Harris puts 991 GT3 against 458 Speciale

[Slickhillsy]

BMCG said:

Carl_Docklands said:

The only Porsche which will beat the speciale and aperta on all counts (apart from cost) is the 918. Porsche need that mid engined flat 8 car to get near ferrari again in terms of desirability.

The RS will be great value for money but comparing the car to the 458 s will not be a fair fight as the 458s is a much more desirable car. Lap times don't quantify the canyon like gap ferrari have opened.

ahh yes that so easy to quantify characteristic called "desirability"...I don't see the 458SP or A as more desirable ...so guess that's one datapoint to the contrary...

LOL course you dont, you own an RS! Try to remove yourself a little, of course the Spec. is desirable... Just depends who you ask if it's more so...

Oh and BTW it absolutely is!

[av185]

BMCG said:

Carl_Docklands said:

The only Porsche which will beat the speciale and aperta on all counts (apart from cost) is the 918. Porsche need that mid engined flat 8 car to get near ferrari again in terms of desirability.

The RS will be great value for money but comparing the car to the 458 s will not be a fair fight as the 458s is a much more desirable car. Lap times don't quantify the canyon like gap ferrari have opened.

ahh yes that so easy to quantify characteristic called "desirability"...I don't see the 458SP or A as more desirable ...so guess that's one datapoint to the contrary...

Very true....and whilst I love the 458........if grip, noise, practicality, usability, 'exclusivity' (by lower numbers), subtlety and the obvious affordability are high on your list then the GT3 is way way more 'desirable'.

More chance it will fit the garage too......

[BMCG]

Slickhillsy said:

BMCG said:

Carl_Docklands said:

The only Porsche which will beat the speciale and aperta on all counts (apart from cost) is the 918. Porsche need that mid engined flat 8 car to get near ferrari again in terms of desirability.

The RS will be great value for money but comparing the car to the 458 s will not be a fair fight as the 458s is a much more desirable car. Lap times don't quantify the canyon like gap ferrari have opened.

ahh yes that so easy to quantify characteristic called "desirability"...I don't see the 458SP or A as more desirable ...so guess that's one datapoint to the contrary...

LOL course you dont, you own an RS! Try to remove yourself a little, of course the Spec. is desirable... Just depends who you ask if it's more so...

Oh and BTW it absolutely is!

shhhhhhh....its a Porsche forum....and I want to keep my membership card intact

(actually the 458S is .....seriously ...beguiling )

[Slickhillsy]

av185 said:

BMCG said:

Carl_Docklands said:

The only Porsche which will beat the speciale and aperta on all counts (apart from cost) is the 918. Porsche need that mid engined flat 8 car to get near ferrari again in terms of desirability.

The RS will be great value for money but comparing the car to the 458 s will not be a fair fight as the 458s is a much more desirable car. Lap times don't quantify the canyon like gap ferrari have opened.

ahh yes that so easy to quantify characteristic called "desirability"...I don't see the 458SP or A as more desirable ...so guess that's one datapoint to the contrary...

Very true....and whilst I love the 458........if grip, noise, practicality, usability, 'exclusivity' (by lower numbers), subtlety and the obvious affordability are high on your list then the GT3 is way way more 'desirable'.

More chance it will fit the garage too......

Dont be so sure, still going to be tight... Pork has gotten a bit - err - Porky of late: 991 GT3 Width = 1,852 mm Vs 458 Width = 1937mm

Dont even mention the weight! GT3 - 1,430 kg (who's been eating all the pies) vs. 458 (standard) 1,395 kg Kerb.

[Slickhillsy]

BMCG said:

Slickhillsy said:

BMCG said:

Carl_Docklands said:

The only Porsche which will beat the speciale and aperta on all counts (apart from cost) is the 918. Porsche need that mid engined flat 8 car to get near ferrari again in terms of desirability.

The RS will be great value for money but comparing the car to the 458 s will not be a fair fight as the 458s is a much more desirable car. Lap times don't quantify the canyon like gap ferrari have opened.

ahh yes that so easy to quantify characteristic called "desirability"...I don't see the 458SP or A as more desirable ...so guess that's one datapoint to the contrary...

LOL course you dont, you own an RS! Try to remove yourself a little, of course the Spec. is desirable... Just depends who you ask if it's more so...

Oh and BTW it absolutely is!

shhhhhhh....its a Porsche forum....and I want to keep my membership card intact

(actually the 458S is .....seriously ...beguiling )

;-)

[jackal]

Slickhillsy said:

jackal said:

Is the RS its truest AB equivalent ?

Personally ive always seen the CS/SCUD as being GT3 rivals. Ferrari just don't make anything as hardcore as an RS (esp on the spring rates front).

