997 Gen 1 or Gen 2 - what to buy?

[mollytherocker]

mrobbie79 said:

...because my budget started at £30k, and increased to £35k to try to buy something newer and avoid the early engine issues. This has brought me to the point of gen 2 models coming into play.

Its certainly not usually wise to stretch your budget, but it depends on your own individual financial and personal circumstances.

What I would say is that a Gen 2 could be a cheaper overall ownership cost.

Its not just about the purchase price.

[David W.]

FWIW just had a week hooning around Scotland in a Gen 1 C4s cab manual, if I'd have spent as much again and had a 991 I'd not have had any more fun. Fab cars one and all.
dw

[drmark]

Holy thread resurrection.
My brother has just bought a 2010 Gen 2 C4s and I had my first opportunity to compare back to back with our Gen 1 4s. And, engine noise aside, the Gen 2 is a much better car
Better steering feel, more grunt, and nicer interior. Plus no engine paranoia.
Gen 2 if you can run to one.

Edited by drmark on Thursday 18th December 07:41

[TorqueDirty]

Double Holy thread resurrection!

I'm having the same debate, and given the strength of the prices my realistic choice is between a Gen 1 C2S and a Gen 1 C2 (might also look at the equivalent 4wd version as I'm in Scotland). Any choice would have to be manual and a coupé.

So given that a year had gone by what is the latest opinion regarding the relative merits of the Gen 1 C2S vs the Gen 2 C2?

My gut is telling me Gen 2 base model since there is not much in it in terms of power and of course there is the huge plus of the more reliable engine (true right?). If I am honest a small part of me might miss having the S on the back of the car but my main priority is getting the best car I can for the money whilst still ensuring I get a superb 911 driving experience.

Not many reviews around about the Gen 2 C2 with manual gearbox (everyone focusses on the S) but the few that I have read hint that the C2 is a cracking car and in some ways may be a better option if you are not interested in tracking it. (not sure I buy this but willing to be convinced)

If I could afford a Gen 2 C2S with the right spec then this would probably be the choice but boy the prices are strong - certainly nothing under 40k that I can see.

TD

[g7jhp]

997.2 prices are strong for a reason, engine reliability. They're only set to get stronger as Gen 1 cars drop as they become ineligible for warranty.

The 997.2 was also bought in smaller numbers due to the 2008 financial crisis, so there are more limited numbers than the Gen 1.

[TorqueDirty]

g7jhp said:

The 997.2 was also bought in smaller numbers due to the 2008 financial crisis, so there are more limited numbers than the Gen 1.

Interesting - I had not considered that. Makes a lot of sense, despite this not really being what I wanted to hear given the implications on used prices!

[bigkeeko]

TorqueDirty said:

. Any choice would have to be manual and a coupé.

So given that a year had gone by what is the latest opinion regarding the relative merits of the Gen 1 C2S vs the Gen 2 C2?

My gut is telling me Gen 2 base




TD

I,ve just went through the exact same scenario you're in. For what it's worth I viewed/tried the various cars before buying what was right for me.
997.1 C2 - Beautiful car in beautiful condition with low miles but lacked the 'spark' I craved. Maybe I didn't give the car a chance It's still for sale. 997.1 C2S (as passenger) . Didn't appear to offer any more go than the C2 and wasn't in as good condition.
Cayman R with PDK. Now I know you said manual but it doesn't matter how hard a die hard manual fan you are these boxes are something else. The Cayman nearly had me veer off my 911 course as well. Phenomenal car and a sound investment.
997.2 C2. Didn't really open the taps on the 3.6 but felt better low down than either of the Gen 1s AND they look better. Interior, bumpers with nicer rear lights, front LEDs. That plus the DFI set up would sway me no doubt.
Incidentally I went Gen 2 C4S. Performance is head and shoulders above any Gen 1 I was in or driven and the fuel economy. ( not that it matters to me much) is pretty amazing for it is.

£35k plus gets you a low mileage mint Gen 2 C2 with a warranty. Worth a thought.

Edited by bigkeeko on Monday 7th September 10:57

[TorqueDirty]

bigkeeko said:

£35k plus gets you a low mileage mint Gen 2 C2 with a warranty. Worth a thought.

Edited by bigkeeko on Monday 7th September 10:57

Thanks bigkeeko.

Any thoughts on what I should expect to pay for Gen 2 C2S / C4S?

[bigkeeko]

TorqueDirty said:

Thanks bigkeeko.

Any thoughts on what I should expect to pay for Gen 2 C2S / C4S?

Any C2S gen 2 cars I thought were nice and ticked my boxes were £40k and up as I was looking at 2009/2010s and wanted the best car I could get, in the best condition with the lowest miles. Any C4S models from Porsche themselves were upwards of £50k. Specialists hovering just below the £50k.
There is always going to be cheaper cars out there and a lot of people buy on price but I didn`t want to be the 6 owner of a pile of other peoples track car with rev ranges all over the shop and the last owner having `not bothered` with a service.
Condition is King. Go with your gut feeling.

