will a water cooled 911 ever appreciate ?

[james280779]

hman said:

I've hankered after a 911 since young, however I recently spoke to a colleague who advised that as a drivers car its a bit "unique" compared to a modern day sports coupe.

Something about the front bouncing up and down over fast uneven roads , understeer then snap oversteer, and a few other handling traits which thankfully we've all moved on from.

He uses his every day but even so he reckons a kettle is a much nicer everyday car, I'm now looking at a kettle instead...

I would recommend he gets his suspension looked at as mine is super smooth, in fact the sister in law last night couldnt believe how smooth and comfortable it was for an old Porsche (My brother has a 944). Having driven mine at speed I wouldnt buy one without a whale tail, over 100mph on slippery roads its invaluable at keeping the rear in check, always feel it starting to go on a bend before it hunkers back down when the wind catches it

[rlw]

rdjohn said:

As for the current GTs they tend to get hammered round tracks a lot of the time; this will tend to negate what a collector may be looking for in a car to keep as an investment, so do not expect 911SC RS type returns.

This always puzzles me about 2.7RSs. Many of these have been racing or rally cars, even rallycross cars, yet a bit of a straighten up and a coat of paint and they're worth silly money. Some of these cars have a history that makes regulat trackday use look like being driven by my grandma to the shop once a month....

I chatted to a guy at the PCGB do at Brands Hatch a few years ago. He had a rusty old 2.7RS, clearly in need of a lot of work, and he had been offered £100,000.00 for it as it stood that day. How long ago was that and what was the real cost of making the car "perfect"?

I have a very unthought through theory that these cars only reflect the actual cost of ownership over the years, so an 2.7RS bought in the early seventies has probably cost about it's current value in parts, servicing, rebuilds and restoration over nearly 40 years. I look at what my GT3 has cost to maintain over the past 4 1/2 years and in some respects its quite scary and as a percentage of the original (my) purchase price its just daft. For the car to appreciate and to simply cover the running costs over my ownership, let alone future ones, it will need to put on about £3000.00 annually. Starting today.

Fingers crossed then.

[SEE YA]

It a funny world this air and water cooled they are all Porsche's. We bought that model, because we liked it be it air or water. So there must be something that people liked, to buy one in the first place.

I bought my old 911, because it was the only one I liked and still do.
Its for me EVERY MILE IS SMILE factor.
The air cooled range of 911's has held its value well in the current climate which is a bonus.
I did not think, about that when I bought mine in 07?
I could not buy one now, for what I paid for it in 2007 that is for sure.
It could have gone the other way, like the water cooled 911's have who knows what will happen next year.
I have spent money on mine each year, even on silly things on the upkeep.

Edited by SEE YA on Wednesday 10th October 21:40

[jackal]

Every mile gives me piles.

[Crimp a Length!]

jackal said:

Every mile gives me piles.

Its them bilsteins fella, hard as rock.
Or them heated seats.

[993kimbo]

jackal said:

Every mile gives me piles.

Stop trying to save weight - put some seats in.

[jackal]

993kimbo said:

jackal said:

Every mile gives me piles.

Stop trying to save weight - put some seats in.

Preparation H mate .. its the only way

[mollytherocker]

jackal said:

Preparation H mate .. its the only way

Perpetration A through G were deemed ok, but on the hole, preparation H was the most effective.



MTR

[Carl_Docklands]

How about these three:

997 Speedster = 10 cars in uk
997 Sports Classic = 21 cars in uk
997 GT3 4.0 = 33 cars in uk

they tick all the boxes for rarity, they look good and were expensive to acquire.

i personally think the sports classic is one of the best looking 911's of all time. whether it has a bespoke engine or not is moot imo.

i don't think the 96RS will appreciate too hard because of the way it looks, same for the MK1 96GT3 and 97RS Gen 2 3.8.

[Carl_Docklands]

[marky911]

Carl_Docklands said:

i don't think the 96RS will appreciate too hard because of the way it looks, same for the MK1 96GT3 and 97RS Gen 2 3.8.

Really!? I hope you're right, as the 996GT3RS is a dream car of mine, so I'll be glad if they don't rocket out of reach. I think you'll be surprised though.

