May be more than an RMS leak? Engine out pic. (997.1 GT3)

[ROK]

My buddy was showing off his lift and we had my 911 up on it when we noticed a bit of oil on the engine carrier bracket. Typical signs of an RMS leak, but the dealer said it may not be the RMS as the seepage may be coming from near the top of the engine?

Not sure what it may be, but my Porsche sales guy thought I'd get a kick out of seeing my engine out for the first time (10K miles, 2008).

Thoughts?

[nsm3]

Some 7.1 GT3 engines had a casting fault which can cause a leak. Mine was checked for this, but turned out to be RMS. If they can't repair/reseal it, they have to replace the engine.

There is an orange RS floating about the UK that is openly advertised as having a new engine at 14k miles - total bill 52k GBP, but done under warranty.

Edit: the fabled Mezger doesn't look much, does it?

Edited by nsm3 on Thursday 26th April 18:46

[thegoose]

nsm3 said:

7.1 GT3 ....a new engine at 14k miles - total bill 52k GBP, but done under warranty.

I know an independent that's just fitted a new "crate motor" from Porsche to a GT3 and it was around £17k + VAT (for the engine) so I'm struggling to see how on earth the supply and fitting of one could come to £52k? I know OPC labour rates are high, but there aren't that many hours in a swap out job.

[ROK]

Porsche service just called to let me know that there's a seal on the oil housing on top of the engine that was not sealing correctly (looks to be an assembly line error). The RMS was weeping a bit so they'll replace as well.

Hoping it stays leak free! Mine's still under factory warranty so nothing OOP.

[ROK]

nsm3 said:

Edit: the fabled Mezger doesn't look much, does it?

Edited by nsm3 on Thursday 26th April 18:46

It's a small engine and the power they get out of it NA is notable! I like how low the flat6 can sit. Look how flat it really is. Cool.

[nsm3]

thegoose said:

I know an independent that's just fitted a new "crate motor" from Porsche to a GT3 and it was around £17k + VAT (for the engine) so I'm struggling to see how on earth the supply and fitting of one could come to £52k? I know OPC labour rates are high, but there aren't that many hours in a swap out job.

Just going from the advert - it was at both Costellos & Nick Whales and both adverts listed the transplant as 52k with all the bills? Also remember Hammond describing the 6 GT3 engine as looking like a washing machine, which was a shame as it costs 38k?

Perhaps they are cheaper now they are no longer selling 3.6's?

[SFO]

is it standard practice to have engine out at 10k miles or 4 years old??

[drmark]

nsm3 said:

Just going from the advert - it was at both Costellos & Nick Whales and both adverts listed the transplant as 52k with all the bills? Also remember Hammond describing the 6 GT3 engine as looking like a washing machine, which was a shame as it costs 38k?

Perhaps they are cheaper now they are no longer selling 3.6's?

Neither source is that reliable! £20k much more like it.

[D900SP]

thegoose said:

I know an independent that's just fitted a new "crate motor" from Porsche to a GT3 and it was around £17k + VAT (for the engine) so I'm struggling to see how on earth the supply and fitting of one could come to £52k? I know OPC labour rates are high, but there aren't that many hours in a swap out job.

What model GT3? Prices of remanufactured or new replacement engines vary considerably.

[keep it lit]

thegoose said:

I know an independent that's just fitted a new "crate motor" from Porsche to a GT3 and it was around £17k + VAT (for the engine) so I'm struggling to see how on earth the supply and fitting of one could come to £52k? I know OPC labour rates are high, but there aren't that many hours in a swap out job.

prices are as follows;
£20k exchange
£40k no exchange

[Zyp]

Size of the exhaust!

[btcc123]

I thought that a GT3 had a racing engine and did not have a RMS on its engines like the majority of 996/997

[nsm3]

The 3.6 still has the RMS issues - not sure about 3.8/4.0 though?

Edited by nsm3 on Thursday 26th April 21:01

[xmrichar]

SFO said:

is it standard practice to have engine out at 10k miles or 4 years old??

I wondered that too! I can only assume it's designed to be easy to drop out, and thus it's cheaper for them to drop the whole thing out for easy access than try to work on it in (restricted) situ. (Says the 986 owner who hasn't been brave enough to even try to get to the engine yet!)

[keep it lit]

nsm3 said:

The 3.6 still has an RMS - not sure about 3.8/4.0 though

they all have RMS & all three sizes are near identical in looks and size other than internal displacement growth and latterly the 4.0L has a fancy crank.. but they all look the same(ish).

[khushy]

Glad its being sorted.

Totally OT I guess, my newly built Ducati 853cc conversion destroyed a water pump seal after 100 miles, the part costs £2.50 but it too is an engine out and side casing surgery - did it myself in the end after the engine builder promised me that the head gasket had blown LOL!

2 hours in the end including pulling the whole engine and remounting it - 40,000 trouble free miles ensued, then BANG - big end bearings shagged RIP 853 - it was an absolute cracker - 118bhp at the back wheel and pulled like a train from tickover.

Khushy

The conversion (from a 748) apparently cost about c£7,000 - I picked it up for £1500 incl a full titanium exhaust with 100 miles on the clock.

Edited by khushy on Thursday 26th April 21:26

[mollytherocker]

btcc123 said:

I thought that a GT3 had a racing engine and did not have a RMS on its engines like the majority of 996/997

I think you are confusing the IMS with the RMS. All engines will have a rear main seal.

MTR

[ROK]

I believe they had to drop the whole thing to get at the top of the engine and remove the plenum. I actually saw the bad seal (slightly torn). They were cool enough to let me check out the engine. Very cool beastly thing!

As I was learning more about the car, turns out the LSD units on the GT3s are quite weak in that they don't last more than 5K miles and less so if tracked. So for all of you guys with GT3s, check your LSDs! The only way to really resolve it is to go aftermarket. Either repack it with aftermarket parts or go with a completely new LSD from Guard or something like that.

I had no idea, but then they say it's nearly impossible to tell driving on the streets.

[thegoose]

The more common thing to do is replace the diff with another Porsche one - but the genuine motorsport part. Cost is similar but a bit more labour as it needs setting up correctly by someone that knows what they're doing. Job cost used to be about £1000, I would guess £1200-£1400 these days.

[puntograle]

I read many different opinions that GT3 diffs go at 5k/15k/25k miles and less so if tracked. How do you know if the diff is no longer locking? What are the symptoms? Slower acceleration from low speed?