start up!!
The smoke seems to come out when i start from warm (rather than hot or cold) and its definitely smoke not vapour. Its intermitent and does not smoke when i'm driving, just on start up - but it looks bad!!
The car was just serviced before i picked it up and when i took it back they thought they had probably overfilled the oil and drained some out, but it got confusing when they said that they had done an oil flush and the oil level would show low for now until the oil was fully circulated - its still showing low even after a 20 mile journey.
I've read some pretty scary threads about piston rings etc, anyone heard of this problem and did it get resolved??
Any help appreciated.
Premio
Edited by premio on Saturday 11th June 19:24
The current oil level (after the chap drained it today) shows very low - 1 bar out of 4 (or 5, can't remember) on the oil guage. The bloke who drained the oil said this would show low and that i should top up after my next run - but it still smoked even after the oil was drained and refilled (to make sure it wasnt overfilled originally).
I've been doing some digging around the internet and it makes throughly depressing reading, there is some bloke who has waged some kind of crusade after his cayman started to smoke upon start up, and has gone to great lengths to pull the engine apart and identify what he believes is the problem (valve guides wearing quickly on all 09 Boxsters and Cayman 2.9s), but its hard to work out if this is just one of those people out to prove a point and therefore will insist there is a problem just to win an e-war -
http://www.planet-9.com/cayman-boxster-problems-co...
and
http://www.planet-9.com/cayman-boxster-problems-co...
The problem seems to be with 09 plate 2.9 Cayman and Boxsters only (and mines an 09), and does not seem to affect the 3.4
I'm totally gutted really as i have just stepped out of a BMW that ran like a dream and was hoping to go for an upgrade, and in 1 day of ownership i've had 3 massive clouds of white smoke, and an internet full of horror stories
I am really not sure what to do, the car is 2 months out of Porsche manufacturers warranty, and due to being mighty skint until payday i don't dare take it to a Porsche main dealer in case they sting me with a bill. The dealer i bought it from provides a 6 month extended warranty, but no way will they want to get involved with this, and will probably just point it to "normal for a flat 6" as this seems to be an accpeted answer, but there does appear to be an actual design fault with the car.
My ideal situ right now would be to return the car, i really cant be dealing with a car that puffs white smoke (really badly) upon start up from warm, and just go and buy a new shape Z4 or something instead.
What would everyone else do?
I dont blame the dealer BTW, they have been very friendly and i doubt they would have bought in a car to sell if they knew it had this problem, but its just very annoying!
I've been doing some digging around the internet and it makes throughly depressing reading, there is some bloke who has waged some kind of crusade after his cayman started to smoke upon start up, and has gone to great lengths to pull the engine apart and identify what he believes is the problem (valve guides wearing quickly on all 09 Boxsters and Cayman 2.9s), but its hard to work out if this is just one of those people out to prove a point and therefore will insist there is a problem just to win an e-war -
http://www.planet-9.com/cayman-boxster-problems-co...
and
http://www.planet-9.com/cayman-boxster-problems-co...
The problem seems to be with 09 plate 2.9 Cayman and Boxsters only (and mines an 09), and does not seem to affect the 3.4
I'm totally gutted really as i have just stepped out of a BMW that ran like a dream and was hoping to go for an upgrade, and in 1 day of ownership i've had 3 massive clouds of white smoke, and an internet full of horror stories
I am really not sure what to do, the car is 2 months out of Porsche manufacturers warranty, and due to being mighty skint until payday i don't dare take it to a Porsche main dealer in case they sting me with a bill. The dealer i bought it from provides a 6 month extended warranty, but no way will they want to get involved with this, and will probably just point it to "normal for a flat 6" as this seems to be an accpeted answer, but there does appear to be an actual design fault with the car.
My ideal situ right now would be to return the car, i really cant be dealing with a car that puffs white smoke (really badly) upon start up from warm, and just go and buy a new shape Z4 or something instead.
What would everyone else do?
I dont blame the dealer BTW, they have been very friendly and i doubt they would have bought in a car to sell if they knew it had this problem, but its just very annoying!
Edited by premio on Saturday 11th June 19:10
Edited by premio on Saturday 11th June 19:23
Can you clarify the timeline please?
You bought the car and it had been given a service before you picked it up. Who did the service? An OPC? The dealer?
Was the white smoke evident from the moment you collected the car or hss it just started (or got worse) in recent days? Did you not notice it on the test drive?
It also sounds like you haven't actually spoken to your dealer about this problem yet. If it were me they would be my first port of call, not least because a)) they did the oil change (I'm presuming this)) and b) the warranty you have is through them.
My concern personally would be that if they are not used to dealing with Porsches, or made a mistake with the oil change, that you might've been driving around with low oil since the service.
