Has your 996 or 997 engine had a major rebuild?

[ChrisW.]

The Cayman and Boxster are similarly afflicted ... I'm not in these figures only because my Cayman was neither a 996 or a 997. It was a 3.4 987 !

[Andyoz]

AwfulAutoMan said:

Andyoz said:

Hi, I've actually driven that car.

I'm in NI and was in a similar boat. Have you considered the Cayman S as a firsr step into Porsche ownership? It's what I've done.

Nice gen 2 987's are well within your budget - like this potentially good example if you don't mind a flight to England.

http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/2019...

Edited by Andyoz on Saturday 23 November 09:59

Hi mate,

Going for a test drive in it tomorrow, be glad and appreciative to hear your opinion of it or anything that stood out.

Yeah I thought about the cayman S but it's the 911 that I of course really want and generally its going to be a second car for myself mostly not a daily driver, only when the misses wants the daily for herself for the day.

Thanks for the input

I'd still recommend trying a Cayman S if you haven't already. You're talking a circa 2011 987.2 for the same money as that 911. Feel free to pm me.

[BubblesNW]

ChrisW. said:

The Cayman and Boxster are similarly afflicted ... I'm not in these figures only because my Cayman was neither a 996 or a 997. It was a 3.4 987 !

It’s only the 987.1 Boxsters and Caymans that are affected, the 987.2 and 997.2 are all ok

[ChrisW.]

Agreed .. in racing the 3.8 Gen 2 engine in the GT4 Clubsport has been incredibly reliable. Cooling the mid engine has been a problem, oil temperatures have run up to 150C ... the race teams disconnected the oil temperature warning and just chased the oil after each race / meet ??

As far as I am aware there have still been no failures (unlike GT3 !!)

Hence the on-going use of this engine in the current GT4 Clubsport ... with slicks.

[BertBert]

wow, I didn't think that engine worked at 150 degrees!

[m444ttb]

EGTE said:

Unfortunately there seems to be a real glut of 996 engine-failures coming up on 911uk.com right now.

Do you think that's due to the car going/having recently gone through one of those transitional phases of ownership? Or perhaps just an age thing as most must be 100k+ now. I remember from my years on the BMW scene how E36 and E46 M3s both went through a period of ownership where they were cheap enough to buy by the sort of people that would rather spend money on tat like heavy 20" wheels then run them on st tyres and not bother to service them. Both seem to pop back out the other side of that.

[hartech]

If you want to know more about these failures and know a bit about engines or engineering and enjoy a long technical read - then contact our Sharon om [e-mail] and she will send you everything you could want to know - which hopefully will put some readers minds at rest and give others food for thought.

They are great cars with generally reliable engines that are cheap to run and if they do go wrong there are alternatives to consider.

Baz

[m444ttb]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

My crank bearings were just down to copper at c.90k miles. One of the reasons I was glad to have decided to go all in on the rebuild

[Andyoz]

Andyoz said:

AwfulAutoMan said:

Andyoz said:

Hi, I've actually driven that car.

I'm in NI and was in a similar boat. Have you considered the Cayman S as a firsr step into Porsche ownership? It's what I've done.

Nice gen 2 987's are well within your budget - like this potentially good example if you don't mind a flight to England.

http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/2019...

Edited by Andyoz on Saturday 23 November 09:59

Hi mate,

Going for a test drive in it tomorrow, be glad and appreciative to hear your opinion of it or anything that stood out.

Yeah I thought about the cayman S but it's the 911 that I of course really want and generally its going to be a second car for myself mostly not a daily driver, only when the misses wants the daily for herself for the day.

Thanks for the input

I'd still recommend trying a Cayman S if you haven't already. You're talking a circa 2011 987.2 for the same money as that 911. Feel free to pm me.

Did you see this one listed. 2009 so should be the updated 385hp engine.

1 owner, low miles. Won't be cheap...wish dealer would just state that bloody price!

http://www.wilsonmotors.co.uk/listing/09-porsche-c...