The looks thing is purely subjective. For everyone that doesn't like something, there'll be someone else who does.

As you've shown with your examples it's the numbers game that matters. That coupled with rawness/specialness secures a cars place on the desirable classics list, which in turn safeguards values.

I view the SC and the speedster as pure marketing exercises by a now very greedy Porsche, cashing in on the reputation and image of the older cars. Like I said, it's all subjective.

[Carl_Docklands]

marky911 said:

Carl_Docklands said:

i don't think the 96RS will appreciate too hard because of the way it looks, same for the MK1 96GT3 and 97RS Gen 2 3.8.

Really!? I hope you're right, as the 996GT3RS is a dream car of mine, so I'll be glad if they don't rocket out of reach. I think you'll be surprised though.

The looks thing is purely subjective. For everyone that doesn't like something, there'll be someone else who does.

As you've shown with your examples it's the numbers game that matters. That coupled with rawness/specialness secures a cars place on the desirable classics list, which in turn safeguards values.

I view the SC and the speedster as pure marketing exercises by a now very greedy Porsche, cashing in on the reputation and image of the older cars. Like I said, it's all subjective.

I don't see how a 964 speedster is any different to a 997 speedster? Neither the sports classic or the speedster were parts bin specials and cannot be replicated using a base 997, the shells are different.

I am being devils advocate though, the 996GT3RS was a watershed car but the truth is, not many people will drive a car with blue wheels, decals and a surf-board spoiler no matter how good it is to drive and this limits the appeal, that's why prices have stayed rock solid but have not really appreciated.

[jackal]

The whole thread begs the question if any cars from the mid 1990's owards have appreciated ?

Integrale and 512M are too early. How about the NSX ? Cant think of much else really.

[mollytherocker]

jackal said:

The whole thread begs the question if any cars from the mid 1990's owards have appreciated ?

Integrale and 512M are too early. How about the NSX ? Cant think of much else really.

NSX defo!
Escort Cozzy?
Clio V6?
Mk1 RS Focus on the cusp?

[OlberJ]

S1 Elise on the rise.

[james280779]

I can see TVR's rising over the forthcoming years - thats why I have bought a lovely early Chimera and garaged it. I think they are as low as they will get for a decent one.

The Griff 500 is probably the one to aim for or possibly a V8 S due to the rare factor.

Oh and the Lotus Elan too - both the 80's and 90's versions

[Steve Rance]

Of course they will. Forget what cools the engine. Passage of time, rarity and 911's always have the same result.

[bullettneil]

mollytherocker said:

NSX defo!
Escort Cozzy?
Clio V6?
Mk1 RS Focus on the cusp?

nsx are rising very slowly(i love these cars)

escort cossie..they have taken a big hit of late.the sapphire has started rising for good ones.that said the escort will go up but not for a few years.my background the last 18 years has always been rs cars so i know them well.only last year i sold my escort at a cheap price for the level of car it was.but now im in the porsche

clio v6? hmm. an odd ball car.under powered imo and dont handle great but will go up in the future i think due to rarity

mk1 focus rs.again took a massive dive but the real good ones are creeping up now due to its looks and pureness compared to the new version

[Mermaid]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

E30 BMW's are good examples ( they made 10's of thousands), and although they made 15k E30 M3's, they are well sought after.

[Slippydiff]

marky911 said:

Carl_Docklands said:

i don't think the 96RS will appreciate too hard because of the way it looks, same for the MK1 96GT3 and 97RS Gen 2 3.8.

Really!? I hope you're right, as the 996GT3RS is a dream car of mine, so I'll be glad if they don't rocket out of reach. I think you'll be surprised though.

The looks thing is purely subjective. For everyone that doesn't like something, there'll be someone else who does.

As you've shown with your examples it's the numbers game that matters. That coupled with rawness/specialness secures a cars place on the desirable classics list, which in turn safeguards values.

I view the SC and the speedster as pure marketing exercises by a now very greedy Porsche, cashing in on the reputation and image of the older cars. Like I said, it's all subjective.

On that basis this :

http://www.hwmalfaromeo.co.uk/usedcars/details.htm...

should be worth nothing . . . . . ?