You bought the car and it had been given a service before you picked it up. Who did the service? An OPC? The dealer?
Was the white smoke evident from the moment you collected the car or hss it just started (or got worse) in recent days? Did you not notice it on the test drive?
It also sounds like you haven't actually spoken to your dealer about this problem yet. If it were me they would be my first port of call, not least because a)) they did the oil change (I'm presuming this)) and b) the warranty you have is through them.
My concern personally would be that if they are not used to dealing with Porsches, or made a mistake with the oil change, that you might've been driving around with low oil since the service.
Hi Durzel,
The timeline was as follows:
Picked up the car today at 10am (porsche specialist dealer, not main)
noticed a puff of smoke (bad one, filled up my car park!) when i started it about midday
noticed another puff of smoke about 3pm (not as bad, but still bad enough to cover the car!)
took it straight back to the dealer who thought it was probs over filled oil, and they drained and refilled - and when we started the car there was another puff of smoke!
I had test driven it during the week and there was no problem, and they serviced it on Thursday whilst waiting for me to collect it.
I have also just mailed the previous owner (got his email from an advert) and he reckons he hadnt spotted any smoke issues previously, however from a few other forums there does seem to be a recognised problem with the early gen2 caymans - for example no one is reporting these smoke problems with later caymens or early gen 2 3.4 caymens.
I am not sure i could live with the problem - its actually mega embarrasing starting the car in public now and thats now way to have to put up with a nice car!
The timeline was as follows:
Picked up the car today at 10am (porsche specialist dealer, not main)
noticed a puff of smoke (bad one, filled up my car park!) when i started it about midday
noticed another puff of smoke about 3pm (not as bad, but still bad enough to cover the car!)
took it straight back to the dealer who thought it was probs over filled oil, and they drained and refilled - and when we started the car there was another puff of smoke!
I had test driven it during the week and there was no problem, and they serviced it on Thursday whilst waiting for me to collect it.
I have also just mailed the previous owner (got his email from an advert) and he reckons he hadnt spotted any smoke issues previously, however from a few other forums there does seem to be a recognised problem with the early gen2 caymans - for example no one is reporting these smoke problems with later caymens or early gen 2 3.4 caymens.
I am not sure i could live with the problem - its actually mega embarrasing starting the car in public now and thats now way to have to put up with a nice car!
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Hi, yes i know you're right. Its also hard to judge if people like me are being over dramatic, and i go get that there will always be a bit pf smoke from car exhausts under certain conditions, however i have never seen anything as bad as this, and even as a porsche dealer himself he clearly hadnt either as none of his other porsches that he was selling do the same to that extent (being flat 6's too), and i suspect if my PX car had massive amounts of smoke on start up he wouldnt touch it with a barge pole (understandable)I'm really not sure what to do right now!
Does anyone have the email of porsche GB just so i can mail them to get their advice / see what they come up with??
thanks everyone for your answers so far.
If it wasn't doing it on the test drive and it is doing it now then that imo would point squarely to something having changed, and since the dealer is the only place that has touched it I would be chasing them quite hard to sort it out.
It doesn't sound normal to me that a prestige car would be covered in a blanket of smoke when you start it up, as you say it is faintly embarassing. That said it does sound like flat sixes do puff smoke normally as well.
Porsche GB will probably say that it should've been serviced by an OPC and/or that it is out of warranty I'm afraid to say, but it's worth a shot.
It doesn't sound normal to me that a prestige car would be covered in a blanket of smoke when you start it up, as you say it is faintly embarassing. That said it does sound like flat sixes do puff smoke normally as well.
Porsche GB will probably say that it should've been serviced by an OPC and/or that it is out of warranty I'm afraid to say, but it's worth a shot.
Durzel said:
If it wasn't doing it on the test drive and it is doing it now then that imo would point squarely to something having changed, and since the dealer is the only place that has touched it I would be chasing them quite hard to sort it out.
It doesn't sound normal to me that a prestige car would be covered in a blanket of smoke when you start it up, as you say it is faintly embarassing. That said it does sound like flat sixes do puff smoke normally as well.
Porsche GB will probably say that it should've been serviced by an OPC and/or that it is out of warranty I'm afraid to say, but it's worth a shot.
Thanks Durzel,It doesn't sound normal to me that a prestige car would be covered in a blanket of smoke when you start it up, as you say it is faintly embarassing. That said it does sound like flat sixes do puff smoke normally as well.
Porsche GB will probably say that it should've been serviced by an OPC and/or that it is out of warranty I'm afraid to say, but it's worth a shot.
Yes the warranty issue is one i need to think about, the cars have a 20,000 mile / 2 year schedule and it turned 2 in June, the dealer did the first serivce just outside of the 2 years, so either way they would possibly use this againstt me, the car has only done 6,250 miles tho so they may give me some grace.