[MGR]

911 997.1 c2s rebuild due to bore scoring.

[CAP3200]

The problems with my 2005 C2S began at 89k on the clock with a big chunk of white smoke coming out of the righthand side whilst on the German autobahn. The car was taken to Porsche Center Kiel, who immediately suspected scored cylinders. After a check this was confirmed.

I took it to a Danish indy Porsche specialist, gave me the good news that it was only oil separator (Eur 3.5k repair). I had that changed, drove 800 km, then the ticking noice began, took it directly back, and cylinder 6 was scored. Had that done (Eur 12k repair w/discount bc of the first repair), drove 1000 km, then my lefthand side was complete black of soot. Took it back to the indy, turned out there was an issue with cylinder 3 - faulty piston ring - had that changed in under the warranty of the repair.

Soot issue persists after approx 200 km. Suffice to say I am a bit tired of Porsches.

My 1st gen Cayenne S was a nightmare of electrical issues.

[Rossco196x]

my 997 3.8 had bore scoring on the right hand bank, 63k miles on a 2004. The small IMS bearing was OK though but i opted to have the very later big bearing c/w the later modified shaft. Hartech carried out a full rebuild including 6 liners , bottom end and chains etc with head job also

[Fish1967]

Unfortunately I did not hard rev the engine and check for smoke when I bought it. TW*T

[Mariosbt]

Rossco196x said:

my 997 3.8 had bore scoring on the right hand bank, 63k miles on a 2004. The small IMS bearing was OK though but i opted to have the very later big bearing c/w the later modified shaft. Hartech carried out a full rebuild including 6 liners , bottom end and chains etc with head job also

When was the rebuild done and at what cost ? if you don’t mind sharing that info.

[N111BJG]

II bought my 997 at a Mannheim Auction in July 2018, I'm reasonably surely it had been in non specialist dealer network for some time. My online search brought up a photo on Carzana dating from late 2017 with a sticker price of £29,995. But it had been serviced in April, I wonder why ? Maybe sold & returned to dealer ?

I researched 997's & found it could well have engine troubles, maybe bore scoring issues. I found that there was a range of options of how to fix them and if so I'd want to be part of decision process of what needed to be done. Sure enough on start up and following round auction block I was convinced this 997 was a little poorly. But it looked very nice in Cobalt blue with GT3 style wheels, full grey leather, PASM, sports chrono etc etc. 66,000 miles. There was me & one other guy interested, he was a dealer. I know I should have stuck to my limit, but it’s a very pretty car. Find another one as they say.

I took mine to a local specialist who I knew personally anyway. They did a check & said it did have scoring but would keep going for a year or two but not to go too mad on the revs / load and keep an eye on the oil usage. Nothing much happened over the next 3,000 miles, no worse smoke, no more rattling, no real oil usage, but I was driving it more gingerly than I wanted to.

I decided that I loved the car and would bite the bullet. I was introduced to Charlie at William Francis and he agreed to take out the engine, ship it to Hartech for a full rebuild and then re-install, plus a few other bits & bobs, a full service, replace the hoses, service gearbox etc etc. It was gone for two months, then there was 1000 miles running in & oil change, now after a bit longer it drives beautifully.

Money wise I’m happy. I always figure that my weekend car is always going to cost me around £100 a week in either depreciation or maintenance or mix of the two. My man maths says that over my first three years ownership I’ll have zero depreciation & have a car with a good engine & nice backstory. Even though it was an auction car it had a full history with loads of paperwork

To be honest I would not want to buy a 997 any other way. I know exactly what has been done by two reputable specialists who I'd recommend to anyone. Its not been cheap, but it’s worth it to me.

[Mariosbt]

N111BJG said:

II bought my 997 at a Mannheim Auction in July 2018, I'm reasonably surely it had been in non specialist dealer network for some time. My online search brought up a photo on Carzana dating from late 2017 with a sticker price of £29,995. But it had been serviced in April, I wonder why ? Maybe sold & returned to dealer ?

