Picking up a 991 today for a ten day test
Discussion
cardigankid said:
You're right.
It is a very fine car, no question, but as RDMCG says, it is another model, like the E-Type compared with the XK150. personally I don't care how fast it is, because what I want is the sensation of controlling a rear engined 911, and this car is not going to give me that.
As to its looks, I feel that it is dressed up as a 911, for no especially good engineering reason, but rather to convince the traditionalists that it is less of a step forward than it actually is. I burned to own a 997. I dont burn to own this. It leaves me cold.
A Cayman is probably the way forward.
I am quite impressed with it, and have no problem with the feeling of control. It is evidently less detailed in the steering, but overall, its a great package.It is a very fine car, no question, but as RDMCG says, it is another model, like the E-Type compared with the XK150. personally I don't care how fast it is, because what I want is the sensation of controlling a rear engined 911, and this car is not going to give me that.
As to its looks, I feel that it is dressed up as a 911, for no especially good engineering reason, but rather to convince the traditionalists that it is less of a step forward than it actually is. I burned to own a 997. I dont burn to own this. It leaves me cold.
A Cayman is probably the way forward.
graemel said:
This is a great read RDMcG. "a Panamera Coupe" That did make me chuckle and probably a very true analogy
I understand the analogy,but this car does not fit the description for me, except when its in touring/auto mode. When you drop it into sport plus and find a good twisty road, its a true, hardass sports car, nothing less. What its not is a retro 911, but a 458 is not a Ferrari 275GTB, and a 2012 M5 is not a first gen M5 either. I always worry about trying to look back and parse out each part of a past car that you want to immortalize. Its interesting when people talk about the superiority of the Cayman with a mid-engined architecture and others bemoan the 911 when it reduces its tail happiness when it is presumably bringing more Cayman-like handling to the 911
.The question is whether the package as a whole works for you. My guess is more appeal to a wider audience, but we will have to see how it does. Each day I drive it I like it a lot more. A lot.
HoHoHo said:
And they gave you a ten day test because...........
You'll be on the order list quicker than you can turn in a parking lot using electronic steering
Good thread, keep it coming!
Nope..I occasionally write articles for magazines. I tend to hang onto the cars I have and add one now and then. I will certainly want to think about the 991 RS but obviously its not for a while. This basic platform here seems very well designed to me, so it should be fascinating what they do with it. I am eagerly awaiting news on what replaces the Mezger engine for instance, what transmissions will be offered, and how decontented and lightened. As usual, there are people who like the C4S, Turbo and so on for their own good reasons. My personal bias is RWD naturally aspirated,though I will almost certainly go PDK. I have enough manual cars and I think its getting to the end of the line for the three pedal car. (Hopefully it will be offered for those who prefer it.)You'll be on the order list quicker than you can turn in a parking lot using electronic steering
Good thread, keep it coming!
Manks said:
Think you're right. I wasn't entirely persuaded by the PDK on the 997, but on the 991 I can see no reason to go manual.
What comes round goes round 
According to a story by USA Today, cars with manual transmissions are enjoying demand that otherwise hasn’t been so strong since 2006. In fact, 6.5 percent of new cars sold in 2012 have had manual transmissions, which is more than double that of 2007.
In 2006, however, demand stood at 7.2 percent before taking a heavy drop. Now, as demand increases, that change is making some people wonder what is causing the shift.
It can be attributed to a few shifts in market preference, some of which probably affect you. First, many consumers perceive that manual cars are more fun to drive.
Lordglenmorangie said:
What comes round goes round
According to a story by USA Today, cars with manual transmissions are enjoying demand that otherwise hasn’t been so strong since 2006. In fact, 6.5 percent of new cars sold in 2012 have had manual transmissions, which is more than double that of 2007.
In 2006, however, demand stood at 7.2 percent before taking a heavy drop. Now, as demand increases, that change is making some people wonder what is causing the shift.
It can be attributed to a few shifts in market preference, some of which probably affect you. First, many consumers perceive that manual cars are more fun to drive.
just like sunroofs have made a comeback in recent years, especially the panaromic onesAccording to a story by USA Today, cars with manual transmissions are enjoying demand that otherwise hasn’t been so strong since 2006. In fact, 6.5 percent of new cars sold in 2012 have had manual transmissions, which is more than double that of 2007.
In 2006, however, demand stood at 7.2 percent before taking a heavy drop. Now, as demand increases, that change is making some people wonder what is causing the shift.
It can be attributed to a few shifts in market preference, some of which probably affect you. First, many consumers perceive that manual cars are more fun to drive.
Lordglenmorangie said:
What comes round goes round
According to a story by USA Today,  cars with manual transmissions are enjoying demand that otherwise hasn’t been so strong since 2006. In fact, 6.5 percent of new cars sold in 2012 have had manual transmissions, which is more than double that of 2007.