And if the rumour mill is to be believed, this forthcoming RS is set to be the most balls out of them all, greatly distanced from the vanilla car. My hunch is it will very comfortably trump the S and have even more hyperbole lavished upon it.

If you think about the Ethos of these cars (lighter more focused version of the standard car) then yes the CS / Scud / Spec + RS are direct compeditors...

As for ferrari not making hardcore cars - I would say they invented the concept! Just check their back catalogue (to numerous to mention)... Annnnnd... You'll never see cruise control or cup holders in their racers! LOL

http://www.maxted-page.com/cars/car-details.aspx?i...

I bet you sell your 430S within the next 12 months.

[isaldiri]

Slickhillsy said:

Dont be so sure, still going to be tight... Pork has gotten a bit - err - Porky of late: 991 GT3 Width = 1,852 mm Vs 458 Width = 1937mm

Dont even mention the weight! GT3 - 1,430 kg (who's been eating all the pies) vs. 458 (standard) 1,395 kg Kerb.

I think you will find real world fully fueled weights the GT3 is ~1480-1500kg while the 458 standard car is a good amount over 1500kg. Neither company has accurate manfacturer declared weights but Ferrari are definitely worse in that respect.

[Slickhillsy]

jackal said:

Slickhillsy said:

jackal said:

Is the RS its truest AB equivalent ?

Personally ive always seen the CS/SCUD as being GT3 rivals. Ferrari just don't make anything as hardcore as an RS (esp on the spring rates front).

And if the rumour mill is to be believed, this forthcoming RS is set to be the most balls out of them all, greatly distanced from the vanilla car. My hunch is it will very comfortably trump the S and have even more hyperbole lavished upon it.

If you think about the Ethos of these cars (lighter more focused version of the standard car) then yes the CS / Scud / Spec + RS are direct compeditors...

As for ferrari not making hardcore cars - I would say they invented the concept! Just check their back catalogue (to numerous to mention)... Annnnnd... You'll never see cruise control or cup holders in their racers! LOL

http://www.maxted-page.com/cars/car-details.aspx?i...

I bet you sell your 430S within the next 12 months.

Bet are flying all over this thread! lol...
The only car I'd sell my Scud for is a Speciale, there were a few in the dealer when I collected mine and it really is a stunning car. But alas to rich for me...

The Scud - it really is the best car I've ever owned and for the first time I cannot think / am not interested in thinking about what I'd replace it with (within the price point). Really does tick every box and when it's on full fury the 60 MilSec gear shift pounding your kidneys is brutal... One of the greats...

[Alpinestars]

Slickhillsy said:

Bet are flying all over this thread! lol...
The only car I'd sell my Scud for is a Speciale, there were a few in the dealer when I collected mine and it really is a stunning car. But alas to rich for me...

The Scud - it really is the best car I've ever owned and for the first time I cannot think / am not interested in thinking about what I'd replace it with (within the price point). Really does tick every box and when it's on full fury the 60 MilSec gear shift pounding your kidneys is brutal... One of the greats...

And a better drive than the Speciale.

[Slickhillsy]

Alpinestars said:

And a better drive than the Speciale.

Really?? (not driven a Spec so cant say) - what makes you place the Scud above it?

[Alpinestars]

Slickhillsy said:

Really?? (not driven a Spec so cant say) - what makes you place the Scud above it?

Involvement. The Scud is more raw and just feels more exciting to drive, which I prefer.

No doubt the Spec is more competent, but it was pretty boring to be honest, unless getting the back end out, at which it was epic. I had one for the weekend, and it was actually slower than the Scud as well. I know this is not supposed to be the case, but F cars are so inconsistent, it's frightening.

[Slickhillsy]

Interesting...

The Speciale is a standard run car (CS & Scuderia were special / limited) so the manufacturing process may have something to do with it. They do look stunning though (espec in black).

As for the Scuderia, if rawnes and character are what you want then absolutely it has it in bucketloads. Genuinly makes me laugh out loud lol...

http://vimeo.com/13451587

Amusing Clarkson vid on the Scud.

"it's like God having really unusual sex. *flips paddle* Oh there we are, he's finished."

"this is what a ferrari should be like. you make mistake, i kill."

"It feels like a street brawler!"

"It's angry!"

"Feel's like it wants to goose your mother; vomit in one of your flower beds; go to the pub, get drunk, and kick someone's head in!"


And Jackle said Ferrari dont make cars as harcore as the RS - piff!

[throt]

Slickhillsy said:

Interesting...

The Speciale is a standard run car (CS & Scuderia were special / limited) so the manufacturing process may have something to do with it. They do look stunning though (espec in black).