I researched 997's & found it could well have engine troubles, maybe bore scoring issues. I found that there was a range of options of how to fix them and if so I'd want to be part of decision process of what needed to be done. Sure enough on start up and following round auction block I was convinced this 997 was a little poorly. But it looked very nice in Cobalt blue with GT3 style wheels, full grey leather, PASM, sports chrono etc etc. 66,000 miles. There was me & one other guy interested, he was a dealer. I know I should have stuck to my limit, but it’s a very pretty car. Find another one as they say.

I took mine to a local specialist who I knew personally anyway. They did a check & said it did have scoring but would keep going for a year or two but not to go too mad on the revs / load and keep an eye on the oil usage. Nothing much happened over the next 3,000 miles, no worse smoke, no more rattling, no real oil usage, but I was driving it more gingerly than I wanted to.

I decided that I loved the car and would bite the bullet. I was introduced to Charlie at William Francis and he agreed to take out the engine, ship it to Hartech for a full rebuild and then re-install, plus a few other bits & bobs, a full service, replace the hoses, service gearbox etc etc. It was gone for two months, then there was 1000 miles running in & oil change, now after a bit longer it drives beautifully.

Money wise I’m happy. I always figure that my weekend car is always going to cost me around £100 a week in either depreciation or maintenance or mix of the two. My man maths says that over my first three years ownership I’ll have zero depreciation & have a car with a good engine & nice backstory. Even though it was an auction car it had a full history with loads of paperwork

To be honest I would not want to buy a 997 any other way. I know exactly what has been done by two reputable specialists who I'd recommend to anyone. Its not been cheap, but it’s worth it to me.

What was the total cost of the rebuild? If you don’t mind me asking.

Why didn’t you just take the car to Hartech?

[DRH986]

N111BJG said:

Nothing much happened over the next 3,000 miles, no worse smoke, no more rattling, no real oil usage

What was the oil usage over the 3000 miles, and was bore scoring actually confirmed? I've paid close attention to the bore scoring problem for many years and never heard of a case that didn't involve high oil consumption.

[N111BJG]

DRH986 said:

N111BJG said:

Nothing much happened over the next 3,000 miles, no worse smoke, no more rattling, no real oil usage

What was the oil usage over the 3000 miles, and was bore scoring actually confirmed? I've paid close attention to the bore scoring problem for many years and never heard of a case that didn't involve high oil consumption.

Yes there was a full inspection done at my friends workshop, I watched the horoscope inspection (it predicted the future for this engine). It was in the early to mid stages of wear. I decided to find out if I liked the car enough to spend the money it needed, so I treated the the engine gently, no short runs & no caning it, hence oil use was not too bad at around 500-600 miles per litre. It smoked on start up & rattled like hell, but no significant deterioration over those 3000 miles. I reckon it would have soldiered on for years like that. But that’s not what I wanted.

Giving rebuild costs is a bit misleading because when the engine was stripped down Grant at Hartech gave me a range of options. I regarded just sorting the scored cylinders as a repair to sort the current problem. Whereas I wanted the engine life to be reset to ‘as new’ expectations. Hence a full rebuild with all internal gubbins refreshed. Same with ancillary’s and there was preventative work done too. I could have maybe spent £4-5k less. Of course I had the benefit of a bigger repair budget as a predecessor took the financial hit. Overall I spent one year of my notional budget, say £5k, plus the purchase ‘discount’ which was £9k. Later this year wheel refurb plus tyres, next year new hood & hardtop. Also replace PCM, I was looking at Pioneer, but the Porsche option is tempting, but rather pricey.

I expect there are many others that would have approached this differently. I took this route as I didn’t want to inherit someone else’s decision. I wanted to make my own, admittedly with expert & trusted advice. But that’s what I should do, as that’s how I make my living.

[hartech]

Our facebook page shows pictures of a close call on crank bearings in a Cayman S. Rest of the engine OK (luckily including the crank) but bronze just starting to show through.

I'll try and post a picture here as well.

Baz

[hartech]