I'd quite happily take my cayman to a porsche centre for another service anyway at my cost, if anything just so i feel happy the right amount of oil is in there. I may well do that at the end of the month on payday (skint right now from the purchase!)
I'm not sure what Porsche are like with customer service / slighgtly out of warranty issues, BMW and Renault both sorted probs for me with no hesitation, so we'll see!
To give an idea of the amount of smoke (if this helps), this dude made a vid of his gen 2 at start up and its exactly the same amount of smoke i'd say:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Be53GbAiWpo
Would this look like the normal amount for a flat 6, or other porsches under "normal" circumstances?
thanks
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Be53GbAiWpo
Would this look like the normal amount for a flat 6, or other porsches under "normal" circumstances?
thanks
My wife's 2005 987 Boxster occasionally smokes on start up, my old 996 GT3 occasionally smoked on start up, then my 997 C2S Gen 1 occasionally smoked on start up and my Gen II 997 GTS occasionally smokes on start up... I can see a pattern evolving here. Never been an issue it's just a design characteristic of the engine 
premio said:
Yes the warranty issue is one i need to think about, the cars have a 20,000 mile / 2 year schedule and it turned 2 in June, the dealer did the first serivce just outside of the 2 years, so either way they would possibly use this againstt me, the car has only done 6,250 miles tho so they may give me some grace.
Porsche GB will be less inclined to help with repair costs since (1) the first service was not on time; and (2) a non OPC did the service.If the oil level gauge is the same as my Gen 2 Cayman S then it will only give the read out with the engine idling and it tells you how long this will take depending on how hot the engine is.After an oil change it must surely be either all bars showing or at worst upto the one below full.My car sometimes blows a little smoke when its been in the garage a few days,especially if I had taken it out of the garage but only left it on the drive a while before putting it away again.
All of my previous Porsche did this as well.
In my view the first port of call must be the supplying dealer.
All of my previous Porsche did this as well.
In my view the first port of call must be the supplying dealer.
Don't get too upset about it, it might be nothing. Mine smokes sometimes too, and at time where there seems to be no explanation for it (i.e. warm day, not driven hard, not standing for long). I asked the dealer and they gave me the 'flat-6 engine' explanation that others have already posted. As far as I'm concerned it's completely random, the car is on warranty and I've drawn the dealer's attention to it.
As for the embarassment, I agree it looks a bit awkward, but remember you're the one driving away in the Porsche
As for the embarassment, I agree it looks a bit awkward, but remember you're the one driving away in the Porsche
Sorry in a rush so just skimmed read the thread, apologies if I've misinterpreted your posts...
I'd be a bit worried about the oil reading - why would that not show at least near the middle of the bars after 20 miles of driving - can anyone shed light on this???
I'd also be worried by the competency of the garage who, if I read correctly, serviced your car and then when you came back drained the oil and refilled to make sure they put the right quantity in??? I mean wtf - this is basics!
Personally I'd just take it to a proper indy specialist to check the oil firstly and then tackle the smoking issue thereafter (they might be related, but low oil would screw everything)...
I'd be a bit worried about the oil reading - why would that not show at least near the middle of the bars after 20 miles of driving - can anyone shed light on this???
I'd also be worried by the competency of the garage who, if I read correctly, serviced your car and then when you came back drained the oil and refilled to make sure they put the right quantity in??? I mean wtf - this is basics!
Personally I'd just take it to a proper indy specialist to check the oil firstly and then tackle the smoking issue thereafter (they might be related, but low oil would screw everything)...
Could this be what was described to me as the oil separator? Replaced on both my and my pal's 996s coincidentally after excessive white smoke post service. This resulted in LOTS of smoke on start up, not the traditional puff we all see as part of the flat six characteristics. Different engine I know and I don't profess to be an expert. Wasn't an expensive fix if I don't think.
OP, suggest you try and resolve this with the supplying dealer asap. I can't see Porsche gb assisting for reasons outlined above - car serviced late and not by their dealer network.
Good luck.
OP, suggest you try and resolve this with the supplying dealer asap. I can't see Porsche gb assisting for reasons outlined above - car serviced late and not by their dealer network.
Good luck.
Calm ...
This is normal for a DFI type engine.
You are seeing oil that is from the crankcase pressure that is recirculate back in to the intake ... this is for emission reasons.
When we first saw this on the RS4s(even very bad smoke) nothing was found to be wrong.
HTH
This is normal for a DFI type engine.
You are seeing oil that is from the crankcase pressure that is recirculate back in to the intake ... this is for emission reasons.
When we first saw this on the RS4s(even very bad smoke) nothing was found to be wrong.
HTH
Edited by Andyuk911 on Monday 13th June 12:14
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