[TorqueDirty]

Wow so C4S had nearly a 10k premium over the C2S at the time. Maybe it was just the cars on sale at the time.

I'd like a C4S but would not pay 10k extra form one over a C2S I don't think.

Will start to investigate more thoroughly and see what is out there.

Out of interest, what sort of wiggle room is there on OPC prices?

Cheers
TD

[g7jhp]

TorqueDirty said:

Wow so C4S had nearly a 10k premium over the C2S at the time. Maybe it was just the cars on sale at the time.

I'd like a C4S but would not pay 10k extra form one over a C2S I don't think.

Will start to investigate more thoroughly and see what is out there.

Out of interest, what sort of wiggle room is there on OPC prices?

Cheers
TD

Quick search of the PH classifieds for 997's from 2009 on shows 9 manuals, 10 automatics and 23 semi-automatics. Finding a manual car might be hard but you know it'll hold it's value as it'll be sought after by enthusiasts and numbers will be low.

[bigkeeko]

TorqueDirty said:

Wow so C4S had nearly a 10k premium over the C2S at the time. Maybe it was just the cars on sale at the time.

I'd like a C4S but would not pay 10k extra form one over a C2S I don't think.

Will start to investigate more thoroughly and see what is out there.

Out of interest, what sort of wiggle room is there on OPC prices?

Cheers
TD

No, not quite like that usually 6k ish for a similar aged car but there are many variables that affect price. I had used the Porsche search agent and there is a grey 58 plate low miles , 2 owner C2S at Tonbridge Well OPC with a 2 year approved warranty.


A year younger higher specced 20k miles 59 plate 1 owner C4S was £56k at another OPC. It`s now sold. I rang about it and was told that manual cars in that condition are out as soon as they`re in. OPC are very reluctant to budge on price but I suppose it`s different for each dealer. Good cars sell themselves.



Or have a look on 911V. Couple of nice cars (that I`ve seen in the flesh)

A gen 2 997 PDK at £38k and a 60 plate C2.

Edited by bigkeeko on Tuesday 8th September 04:32

[TorqueDirty]

bigkeeko said:

No, not quite like that usually 6k ish for a similar aged car but there are many variables that affect price. I had used the Porsche search agent and there is a grey 58 plate low miles , 2 owner C2S at Tonbridge Well OPC with a 2 year approved warranty.


A year younger higher specced 20k miles 59 plate 1 owner C4S was £56k at another OPC. It`s now sold. I rang about it and was told that manual cars in that condition are out as soon as they`re in. OPC are very reluctant to budge on price but I suppose it`s different for each dealer. Good cars sell themselves.



Or have a look on 911V. Couple of nice cars (that I`ve seen in the flesh)

A gen 2 997 PDK at £38k and a 60 plate C2.

Edited by bigkeeko on Tuesday 8th September 04:32

Ooo,

Just seen your new motor on another post. That's a cracker. Thinking the same sort of spec myself given that I'm up in Scotland too. How different does the C4S feel compared to the C2S (assuming that you have driven both in your search)?

Anyway, nice one!

TD

[bigkeeko]

TorqueDirty said:

Ooo,

Just seen your new motor on another post. That's a cracker. Thinking the same sort of spec myself given that I'm up in Scotland too. How different does the C4S feel compared to the C2S (assuming that you have driven both in your search)?

Anyway, nice one!

TD

Thanks fella. Difference wasn`t as much as some people would have you believe. Purists will mention the `Porsche `experience` but to be honest performance wise as far as a road driven car goes I didn`t notice anything. That plus I genuinely have got the Porsche experience now. I love my new car that much. The 4S feels slightly `heavier` when steering at slow speeds and very planted and stable when pushing on. FWIW I saw an Evo video showing a C2S against a C4S on a damp track. SIX seconds difference in favour of the 4 wheel drive car. Naturally the conditions suited the four.
Compared to a Gen 1 C2S the Gen 2 C4S is noticeably faster and that obviously wasn`t sending her on if you`re still considering a Gen 1 car.

I would have bought either 2S or 4S if the truth be told and bought on spec/ condition and low miles/owners.

This good reading..

http://sharkwerks.com/porsche/porsche-modification...

[Cardiff]

Interesting to see people talking about prices of these at circa £40k, now look at them!

I am in this position now, I just love the look of the Gen 2 so much more but its the same price as a brand new 991 GT3, hard ot swallow

[13m]

Cardiff said:

Interesting to see people talking about prices of these at circa £40k, now look at them!

I am in this position now, I just love the look of the Gen 2 so much more but its the same price as a brand new 991 GT3, hard ot swallow

You what?

[Magic919]

He's obviously a GT3 guy that got lost in a Carrera thread.

[Cardiff]

Yup, my bad