Prospective 981 GT4 Owners Discussion Forum.
Discussion
av185 said:
Be interesting to know what proportion of buyers are going clubsport......
I am teetering but remain unconvinced the effective £3k cost with passenger harness is well spent, especially having regard to the 'free' cs on the GT3.
Furthermore, the additional extra weight and resultant possible imbalance on such a relatively light car as mentioned by W Rohrl are obvious minuses.
And would a cs car be worth anymore than £3k over one with buckets at c £95k +. Probably not.
I am teetering but remain unconvinced the effective £3k cost with passenger harness is well spent, especially having regard to the 'free' cs on the GT3.
Furthermore, the additional extra weight and resultant possible imbalance on such a relatively light car as mentioned by W Rohrl are obvious minuses.
And would a cs car be worth anymore than £3k over one with buckets at c £95k +. Probably not.
I have chosen CS.
Do you have a link to the W Rohrl quote regarding imbalance.
av185 said:
Be interesting to know what proportion of buyers are going clubsport......
I am teetering but remain unconvinced the effective £3k cost with passenger harness is well spent, especially having regard to the 'free' cs on the GT3.
Furthermore, the additional extra weight and resultant possible imbalance on such a relatively light car as mentioned by W Rohrl are obvious minuses.
And would a cs car be worth anymore than £3k over one with buckets at c £95k +. Probably not.
I'm in the same boat!!!I am teetering but remain unconvinced the effective £3k cost with passenger harness is well spent, especially having regard to the 'free' cs on the GT3.
Furthermore, the additional extra weight and resultant possible imbalance on such a relatively light car as mentioned by W Rohrl are obvious minuses.
And would a cs car be worth anymore than £3k over one with buckets at c £95k +. Probably not.
Put off by added weight and 3k!! Don't need it just kind of want it, the Americans can't have club sport for some reason either?
av185 said:
Be interesting to know what proportion of buyers are going clubsport......
I am teetering but remain unconvinced the effective £3k cost with passenger harness is well spent, especially having regard to the 'free' cs on the GT3.
Furthermore, the additional extra weight and resultant possible imbalance on such a relatively light car as mentioned by W Rohrl are obvious minuses.
And would a cs car be worth anymore than £3k over one with buckets at c £95k +. Probably not.
I think I remember the comment on weight but can't imagine imbalance as it must be very close to the centre of weight of the car. It will depend on how many serious track-goers there are as to whether you'd get your money back. I'm a very occasional track user and have decided against clubsport because of cost and weight. The rear bulkhead of the mid-engine layout already gives the car more structural integrity than other layouts.I am teetering but remain unconvinced the effective £3k cost with passenger harness is well spent, especially having regard to the 'free' cs on the GT3.
Furthermore, the additional extra weight and resultant possible imbalance on such a relatively light car as mentioned by W Rohrl are obvious minuses.
And would a cs car be worth anymore than £3k over one with buckets at c £95k +. Probably not.
as usual a boatload of ignorance........
Originally Posted by stout View Post
Some info on the factory Club Sport setup came a bit too late to make it into a column about why the CS rear cage really should be added at the factory this time, but the info may be useful to those interested in this thread:
Club Sport package weights:
Roll cage including body reinforcements: +44.09 lbs (20.0 kg)
Fire extinguisher including bracket: +7.61 lbs (3.45 kg)
Six point safety harnesses: +5.95 lbs (2.7 kg)
Lightweight bucket seats: +72.75 lbs (33.0 kg)
Total: +130.4 lbs (59.15 kg)
Delete Sports Seats Plus: -114.63 lbs (52.0 kg)
GT4 CS vs standard GT4: +15.77 lbs (7.15 kg)
Originally Posted by stout View Post
Some info on the factory Club Sport setup came a bit too late to make it into a column about why the CS rear cage really should be added at the factory this time, but the info may be useful to those interested in this thread:
Club Sport package weights:
Roll cage including body reinforcements: +44.09 lbs (20.0 kg)
Fire extinguisher including bracket: +7.61 lbs (3.45 kg)
Six point safety harnesses: +5.95 lbs (2.7 kg)
Lightweight bucket seats: +72.75 lbs (33.0 kg)
Total: +130.4 lbs (59.15 kg)
Delete Sports Seats Plus: -114.63 lbs (52.0 kg)
GT4 CS vs standard GT4: +15.77 lbs (7.15 kg)
HokumPokum said:
as usual a boatload of ignorance........
