Is the 991 GT3 the greatest 911 and Sportscar ever made?
Discussion
sidicks said:
No, I can understand that people have different opinions. And I can certainly understands that a racing driver has very different requirements than most normal road drivers.
However, a key part of setting up a race car must be the driver-engineer feedback and that has to be based on a relative measure - does the change make the car feel better or worse than before.
Yes he might find the car 'dreary' compared to what he is used to, yes he might feel less connected compared to his race car.
But to state the car is "dreary" (absolute measure) and "unconnected" (absolute measure) is blatantly not true, regardless of whether you're a journalist, an owner, a random man off the street or a racing driver....
Nevermind a cup car, vs a 997 GT3 nevermind the 996 GT3, it is difficult to see how the 991 gt3 will not feel 'unconnected' to someone who is used to driving those cars much less a racing driver.However, a key part of setting up a race car must be the driver-engineer feedback and that has to be based on a relative measure - does the change make the car feel better or worse than before.
Yes he might find the car 'dreary' compared to what he is used to, yes he might feel less connected compared to his race car.
But to state the car is "dreary" (absolute measure) and "unconnected" (absolute measure) is blatantly not true, regardless of whether you're a journalist, an owner, a random man off the street or a racing driver....
Weight of opinion especially from owners and journalists might be against Steve Rance here but while everyone is entitled to have their own opinion, equally not every opinion carries the same weight. I would submit that someone who has plenty of experience with the older cars opinion carries a lot more weight, to me at least. And most assuredly over some journalists who invariably talk up new cars.
Firstly sidicks you make spelling mistakes and correcting some elses spelling or comment is clearly school yard,because you dont like it.
You dont have much porsche experience do you?,as the comment you cant surely make a opinion with out driving it,does not stack up!
I have more porsche experience than steve,but i dont like to say it,but heres the thing,i have a gt3rs in the garage and other air cooled cars,i choose the earlier car nearly every time for a spirited drive,its a better driving experience,more fun and ten times the feed back of the gt.The gt feels like you have two pairs of gloves on driving,and not much more in the seat.
Great road car that the 997 is and the 991 is no doubt better at a few things but not all,i helped a friend get a mark 1 gt3,what a fantastic car.
I know of another mk1 gt3 that will run rings around most things,Probably the best road car that's been set up for track fun driving,and not a race car, that i have just jumped into and driven.
So just because a few biased journos and owners say its the best thing since slice bread,it may be for them,but for a lot its not also.I think the best looking 911 deravative they have made for a long time is the new targa,i bet not so many agree with that,but who cares its my opinion.
I have just returned from the factory with a very privileged private tour of the inner sanctum of some very special cars,it was a joy.We then went into the opc later,it left me cold and bored.
I do for one hope porsche get back to making some fun,lightweight cars,and get away from the boring ,corporate ,cheaper ,production methods,ie parts sharing for more profit.
Hopefully the next couple of years and there gaining in experience of carbon fibre ,will produce something of interest that will appeal to the lighter weight fans with a awesome driving experience,that the 911 lost a few years ago.The 911 died a few years ago,so we need to get over it,porsche need to stop pretending and rename the car as something else,but the marketing department will not let it go,apart from its now a 991.
Enjoy what ever you drive.
You dont have much porsche experience do you?,as the comment you cant surely make a opinion with out driving it,does not stack up!
I have more porsche experience than steve,but i dont like to say it,but heres the thing,i have a gt3rs in the garage and other air cooled cars,i choose the earlier car nearly every time for a spirited drive,its a better driving experience,more fun and ten times the feed back of the gt.The gt feels like you have two pairs of gloves on driving,and not much more in the seat.
Great road car that the 997 is and the 991 is no doubt better at a few things but not all,i helped a friend get a mark 1 gt3,what a fantastic car.
I know of another mk1 gt3 that will run rings around most things,Probably the best road car that's been set up for track fun driving,and not a race car, that i have just jumped into and driven.
So just because a few biased journos and owners say its the best thing since slice bread,it may be for them,but for a lot its not also.I think the best looking 911 deravative they have made for a long time is the new targa,i bet not so many agree with that,but who cares its my opinion.
I have just returned from the factory with a very privileged private tour of the inner sanctum of some very special cars,it was a joy.We then went into the opc later,it left me cold and bored.
I do for one hope porsche get back to making some fun,lightweight cars,and get away from the boring ,corporate ,cheaper ,production methods,ie parts sharing for more profit.
Hopefully the next couple of years and there gaining in experience of carbon fibre ,will produce something of interest that will appeal to the lighter weight fans with a awesome driving experience,that the 911 lost a few years ago.The 911 died a few years ago,so we need to get over it,porsche need to stop pretending and rename the car as something else,but the marketing department will not let it go,apart from its now a 991.
Enjoy what ever you drive.
Yellow491 said:
Firstly sidicks you make spelling mistakes and correcting some elses spelling or comment is clearly school yard,because you dont like it.
What has spelling got to do with anything?Yellow491 said:
You dont have much porsche experience do you?,as the comment you cant surely make a opinion with out driving it,does not stack up!
I have more porsche experience than steve,but i dont like to say it,but heres the thing,i have a gt3rs in the garage and other air cooled cars,i choose the earlier car nearly every time for a spirited drive,its a better driving experience,more fun and ten times the feed back of the gt.The gt feels like you have two pairs of gloves on driving,and not much more in the seat.