As for the Scuderia, if rawnes and character are what you want then absolutely it has it in bucketloads. Genuinly makes me laugh out loud lol...

http://vimeo.com/13451587

Amusing Clarkson vid on the Scud.

"it's like God having really unusual sex. *flips paddle* Oh there we are, he's finished."

"this is what a ferrari should be like. you make mistake, i kill."

"It feels like a street brawler!"

"It's angry!"

"Feel's like it wants to goose your mother; vomit in one of your flower beds; go to the pub, get drunk, and kick someone's head in!"


And Jackle said Ferrari dont make cars as harcore as the RS - piff!

Whats the availability on a Speciale,, and the waiting time..?...

More than happy though with my 991GT3,, its so so usable, which I need it to be..

[isaldiri]

throt said:

Whats the availability on a Speciale,, and the waiting time..?...

More than happy though with my 991GT3,, its so so usable, which I need it to be..

If I'm not wrong, you can still place an order but delivery will be the tail end of production so probably mid ish next year.

[V8KSN]

isaldiri said:

throt said:

Whats the availability on a Speciale,, and the waiting time..?...

More than happy though with my 991GT3,, its so so usable, which I need it to be..

If I'm not wrong, you can still place an order but delivery will be the tail end of production so probably mid ish next year.

I read that you have to spec it with lots of options too in order to guarantee the order. Think the article was posted on Jalopnik

[throt]

V8KSN said:

isaldiri said:

throt said:

Whats the availability on a Speciale,, and the waiting time..?...

More than happy though with my 991GT3,, its so so usable, which I need it to be..

If I'm not wrong, you can still place an order but delivery will be the tail end of production so probably mid ish next year.

I read that you have to spec it with lots of options too in order to guarantee the order. Think the article was posted on Jalopnik

So in other words, you have to "bum suck" to secure one..

Cheers guys..

[Callughan]

throt said:

V8KSN said:

isaldiri said:

throt said:

Whats the availability on a Speciale,, and the waiting time..?...

More than happy though with my 991GT3,, its so so usable, which I need it to be..

If I'm not wrong, you can still place an order but delivery will be the tail end of production so probably mid ish next year.

I read that you have to spec it with lots of options too in order to guarantee the order. Think the article was posted on Jalopnik

So in other words, you have to "bum suck" to secure one..

Cheers guys..

Build your own option is back up on the gt3

[isaldiri]

V8KSN said:

I read that you have to spec it with lots of options too in order to guarantee the order. Think the article was posted on Jalopnik

Not what I'm finding. Am still in 2 minds about sticking an order in. Will get a quick test drive to finally decide either way later this week anyway.

[Carl_Docklands]

isaldiri said:

V8KSN said:

I read that you have to spec it with lots of options too in order to guarantee the order. Think the article was posted on Jalopnik

Not what I'm finding. Am still in 2 minds about sticking an order in. Will get a quick test drive to finally decide either way later this week anyway.

From what I understand the '60k worth of options' thing was in order to secure a 2014 car and a big reason why most of the cars for sale are in this ball-park. Similar situation to the early FF cars.

LHD market stuffed to the gills with Speciale so can't see them being hard to get hold of.

I prefer to see this approach than Porsche's aloof approach to the new RS, I don't see why the car should be VIP only. Some people on the board are posting as if the new RS is actually a car mere mortals will be able to buy when it is not. The situation appears far more dire than in the days of the 997 Gen1 RS.

Ferrari, the peoples champion car brand? Surely not !

[isaldiri]

Carl_Docklands said:

From what I understand the '60k worth of options' thing was in order to secure a 2014 car and a big reason why most of the cars for sale are in this ball-park. Similar situation to the early FF cars.

LHD market stuffed to the gills with Speciale so can't see them being hard to get hold of.

I prefer to see this approach than Porsche's aloof approach to the new RS, I don't see why the car should be VIP only. Some people on the board are posting as if the new RS is actually a car mere mortals will be able to buy when it is not. The situation appears far more dire than in the days of the 997 Gen1 RS.

Ferrari, the peoples champion car brand? Surely not !

The LHD market is also stuffed with 991 gt3s though so it seems it's more a case of the RHD allocations being pretty small vs the non UK/RHD market (and in particular the RHD allocation PAG are doling out). To be fair, the RS total production run I am given to understand from admittedly limited info is due to be quite small (timing supposedly limited) so comparing the speciale to the RS in terms of getting allocations is a bit unfair. I think if you really wanted a RS you have a decent chance of getting one from a european OPC.

Try getting hold of a Speciale spider allocation for example and you probably would start fancying your chances of a UK C16 991 RS instead!