Originally Posted by stout View Post
Some info on the factory Club Sport setup came a bit too late to make it into a column about why the CS rear cage really should be added at the factory this time, but the info may be useful to those interested in this thread:
Club Sport package weights:
Roll cage including body reinforcements: +44.09 lbs (20.0 kg)
Fire extinguisher including bracket: +7.61 lbs (3.45 kg)
Six point safety harnesses: +5.95 lbs (2.7 kg)
Lightweight bucket seats: +72.75 lbs (33.0 kg)
Total: +130.4 lbs (59.15 kg)
Delete Sports Seats Plus: -114.63 lbs (52.0 kg)
GT4 CS vs standard GT4: +15.77 lbs (7.15 kg)
Or +26.15kg if you spec the LWB's without the cage/extinguisher/harnesses. I think that is the fair comparison.Originally Posted by stout View Post
Some info on the factory Club Sport setup came a bit too late to make it into a column about why the CS rear cage really should be added at the factory this time, but the info may be useful to those interested in this thread:
Club Sport package weights:
Roll cage including body reinforcements: +44.09 lbs (20.0 kg)
Fire extinguisher including bracket: +7.61 lbs (3.45 kg)
Six point safety harnesses: +5.95 lbs (2.7 kg)
Lightweight bucket seats: +72.75 lbs (33.0 kg)
Total: +130.4 lbs (59.15 kg)
Delete Sports Seats Plus: -114.63 lbs (52.0 kg)
GT4 CS vs standard GT4: +15.77 lbs (7.15 kg)
Edited by iantr on Sunday 9th August 18:56
Been in and finalised spec today. Looking forward to October.
Edit: One thing I have learnt is never try to base a colour choice off the overblown, California-shot internet photos. Only way to do it is to get to a dealer and see the colours in the flesh, and in the daylight! Cars that looked lovely in the showroom were dull and wishywashy in the usual overcast Manchester gloom. And it wasn't even THAT dull today...
Needless to say we ended up going for a completely different colour than the one we went in for. But very happy with the choice.
And for those that know me/my GT3 I also purchased GT04 FAB to go on it today
Edit: One thing I have learnt is never try to base a colour choice off the overblown, California-shot internet photos. Only way to do it is to get to a dealer and see the colours in the flesh, and in the daylight! Cars that looked lovely in the showroom were dull and wishywashy in the usual overcast Manchester gloom. And it wasn't even THAT dull today...
Needless to say we ended up going for a completely different colour than the one we went in for. But very happy with the choice.
And for those that know me/my GT3 I also purchased GT04 FAB to go on it today
Edited by jackwood on Sunday 9th August 19:08
jackwood said:
Been in and finalised spec today. Looking forward to October.
Edit: One thing I have learnt is never try to base a colour choice off the overblown, California-shot internet photos. Only way to do it is to get to a dealer and see the colours in the flesh, and in the daylight! Cars that looked lovely in the showroom were dull and wishywashy in the usual overcast Manchester gloom. And it wasn't even THAT dull today...
Needless to say we ended up going for a completely different colour than the one we went in for. But very happy with the choice.
And for those that know me/my GT3 I also purchased GT04 FAB to go on it today
Curious to hear which colour combo you ended up going for?Edit: One thing I have learnt is never try to base a colour choice off the overblown, California-shot internet photos. Only way to do it is to get to a dealer and see the colours in the flesh, and in the daylight! Cars that looked lovely in the showroom were dull and wishywashy in the usual overcast Manchester gloom. And it wasn't even THAT dull today...
Needless to say we ended up going for a completely different colour than the one we went in for. But very happy with the choice.
And for those that know me/my GT3 I also purchased GT04 FAB to go on it today
Edited by jackwood on Sunday 9th August 19:08
iantr said:
HokumPokum said:
as usual a boatload of ignorance........