As I said, relative measures, not absolute.I have more porsche experience than steve,but i dont like to say it,but heres the thing,i have a gt3rs in the garage and other air cooled cars,i choose the earlier car nearly every time for a spirited drive,its a better driving experience,more fun and ten times the feed back of the gt.The gt feels like you have two pairs of gloves on driving,and not much more in the seat.
Yellow491 said:
Great road car that the 997 is and the 991 is no doubt better at a few things but not all,i helped a friend get a mark 1 gt3,what a fantastic car.
I know of another mk1 gt3 that will run rings around most things,Probably the best road car that's been set up for track fun driving,and not a race car, that i have just jumped into and driven.
I wouldn't disagree with the above, nor have I done so previously.I know of another mk1 gt3 that will run rings around most things,Probably the best road car that's been set up for track fun driving,and not a race car, that i have just jumped into and driven.
Yellow491 said:
So just because a few biased journos and owners say its the best thing since slice bread,it may be for them,but for a lot its not also.
I certainly agree 100%. That doesn't it is at the opposite end of the scale either...Yellow491 said:
I think the best looking 911 deravative they have made for a long time is the new targa,i bet not so many agree with that,but who cares its my opinion.
I have just returned from the factory with a very privileged private tour of the inner sanctum of some very special cars,it was a joy.We then went into the opc later,it left me cold and bored.
I do for one hope porsche get back to making some fun,lightweight cars,and get away from the boring ,corporate ,cheaper ,production methods,ie parts sharing for more profit.
Hopefully the next couple of years and there gaining in experience of carbon fibre ,will produce something of interest that will appeal to the lighter weight fans with a awesome driving experience,that the 911 lost a few years ago.The 911 died a few years ago,so we need to get over it,porsche need to stop pretending and rename the car as something else,but the marketing department will not let it go,apart from its now a 991.
Enjoy what ever you drive.
I have just returned from the factory with a very privileged private tour of the inner sanctum of some very special cars,it was a joy.We then went into the opc later,it left me cold and bored.
I do for one hope porsche get back to making some fun,lightweight cars,and get away from the boring ,corporate ,cheaper ,production methods,ie parts sharing for more profit.
Hopefully the next couple of years and there gaining in experience of carbon fibre ,will produce something of interest that will appeal to the lighter weight fans with a awesome driving experience,that the 911 lost a few years ago.The 911 died a few years ago,so we need to get over it,porsche need to stop pretending and rename the car as something else,but the marketing department will not let it go,apart from its now a 991.
Enjoy what ever you drive.
Maybe it's just me but I took Steve's comment to mean that he was excluding the 991 GT3 from his criticism of modern 911s, i.e. there is no longer an affordable 911 with nice feedback (like a basic C2 coupe) - you have to go the full monty and spunk £100k on a GT3 (which isn't even possible as they are no longer selling them).
braddo said:
Maybe it's just me but I took Steve's comment to mean that he was excluding the 991 GT3 from his criticism of modern 911s, i.e. there is no longer an affordable 911 with nice feedback (like a basic C2 coupe) - you have to go the full monty and spunk £100k on a GT3 (which isn't even possible as they are no longer selling them).
Interesting interpretation - (to me at least) that would make more sense.Steve Rance said:
Absolutely not Old Boy! My feelings remain the same unfortunately. In fact, so dreary are porsches current offerings - and so uttely unaffordable is anything now 911 that gives the driver the remotest feeling that he or she is actually connected to it's driving controls, that I have sought satisfaction in a rather delightful little Elise S1 Sport 190.
I was considering scratching that itch myself. Whilst my 996 was under the knife all summer, I sought solace in this:
The antidote to electronic lardiness (there, that'll rattle the 991 cages 
).
Carbon doors, front wings, bonnet, decklid, wing. Full cage, harnesses, extinguisher and all that malarkey. Used to be completely stripped inside but it's retired from active duty so I've since put the a/c, heater, console and carpets back for road use. Cup diff plates and shorter ratios. KW Manthey and solid bushes but I've held back on the uniballs for now. I think I might take it racing again at some point as I hear the Classic Sports Car Club are now running a post-Millennium series. Can't do that with a 991
).Carbon doors, front wings, bonnet, decklid, wing. Full cage, harnesses, extinguisher and all that malarkey. Used to be completely stripped inside but it's retired from active duty so I've since put the a/c, heater, console and carpets back for road use. Cup diff plates and shorter ratios. KW Manthey and solid bushes but I've held back on the uniballs for now. I think I might take it racing again at some point as I hear the Classic Sports Car Club are now running a post-Millennium series. Can't do that with a 991
Harris_I said:
The antidote to electronic lardiness (there, that'll rattle the 991 cages ).
Carbon doors, front wings, bonnet, decklid, wing. Full cage, harnesses, extinguisher and all that malarkey. Used to be completely stripped inside but it's retired from active duty so I've since put the a/c, heater, console and carpets back for road use. Cup diff plates and shorter ratios. KW Manthey and solid bushes but I've held back on the uniballs for now. I think I might take it racing again at some point as I hear the Classic Sports Car Club are now running a post-Millennium series. Can't do that with a 991
See also: ).Carbon doors, front wings, bonnet, decklid, wing. Full cage, harnesses, extinguisher and all that malarkey. Used to be completely stripped inside but it's retired from active duty so I've since put the a/c, heater, console and carpets back for road use. Cup diff plates and shorter ratios. KW Manthey and solid bushes but I've held back on the uniballs for now. I think I might take it racing again at some point as I hear the Classic Sports Car Club are now running a post-Millennium series. Can't do that with a 991
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