Prospective 981 GT4 Owners Discussion Forum.

[Mario149]

Robbo66 said:

Mario149 said:

I've not driven an R500 on the road properly, but my impressions during the short test drive were that basically you've got to work the engine harder whereas the 620 has more torque at all revs, especially lower down. My mate who came for a spin on Sat has an R500 and he agreed.

All that said, an R500 is so quick anyway there's no logical reason to buy a 620R if you're not fussed about gearbox choice too much either way. I got a 620 purely because I was being child and wanted the most ridiculous one, and the fact that 3 of my mates have an R500D, a heavily modded R400 and an R500K - so after thinking about it and that it would be good to keep the variety I thought I'd get something different which basically only left the R500 Evo (the one which CC South has) or a 620R.

I'd have the 620R over the GT4 all day, but again depends where you drive predominately. Proper hoot through tight twisty roads, would suit me perfectly. Tempted.

Mine will be primarily for track use with maybe the odd weekend hoon thrown in. It's very firmly sprung, so if you were going for primarily road use, you'd want to change the springs/dampers for something softer I reckon, or hang fire until the 620S comes out (unofficially I was told that they hope to deliver it for early next summer).

That said, the 620 engine is arguably completely pointless for the road. You'd do just as well with a 420, or if you wanted the 620 torquiness a CSR260 would fit the bill I imagine

[PorscheGT4]

braddo said:

Says he who always complains about understeer because he can't manage weight transfer properly.

most F1 driver also complain about understeer in their cars, thought it was the thing to do :-)

on a serious note having to brake to get the car to turn in is a 911 trate, and why I buy Porsche mid engine platforms :-)

braking just slows you down !!

the only way to fix the 911 was to fit RWS !!!

Edited by PorscheGT4 on Thursday 8th October 10:38

[PorscheGT4]

miskalachi said:

I found the low grip surface tricky to begin with, putting too much throttle down at times, but I got there in the end and had some great fun on that part of the track. I'm glad your excited as I am about the arrival of your car, happy driving!

to get the car to keep the drift you need a heap load of throttle, most people don't feel like they want to give it the full beans, but you needs heaps of throttle and need to be quite aggressive.

the quote Mr Harris "BIG ON THE THROTTLE"

I did watch some one in the GT4 Monday AM not drifting !!! in the low slip area and just understeering in a straight line, It was funny to watch.

you have to thrash the f*** out of it to start and keep a drift !

you can never have "Too much throttle" !!!

you might need to watch this ;-)

https://youtu.be/-LpPc8qutCA

[isaldiri]

PorscheGT4 said:

most F1 driver also complain about understeer in their cars, thought it was the thing to do :-)

on a serious note having to brake to get the car to turn in is a 911 trate, and why I buy Porsche mid engine platforms :-)

braking just slows you down !!

And you really think every racing driver isn't trail braking......?

[Sandy59]

PorscheGT4 said:

to get the car to keep the drift you need a heap load of throttle, most people don't feel like they want to give it the full beans, but you needs heaps of throttle and need to be quite aggressive.

the quote Mr Harris "BIG ON THE THROTTLE"

I did watch some one in the GT4 Monday AM not drifting !!! in the low slip area and just understeering in a straight line, It was funny to watch.

you have to thrash the f*** out of it to start and keep a drift !

you can never have "Too much throttle" !!!

you might need to watch this ;-)

https://youtu.be/-LpPc8qutCA

I also think the low friction area was actually higher friction than normal last week, both instructors I had thought it was due for a polish up to reduce the friction.

[PorscheGT4]

isaldiri said:

And you really think every racing driver isn't trail braking......?

depends on the car and setup.

the GT4 just pushed every where, so even if you trail brake to get it to turn in, which you had to do in the PEC car, it still understeered mid corner under power.

Trail braking can be used to good effect to get a car to turn in, or to induce some over steer, as I say it depends on the car layout and set up.

[PorscheGT4]

Sandy59 said:

I also think the low friction area was actually higher friction than normal last week, both instructors I had thought it was due for a polish up to reduce the friction.

just means even more throttle :-)

A trick here is on the roads which link the circle in and out, go off line and put sand/loose bits on your tyres, because the tyres are mega hot, it picks up all the sand and you enter the circle with less grip due to all the st you have just picked up.

[seawise]

PorscheGT4 said:

to get the car to keep the drift you need a heap load of throttle, most people don't feel like they want to give it the full beans, but you needs heaps of throttle and need to be quite aggressive.

the quote Mr Harris "BIG ON THE THROTTLE"

I did watch some one in the GT4 Monday AM not drifting !!! in the low slip area and just understeering in a straight line, It was funny to watch.

you have to thrash the f*** out of it to start and keep a drift !

it's a pity you weren't spectating pm Monday 28th sept - I had no trouble at all getting the black PEC car to drift on the low friction track, and it didn't require more than a lift and then throttle stab on entry to get the tailing sliding one way and then back the other for the opposing turn, smooth as silk. I am no Swedish rally star, but I have had a bit of practice on a frozen lake last Feb.

[Mario149]

seawise said:

PorscheGT4 said:

to get the car to keep the drift you need a heap load of throttle, most people don't feel like they want to give it the full beans, but you needs heaps of throttle and need to be quite aggressive.

the quote Mr Harris "BIG ON THE THROTTLE"

I did watch some one in the GT4 Monday AM not drifting !!! in the low slip area and just understeering in a straight line, It was funny to watch.

you have to thrash the f*** out of it to start and keep a drift !

it's a pity you weren't spectating pm Monday 28th sept - I had no trouble at all getting the black PEC car to drift on the low friction track, and it didn't require more than a lift and then throttle stab on entry to get the tailing sliding one way and then back the other for the opposing turn, smooth as silk. I am no Swedish rally star, but I have had a bit of practice on a frozen lake last Feb.

Funny you should say that as I (also) had no problem drifting my "understeery" 7GT3 on the LF surface at PEC in Feb or so Wonder if he's doing it wrong?

[PorscheGT4]

Well it's not hard is it ?

just people don't give it enough throttle !

It's ok doing a 1/2 a circle etc but to hold 2 full circles you need heaps of throttle.

Again like Harris says " ALL IT HAS"

Hot CUP 2's in 295's have heaps of grip.

[Steve Rance]

PorscheGT4 said:

most F1 driver also complain about understeer in their cars, thought it was the thing to do :-)

on a serious note having to brake to get the car to turn in is a 911 trate, and why I buy Porsche mid engine platforms :-)

braking just slows you down !!

the only way to fix the 911 was to fit RWS !!!

Edited by PorscheGT4 on Thursday 8th October 10:38

F1 drivers complain of understter AND oversteer. However, almost all trail brake and would prefer a rearward grip bias if they dont have a perfect balance because dirvers at that level can relatively easily drive around it. Oversteer just slows you down and eats your tyres. I know that Hamilton, Vettel and Alsonso trail brake. As do most of the drivers that I know that drive in GT or Prototype. It's becoming accepted as the fastest way to drive because of advances in diff and tyre technology. It's tricky even with a little help from the diff ( no doubt torque vectoring and even more electronic aids will make it a lot easier )and tyres but it's fast.

You can drive a GT4 the classic mid engined (boring) off brakes in straight line, coast into apex and gradually pick up throttle etc.. - but the quick boys will be braking later, rotaing the car on the brakes as they turn and be on the throttle earlier on the exit.

[miskalachi]

PorscheGT4 said:

to get the car to keep the drift you need a heap load of throttle, most people don't feel like they want to give it the full beans, but you needs heaps of throttle and need to be quite aggressive.

the quote Mr Harris "BIG ON THE THROTTLE"

I did watch some one in the GT4 Monday AM not drifting !!! in the low slip area and just understeering in a straight line, It was funny to watch.

you have to thrash the f*** out of it to start and keep a drift !

you can never have "Too much throttle" !!!

you might need to watch this ;-)

https://youtu.be/-LpPc8qutCA

I'll watch that vid later, looks good. I must have pulled the short straw yesterday and ended up with a bad instructor then because he kept telling me to "not too much throttle" and hold my revs going into the drift? it did work out in the end though

[DMC2]

PorscheGT4 said:

braddo said:

Says he who always complains about understeer because he can't manage weight transfer properly.

most F1 driver also complain about understeer in their cars, thought it was the thing to do :-)

on a serious note having to brake to get the car to turn in is a 911 trate, and why I buy Porsche mid engine platforms :-)

braking just slows you down !!

the only way to fix the 911 was to fit RWS !!!