Originally Posted by stout View Post
Some info on the factory Club Sport setup came a bit too late to make it into a column about why the CS rear cage really should be added at the factory this time, but the info may be useful to those interested in this thread:
Club Sport package weights:
Roll cage including body reinforcements: +44.09 lbs (20.0 kg)
Fire extinguisher including bracket: +7.61 lbs (3.45 kg)
Six point safety harnesses: +5.95 lbs (2.7 kg)
Lightweight bucket seats: +72.75 lbs (33.0 kg)
Total: +130.4 lbs (59.15 kg)
Delete Sports Seats Plus: -114.63 lbs (52.0 kg)
GT4 CS vs standard GT4: +15.77 lbs (7.15 kg)
Or +26.15kg if you spec the LWB's without the cage/extinguisher/harnesses. I think that is the fair comparison.Originally Posted by stout View Post
Some info on the factory Club Sport setup came a bit too late to make it into a column about why the CS rear cage really should be added at the factory this time, but the info may be useful to those interested in this thread:
Club Sport package weights:
Roll cage including body reinforcements: +44.09 lbs (20.0 kg)
Fire extinguisher including bracket: +7.61 lbs (3.45 kg)
Six point safety harnesses: +5.95 lbs (2.7 kg)
Lightweight bucket seats: +72.75 lbs (33.0 kg)
Total: +130.4 lbs (59.15 kg)
Delete Sports Seats Plus: -114.63 lbs (52.0 kg)
GT4 CS vs standard GT4: +15.77 lbs (7.15 kg)
Edited by iantr on Sunday 9th August 18:56
The savings on the PCCB's and their effect on unsprung masses is substantial --- at speed many times the actual weight saving, and of course, held reserve, is the Lithium battery ?? !
Or the driver on a diet !!
The additional weight of the 'cage and associated parts will be all but irrelevant.
It might just help you in an off, but only in a narrow set of circumstances.
It is in keeping with the GTx "drive to a trackday" concept, and lots of people will think it cool.
The 6-point will be helpful if you do trackdays.
"CS style" cars may attract a premium on resale, but whether this will offset the additional purchase costs is not knowable.
I think those are the salient points.
It might just help you in an off, but only in a narrow set of circumstances.
It is in keeping with the GTx "drive to a trackday" concept, and lots of people will think it cool.
The 6-point will be helpful if you do trackdays.
"CS style" cars may attract a premium on resale, but whether this will offset the additional purchase costs is not knowable.
I think those are the salient points.
iantr said:
The additional weight of the 'cage and associated parts will be all but irrelevant.
It might just help you in an off, but only in a narrow set of circumstances.
It is in keeping with the GTx "drive to a trackday" concept, and lots of people will think it cool.
The 6-point will be helpful if you do trackdays.
"CS style" cars may attract a premium on resale, but whether this will offset the additional purchase costs is not knowable.
I think those are the salient points.
I suppose 991 GT3 CS's attract a premium but you did not have to pay for the option. GT4 CS is not an easy one.It might just help you in an off, but only in a narrow set of circumstances.
It is in keeping with the GTx "drive to a trackday" concept, and lots of people will think it cool.
The 6-point will be helpful if you do trackdays.
"CS style" cars may attract a premium on resale, but whether this will offset the additional purchase costs is not knowable.
I think those are the salient points.
ChrisW. said:
Very interesting, and you can imagine that the roll cage and body reinforcement will add stiffness to the suspension platform --- enabling the system to work better ..
The savings on the PCCB's and their effect on unsprung masses is substantial --- at speed many times the actual weight saving, and of course, held reserve, is the Lithium battery ?? !
Or the driver on a diet !!
Chris,The savings on the PCCB's and their effect on unsprung masses is substantial --- at speed many times the actual weight saving, and of course, held reserve, is the Lithium battery ?? !
Or the driver on a diet !!
you need to check up on that. I believe the multiplier only exists for rotational weights. with regards to the disc weights since we already have inverted struts and the proximity of the disc to the struts, the weight effect might not even have any multiplier at all. Still, weight loss is weight loss.
You checked out the lithium battery option? not easy to lose 13.5 kg up high for less money and oem. i.e. if you get a fire, you can blame porsche.
er driver diet??? my excuse is driver weight is lower in the chassis.........
Edited by HokumPokum on Sunday 9th August 21:27
The static mass equivalent multiplier for brake discs is usually less than 1.2
It seems many people forget to look at unsprung weight savings in the context of the total unsprung mass.
You have the wheel, tyre, hub carrier, disc, caliper, pads, bolts all part of unsprung mass then 50% of the weight of the strut, spring, control arms etc also adding to the figure.
Winning £100 has more of an impact when your bank balance is £50 than it does when its £500,000
It seems many people forget to look at unsprung weight savings in the context of the total unsprung mass.
You have the wheel, tyre, hub carrier, disc, caliper, pads, bolts all part of unsprung mass then 50% of the weight of the strut, spring, control arms etc also adding to the figure.
Winning £100 has more of an impact when your bank balance is £50 than it does when its £500,000
Edited by fioran0 on Sunday 9th August 22:03
ChrisW. said:
Very interesting, and you can imagine that the roll cage and body reinforcement will add stiffness to the suspension platform --- enabling the system to work better ..
A bolt-in cage does virtually nothing for torsional stiffness. You're paying the weight cost mostly for looks.Gassing Station | Porsche General | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff