LED Headlights

LED Headlights

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ChimpOnGas

Original Poster:

9,637 posts

178 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
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Ok, so as promised here's a little early doors write-up on the very latest Cree LED headlights I fitted half an hour ago.

I'll do a little boring preamble with some background first that you'll probably all skip, then get into the results later.

I've been looking into headlight technology for some time now and came to the conclusion I really didn't want to fit an HiD kit due to warm up time and lack of a proper flash function.

I'm also not keen on the idea of big wattage bulbs, I've looked at the wiring gauge used by TVR & I'd recommend 60/55w bulbs as a maximum if you don't want to experience a Chimaera BBQ one day.

What I can recommend is upgrading to Philips X-treme Vision 60/55w H4, these are a massive step up from standard 60/55w bulbs but being the same rating are completely safe because they only ever put the same load on the TVR wiring.

The truth is there are a lot of LED Headlight bulbs out there and have been for some time, but when you consider a standard incandescent H4 bulb already serves up a healthy 1200 lumens it needs to be a pretty special LED emitter to compete.

Until very recently even the very best LED headlight bulbs couldn't come close to regular H4 bulb, please check what your buying first, you could easily buy LED a headlight bulb that gives out substantially less light than a cheap everyday incandescent H4 bulb.

However, right now LED technology is advancing at a frightening pace; yesterdays best LED headlight bulb was pretty good but only just about matched 1200 lumens, today you can buy an LED conversion set that delivers an astonishing 3200 lumens per bulb!

This is what I went for and in theory these new sets that became available in the last few months should put out HiD levels of light and promise to be completely game changing as LED emitters have many advantages:

1. Long Life
2. Energy Efficiency
3. Ecologically Friendly (sod the dolphins)
4. Vibration Resistant Durability
5. Zero UV Emissions
6. Design Flexibility
7. Operate in Extremely Cold or Hot Temperatures
8. Superior light Disbursement
9. Instant Lighting & Fast Switching (instant flash - faster than incandescent)
10. Low current draw

Right now if you want one of these very latest 3200 lumen per bulb sets, you'll need to order it directly from China, as yet there are no UK retailers I could find offering them.

There are some American suppliers selling them, but the one I spoke to wanted £300 to deliver a set to me here, so I bought direct from China for £60 delivered all in.

http://www.dx.com/p/ax-4hl-h4-3200lm-h4-36w-3200lm...

Right enough waffle, get ready for some evidence on how these 3200 lumen Cree LED H4 bulb replacements perform in my next installment.................

wuckfitracing

990 posts

142 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
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It would be interesting to see if I could find some whilst Im here ( China that is) do you have any piccies or any details where you bought them from.

V8 GRF

7,294 posts

209 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
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Do you have any photos comparing the colour and brightness of standard Vs LED bulbs as fitted.

Light pattern comparisons would be good as well.

What is the legality of these at the moment?

ChimpOnGas

Original Poster:

9,637 posts

178 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
quotequote all
Right back again and lets get stuck into it, so what did the Chinese supplier actually send me for my £60.00?



And inside the set contains the following:

2 x LED H4 bulb replacement units
2 x Heat Sinks with fans
2 x Constant Current Drivers



How to fit:

1. Jack & support the car for safe easy access to the headlight access panel in the wheel arch

2. Remove the access panel by removing the three self tapper screws at 12, 5 & 7 O'clock



3. Remove the three pin socket on the back of the existing incandescent H4 bulb and extract it

4. Fit the replacement LED H4 bulb unit taking care to locate both ends of the clip correctly and not to trap the supply cable



5. Screw the heat sink/fan assembly on the back of the replacement LED unit



6. Screw the constant current driver to the back of the removed headlight access panel so it lives inside the wing in a relatively dry environment



7. Connect the small heat sink/fan latch connector to the constant current driver



8. Connect the LED bulb replacement unit power feed cable to the constant current driver, make sure you observe & correctly fit the two halves with respect to the key way design and screw on the outer locking sleeve





9. Connect the male three pin connector from the constant current driver to the existing TVR H4 female bulb socket you removed from the original incandescent bulb earlier





10. Re-fit the headlight access panel with the constant current driver inside the inner wing void



In my next installment we'll take a proper look at how these 3200 lumen LED units look in the bright day light, later today I'll upload some night shots and YouTube clips of how they really perform in the dark.

Chuffmeister

3,597 posts

136 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
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+1 I'll be there again shortly too.

Digitalize

2,850 posts

134 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
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Interesing...

ChimpOnGas

Original Poster:

9,637 posts

178 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
quotequote all
First off a serious word of warning teacher

When you first hook up these LED units, under no circumstances look directly at them before you secure them in the reflector bowls

Yes you guessed it folks, this is exactly what I did rolleyes

The result was I had a big yellow dot obscuring my vision for a good five minutes after, it was that bad I had to take a break from the project and at one point I thought a trip to A&E may me on the cards.

I AM NOT EXAGGERATING FOLKS, YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED!

Ok, enough teasing lets take a look at how these LED headlights look in the bright daylight against an H4 incandescent bulb.

At this point I should make it clear one side is the already vastly superior Philips Xtreme Vision H4 bulbs I've been so happy with up till now, the other is the 3200 LED unit all photographed in bright sunlight a few hours ago.

Here we are in dip beam:



It's also important to point out my reflector bowls are far from being in as "new condition". They're not bad you understand, I've seen a lot worse but being honest my reflectors are probably about 75% as reflective as a new set.


And here's what maim beam looks like:




And finally from a distance:




To be honest while the results in the above images look impressive the photos simply don't even come close to giving you a true representation of what these headlights deliver the real world.

Remember, the photos were taken earlier today on what has been a very bright and sunny day here, the only way I can describe the results so far is devastatingly brightyikescoolyikes

In fact I'd say they are even brighter than HiD!!!!!

Later today I'll be doing some dusk & nighttime testing, I'm sure from what I've seen already their performance will be amazing.

Lets just hope they don't dazzle oncoming drivers, if they do I'll be removing them quick smart.

Edited by ChimpOnGas on Saturday 25th October 16:42

Dr Mike Oxgreen

4,101 posts

164 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
quotequote all
Looks like even I could do that!

Interested to know how blue they look; 6,500K strikes me as a rather high colour temperature.

Nice and reversible though, so even if an MOT tester gets arsey about them it would be a half-hour job to swap them back.

I could possibly be interested for my SEAT as well, but that has separate dipped and main bulbs. Do you know if they do these in H7 (and H3 for the main beam would be nice)?


Edited to add: I'm pleasantly surprised that they don't look terribly blue in the pictures, which is a good thing. Looking forward to hearing what reaction they get from other drivers, if any.

Edited again: Looks like they do them in H7: http://www.dx.com/p/ax-4hl-h7-3200lm-36w-h7-3200lm...

Edited by Dr Mike Oxgreen on Saturday 25th October 16:38

Dr Mike Oxgreen

4,101 posts

164 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
quotequote all
Any chance of taking a picture of the beam shape up against a wall, so we can compare against the halogen? That'll be a good test of whether they'll annoy other drivers.

magpies

5,129 posts

181 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
quotequote all
looking really good up to now.

Could you check the dip beam cut-off pattern up against your garage door when it gets a little darker.

ChimpOnGas

Original Poster:

9,637 posts

178 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
quotequote all
Right, while we're waiting for the sun to go down I'll make some other observations regarding this kit.

Firstly I've used the Deal Extreme website a few time over the last four years and have never been ripped off, but don't expect mega fast delivery, I've been waiting the best part of three weeks for this kit to arrive.