Edited by PorscheGT4 on Thursday 8th October 10:38

You track day heroes do talk a load of crap. Any car will understeer if driven incorrectly, especially a road car.

[Phooey]

miskalachi said:

PorscheGT4 said:

to get the car to keep the drift you need a heap load of throttle, most people don't feel like they want to give it the full beans, but you needs heaps of throttle and need to be quite aggressive.

the quote Mr Harris "BIG ON THE THROTTLE"

I did watch some one in the GT4 Monday AM not drifting !!! in the low slip area and just understeering in a straight line, It was funny to watch.

you have to thrash the f*** out of it to start and keep a drift !

you can never have "Too much throttle" !!!

you might need to watch this ;-)

https://youtu.be/-LpPc8qutCA

I'll watch that vid later, looks good. I must have pulled the short straw yesterday and ended up with a bad instructor then because he kept telling me to "not too much throttle" and hold my revs going into the drift? it did work out in the end though

Nowt wrong with your instructor - no need to mash the throttle on a 'low-friction' surface. Ever tried drifting in the snow/ice?

[PorscheGT4]

the "'low-friction'" has not been "'low-friction' " the last 2 times I have been unless it's wet, then it is like ice and I found that much harder to do.

As others have said, it's not that slippery atm.

[turbofreeFLAT6]

All this discussion is pretty irrelevant to the GT4 when one of its fortes is that it can easily be setup to understeer, oversteer or be neutral.

[Steve Rance]

It's not quite a simple as that. If you set the car up for maximin grip at each end it's unlikely to have a balance and so will default to either oversteer or understeer. If it defaults to oversteer - as a rule - grip will need to be taken away from the front end to find a balance. If it defaults to understeer, the driver may be able to drive around it if the balance isnt too bad and the diff is set up properly.

[PorscheGT4]

Steve Rance said:

It's not quite a simple as that. If you set the car up for maximin grip at each end it's unlikely to have a balance and so will default to either oversteer or understeer. If it defaults to oversteer - as a rule - grip will need to be taken away from the front end to find a balance. If it defaults to understeer, the driver may be able to drive around it if the balance isnt too bad and the diff is set up properly.

hence why I like at least 2 way dampers to fine tune the balance.

I find it odd Porsche GT cars have these PASM things.

2 ways give you 3 easy set ups for road, track and wet. some settings a bit softer and some more forgiving depending if you wanted over or understeer.

On my Exige I used to soften the rebound in the rear if it were a bit wet.

Also under steer in the wet is not fun one bit. but in the dry you base the car to understeer 1st.

Porsche GT cars offer none of this fine tuning .

[Custard Beast]

Quote of the day.... Braking just slows you down !!

The Porsche guys really missed a trick, you should be running the driver training programme at the PEC.... I'm sure you could teach us mere mortals how to drive these understeering sh#tboxes!

[Monkey nut]

I am new to this forum. My build slot is not confirmed but I am told to expect December. I suspect that I am not an unusual prospective GT4 owner - I like the very occasional track day but will spend most of my time with the GT4 on the road. I am over 50 and enjoying my crisis. This is the first non 911 I will have owned, except for a 928GT back in the early 90s. Having read this forum I was full of trepidation about the gearing and under steer when I had my PEC day - in the black car. I ordered the GT4 wanting something special, smaller than the increasingly large 911, and not unuseable or flashy like a Ferrari. My car will be Dark Blue Met with LWBs, CCBs, adaptive lights plus leather, hifi etc - total circa 82k. I think this car delivers in spades. It instantly feels just right and you simply cannot help but smile - a lot. It's just good fun, well made, goes well, is predictable and grips liked a good 'un. The noise is addictive, the gearbox sublime and the driving position superb. Are the ratios long? Yes. Will they affect my enjoyment? No. I will on the road for the vast majority of the time and don't care about the 0-40 performance at all. At higher speeds on country roads the gears will make sense and the torque means that it is fine in most driving conditions not to run the engine to the red line all the time. Does it understeer? Yes, but trailing braking and balancing the car helps a lot. But many cars understeer on track whilst making fun and safe road cars. If it bugs me when my car arrives, I will change the suspension settings. I cannot see what the fuss is about for those of us that are not totally track focussed. I loved the car, can't wait for mine to arrive, have no intention of selling it and look forward to happy times enjoying it. Perhaps those who want to track it should look at the Clubsport version that may offer shorter ratios and more oversteer bias.