In 2006, however, demand stood at 7.2 percent before taking a heavy drop. Now, as demand increases, that change is making some people wonder what is causing the shift.
It can be attributed to a few shifts in market preference, some of which probably affect you. First, many consumers perceive that manual cars are more fun to drive.
Hmmm. I still think manual cars will ultimately trend downwards in popularity.According to a story by USA Today,  cars with manual transmissions are enjoying demand that otherwise hasn’t been so strong since 2006. In fact, 6.5 percent of new cars sold in 2012 have had manual transmissions, which is more than double that of 2007.
In 2006, however, demand stood at 7.2 percent before taking a heavy drop. Now, as demand increases, that change is making some people wonder what is causing the shift.
It can be attributed to a few shifts in market preference, some of which probably affect you. First, many consumers perceive that manual cars are more fun to drive.
Manks said:
Hmmm. I still think manual cars will ultimately trend downwards in popularity.
The numbers in the US coincide with a stunning cage in the marketplace away from large V8s into small economy cars, caused by fuel prices. When you think of it, US modern cities are designed around the car,and cheap fuel. Places like Phoenix barely have sidewalks. This means that people are used to long distances. When gas goes up , combined with persistent unemployment and an ageing fleet of cars, the total impact has been this change. My sense is that the switch to manual there is part of that trend..economy, not performance.As for manuals...AMG is gone, Ferrari basically gone, BMW well on the way. In Germany very few cars are sold now with stick shifts.
Obviously, I grew up with manual..learned on a three speed column in a Hillman Minx. However, people entering the market today will be different. Manuals are huge fun when you have an empty country road or a track day. The steering is the best I have personally had on any car, including other Porsches .
Personally, driving an RS in nose-to-tail traffic on poorly maintained urban roads is not a thrilling experience. Some people are extremely skilled here at PH ( I know there are posers too), and for those with the expertise, driving on PS Cup tires in the rain is no problem; for me it is not confidence -building.
Four laps of the Nordschleife in heavy rain driving the RS.2 left me almost shaking, and when I saw a CGT written off in front of me, that was the end of my day
The RS is a niche car, more written about than sold, won just about every possible comparo for performance, but a rounding error in annual Porsche sales. I would not personally have one as an only car. I could easily see a 991 (particularly when the C4S comes) as a four season, all weather car.For those who prefer manuals for very good and valid reasons, I suspect that there will be Porsches available. I think I will move to the dark side next time. I recall when I bought the M6, my first paddle shift car, it took a while to get used to it. (the SMG transmission is very inferior to PDK, but with a bit of practice you can shift very quickly and smoothly).
Now, I jump from a paddle to manual and back and don't really notice it any more. I am just as much in control in reality......just my two bits' worth.
RDMcG said:
Manks said:
Hmmm. I still think manual cars will ultimately trend downwards in popularity.
The numbers in the US coincide with a stunning cage in the marketplace away from large V8s into small economy cars, caused by fuel prices. When you think of it, US modern cities are designed around the car,and cheap fuel. Places like Phoenix barely have sidewalks. This means that people are used to long distances. When gas goes up , combined with persistent unemployment and an ageing fleet of cars, the total impact has been this change. My sense is that the switch to manual there is part of that trend..economy, not performance.As for manuals...AMG is gone, Ferrari basically gone, BMW well on the way. In Germany very few cars are sold now with stick shifts.
Obviously, I grew up with manual..learned on a three speed column in a Hillman Minx. However, people entering the market today will be different. Manuals are huge fun when you have an empty country road or a track day. The steering is the best I have personally had on any car, including other Porsches .
Personally, driving an RS in nose-to-tail traffic on poorly maintained urban roads is not a thrilling experience. Some people are extremely skilled here at PH ( I know there are posers too), and for those with the expertise, driving on PS Cup tires in the rain is no problem; for me it is not confidence -building.
Four laps of the Nordschleife in heavy rain driving the RS.2 left me almost shaking, and when I saw a CGT written off in front of me, that was the end of my day
The RS is a niche car, more written about than sold, won just about every possible comparo for performance, but a rounding error in annual Porsche sales. I would not personally have one as an only car. I could easily see a 991 (particularly when the C4S comes) as a four season, all weather car.For those who prefer manuals for very good and valid reasons, I suspect that there will be Porsches available. I think I will move to the dark side next time. I recall when I bought the M6, my first paddle shift car, it took a while to get used to it. (the SMG transmission is very inferior to PDK, but with a bit of practice you can shift very quickly and smoothly).
Now, I jump from a paddle to manual and back and don't really notice it any more. I am just as much in control in reality......just my two bits' worth.
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