I recommend using PayPal when you buy from Deal Extreme as it'll give you a second layer of protection, but honestly DX are one of the big direct Chinese consumer sites, they've been around for years now and seem to be a very reliable way to buy direct from China.

The second thing I'd say is the kit I bought and fitted today seems to be very well made.

Anyone who buys product from China as a business will tell you the poor quality reputation is just a myth. If you go to China you'll find you can have just about anything made, and they'll make it to the standards you specify. If you want cheap as chips they'll do that but the quality will suffer, if you want top quality they'll do that too, its just it'll cost you more.

The Chinese are more than capable of making very high quality products indeed, if you only knew how many of the trusted brand name electronics and other items dotted around your home & workplace actually originated (or contain components that originated) in China, and you'd soon understand what I mean.

While the construction and quality of materials used on these LED headlights looks to be very good indeed for £60, only time will tell if they are genuinely durable.

If anything fails my guess is it'll be the fans, which could end in the emitter overheating & total headlight failure. But it's not like traditional incandescent bulbs last forever its it?

The nice thing about this kit is.... if an LED unit goes down you can simply pop in a regular spare H4 at the side of the road.

Stay tuned for the next installment boys, dusk is approaching wink




Sardonicus

18,928 posts

220 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
quotequote all
Good write up Dave, your right concerning the Chinese pay them peanuts and you will get st but pay a sensible price you will get quality.

Edited by Sardonicus on Saturday 25th October 19:19

mk1fan

10,507 posts

224 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
quotequote all
Bookmarked.

Thanks for the info.

ETA: I've used DX several time over the years for various things. Can't fault them for value for money.

Edited by mk1fan on Saturday 25th October 18:44

ChimpOnGas

Original Poster:

9,637 posts

178 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
quotequote all
Ok, just back after an hours drive on the Hertfordshire lanes and a bit of a mixed bag to be honest scratchchin

I estimate I must have passed over 200 oncoming vehicles with a mix of inclines, and two of them flashed me frown

Ok so it's a tiny percentage but two is too many to my mind, actually one is too many!

On a more positive note I'm very confident a small amount of adjustment will sort it, it seems overall both beams are higher than they were last night with the Philips Xtreme Vision incandescent bulbs.

Dip is very effective indeed, but when you try full beam it tends to light up the the tops of the hedges and the branches & leaves on the trees above you, but you don't get a big improvement in distance light penetration of the road ahead like you should do on full beam.

These are the exact same symptoms you get with any headlight that needs adjusting down slightly, so I'll be popping over to my mate next week to drop the car on his beam setter. Having the car on a proper professional beam setter will conclusively prove if the beam on these LED headlights are acceptable or unsatisfactory.

Perhaps its just the nature of the LED H4 units and how they sit in the reflector that's lifted the beams?

Perhaps the beams were too high in the first place and these super bright LED units have revealed it?

What I can say for sure is the amount of light they put in front of you is game changing, they really illuminate the road directly ahead of you with a pure brilliant white light and lets be frank two flashes out of 200+ cars isn't telling me they're blinding everyone.

As they are right now these new headlight LEDs are not shockingly bad for oncoming traffic, and with some adjustment I think they could be just the ticket.

However nothing beats a reflector re-silver and I'll be doing that too very soon.

A couple of other notable points with are:

1. When you put the LED headlights on its so instant compared with incandescents it really takes you by surprise

2. Touching the headlight lens after an hour of use is odd, the glass is totally cold where it would normally be at least warm with an incandescent bulb

I like the LED units a lot for many reasons, but they need to be adjusted and have the beam pattern checked on a proper professional beam setter before I can give them the "ChimpOnGs" seal of approval wink

Watch this space folks.

Dave.

blitzracing

6,387 posts

219 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
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Any chance of a photo against a close wall to show the shape of the dip beam cut off? This will reveal any scatter, more than simply the beam being to high.

sheel

696 posts

222 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
quotequote all
Dave, excellent review, informative well written and precise, what you experienced on high beam was what I found using the HIDs hence my comments about going back to incandescent.
It will be interesting to hear how the beam setter views them when you have them checked out, with a tweak they maybe ok, in which case I will follow your lead in my mk3 conversion and rebuild.... top article
Rich

Alexdaredevils

5,697 posts

178 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
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Awesome thread Dave!

Chuffmeister

3,597 posts

136 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
quotequote all
Light patterns are a bit of a science TBH Dave. Having spent time worked with some of the photographic lighting manufacturers and time chatting to their R&D etc, it would appear that simply replacing bulbs, even of a similar shape doesn't always achieve the same shape light, cut-off, spread or evenness; regardless whether you're using a standard parabolic reflector or not. Light emission from LED's is apparently different. Even reflector coatings make a huge difference. As these new bulbs are so bright, it makes me wonder whether there would be scope for a silver/ white metallic coating on the inside of the bowl, to reduce the light output, and perhaps diffuse the light more?

This is a great little reflector... I use it a lot, but you can see the coating I'm referring to.



Still a worthwhile experiment and maybe not so noticeable/ important in car headlights. I'm sure a few adjustments will make a world of difference to the ones you've installed

ChimpOnGas

Original Poster:

9,637 posts

178 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
quotequote all
blitzracing said:
Any chance of a photo against a close wall to show the shape of the dip beam cut off? This will reveal any scatter, more than simply the beam being to high.
I looked at it on my white garage door when I got back from my little test run and there's definitely zero scatter from what I can see, but the the beams are certainly a bit too high.

I didn't bother to take a photo, TBH I don't really hold much faith in the wall test when I have access to a professional beam setter.

We're not living in the 50's Blitz hehe

I want to try and do this properly and give everyone here honest feedback before you go investing £60 in this kit.

Lets be patient and get 'Ol Gasbag' on a beam setter before we pass judgment, hopefully you'll all agree its the right way to do it.

thumbup Dave.

ChimpOnGas

Original Poster:

9,637 posts

178 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
quotequote all
Chuffmeister said:
Light patterns are a bit of a science TBH Dave. Having spent time worked with some of the photographic lighting manufacturers and time chatting to their R&D etc, it would appear that simply replacing bulbs, even of a similar shape doesn't always achieve the same shape light, cut-off, spread or evenness; regardless whether you're using a standard parabolic reflector or not. Light emission from LED's is apparently different. Even reflector coatings make a huge difference. As these new bulbs are so bright, it makes me wonder whether there would be scope for a silver/ white metallic coating on the inside of the bowl, to reduce the light output, and perhaps diffuse the light more?

This is a great little reflector... I use it a lot, but you can see the coating I'm referring to.



Still a worthwhile experiment and maybe not so noticeable/ important in car headlights. I'm sure a few adjustments will make a world of difference to the ones you've installed
Very interesting and informative Christian, your professional knowledge on this subject is very welcome.

If reflector finish is that important these LED headlights may not be the answer on our cars, take a look at pretty much every Chimaera with standard headlight reflectors that are older than a year or so, and I guarantee you the silvering will be in a very degraded state.

I was looking at the TVR separate lens & reflector set up again today and they are completely open to moisture from the back, no winder they don't last 10 minutes.

Its difficult to make out from the picture of the photography lamp reflector you posted above what the finish is but would I be right to assume it's what they call an orange peel reflector?

The reason I ask is this is the type of reflector used in the more powerful modern LED torches.

Here's a comparison between smooth & orange peel reflectors:



My understanding is orange peel reflectors are good for a clean spread of localised light, but you want a smooth silvered reflector for decent throw.

You need decent throw with a headlight reflector, the beam is then controlled by the pattern cast into the glass lens.

TBH it's largely irreverent for me as the most I'm prepared do reflector wise is get my originals re-silvered.

Perhaps the beam setter session and the reflector re-silver I'm planning will be all these super bright lights need?

Only time will tell.