Ken at Nine Excellence lied to me...

[200Plus Club]

TB993tt said:

I find these answers disturbing, I hope you guys are just being macho. If you don't find going over 150mph scary then IMO you shouldn't really be doing it, you've got to respect the game.

Its all about the time n place. No ones suggesting 150plus on a public road. This was all done on a nice flat runway with no traffic so its all relative.

[Nineexcellence]

Ha, just seen this thread...

Just a couple of points

- the 9exx (997 Turbo 4.2L) we ran at Brunters that did 216gps was unfortunately electronically limited on the day...my fault actually as we were working on the shift points (upgraded tiptronic box) and stupidly I set the rev limit on the 5th gear . Anyway the car now has a higher limit so we should see something a little higher next time

With the weather we actually turned the boost down on the 9exx from 1.74bar to just under 1.3bar just to get traction.

- re the 9e28, we run very little boost even in sports mode. We do this to protect the engine, and also to increase performance from 200kph onwards. Here is the actual boost curve. A lot of VTG hybrids run 1.5 bar etc. We make very close to the same power from a lot less boost, which is a better solution.

Ken

[ORD]

Nineexcellence said:

Ha, just seen this thread...

Just a couple of points

- the 9exx (997 Turbo 4.2L) we ran at Brunters that did 216gps was unfortunately electronically limited on the day...my fault actually as we were working on the shift points (upgraded tiptronic box) and stupidly I set the rev limit on the 5th gear . Anyway the car now has a higher limit so we should see something a little higher next time

With the weather we actually turned the boost down on the 9exx from 1.74bar to just under 1.3bar just to get traction.

- re the 9e28, we run very little boost even in sports mode. We do this to protect the engine, and also to increase performance from 200kph onwards. Here is the actual boost curve. A lot of VTG hybrids run 1.5 bar etc. We make very close to the same power from a lot less boost, which is a better solution.

Ken

How do you get it to 4.2l? I saw something from Porsche today to the effect that one problem with the flat six is that you cannot take it about 4l without very major changes (effectively a completely new engine).

[Nineexcellence]

ORD said:

Nineexcellence said:

Ha, just seen this thread...

Just a couple of points

- the 9exx (997 Turbo 4.2L) we ran at Brunters that did 216gps was unfortunately electronically limited on the day...my fault actually as we were working on the shift points (upgraded tiptronic box) and stupidly I set the rev limit on the 5th gear . Anyway the car now has a higher limit so we should see something a little higher next time

With the weather we actually turned the boost down on the 9exx from 1.74bar to just under 1.3bar just to get traction.

- re the 9e28, we run very little boost even in sports mode. We do this to protect the engine, and also to increase performance from 200kph onwards. Here is the actual boost curve. A lot of VTG hybrids run 1.5 bar etc. We make very close to the same power from a lot less boost, which is a better solution.

Ken

How do you get it to 4.2l? I saw something from Porsche today to the effect that one problem with the flat six is that you cannot take it about 4l without very major changes (effectively a completely new engine).

Well we increase the stroke to 80.4 (in fact you can do just over 4.3L using 82.4 stroke) from 76.4 and the larger pistons and liners, custom rods etc. It takes quite a bit of machine work so that everything clears - we have to amend the skirt of the pistons as well, do some changes to the crankcase, do some machine work on the crankshaft and oil pump. In essence it is still the same engine, just with upgraded parts.

The main difficulty is that when you get up in the power, the studs are just not strong enough to hold the heads together. So we drill the water jackets, heads and crankcase to access studs that are 2mm larger and can be torqued to three times the standard. This together with o-ringing the heads means that the heads are not coming apart any time soon.

The issue with fitting larger studs, is that it reduces the clearances in the heads and water jackets. If you ever look at the liners in one of these heads, you will see that the stud holes clip the corner of the liners in some places. When you increase the size from 10mm to 12mm, there is not much margin left.

Increasing the stroke is the best way to do this. I have seen other solutions running large pistons to give you displacement but you are restricted to just a fraction over 4L with a 76.4mm stroke.

In summary, the engine is still very much close to any 3.6L or 3.8L Porsche turbo engine. Obviously a lot more expensive.

[TB993tt]

Nineexcellence said:

No boost at all 'til 4000rpm talk about turbo lag

[TB993tt]

ORD said:

How do you get it to 4.2l? I saw something from Porsche today to the effect that one problem with the flat six is that you cannot take it about 4l without very major changes (effectively a completely new engine).

Probably talking about the latest A91 lump, there are 4.5 litre Mezger lumps alive and kicking in Europe at 600PS naturally aspirated.

[Nineexcellence]

TB993tt said:

Nineexcellence said:

No boost at all 'til 4000rpm talk about turbo lag

lol Toby.

[Nineexcellence]

TB993tt said:

ORD said:

How do you get it to 4.2l? I saw something from Porsche today to the effect that one problem with the flat six is that you cannot take it about 4l without very major changes (effectively a completely new engine).

Probably talking about the latest A91 lump, there are 4.5 litre Mezger lumps alive and kicking in Europe at 600PS naturally aspirated.

Yes there is no reason why not on a turbo engine, but the only thing is your propensity to tolerance - it leaves very little material and I just cannot see how this could be achieved with larger studs - so unless you intend to keep the power at reasonable levels, it sort of defeats the purpose.

4.2L is fine achieved with 80.4mm, 4.3L from 82.4mm gets very close. The level of machine work between those two for an extra 100cc is substantial.

[Nineexcellence]

Toby, this shows you how bad conditions where on the day re 9exx 997 4.2L. As I mentioned we backed the boost down to 1.3 bar from 1.74 bar. The car still has full 4wd etc. Look at the lack of traction below 120mph and the slow time. Was nearly 6 seconds slower due to boost and conditions.

[TB993tt]

Nineexcellence said:

Toby, this shows you how bad conditions where on the day re 9exx 997 4.2L. As I mentioned we backed the boost down to 1.3 bar from 1.74 bar. The car still has full 4wd etc.

Are your team drivers so busy "not being scared" that they are incapable of using their right foot boost control

[200Plus Club]

Hey Imran. Your car looks beautiful in those pictures. 5mph difference is interesting, last time was perfect turbo weather , was it warmer yesterday? Maybe tail wind also as you say. Enjoyed our event tremendously :-)

[200Plus Club]

If you are going to any others and i'm still welcome i could come in my owm 911 you inspired me with ;-)
Guarantee its not as fast lol

[IMIA]

Hi Chris. It was a last minute thing and took another pal. of course you're welcome anytime.

[200Plus Club]

Sounds like it probably didn't help the cause at all. Bad batch possibly? Siphon ot all out and fill with fresh v power ? Hope you get it sorted imran

[IMIA]

Heres the other 9e 28 against a 650S, SLR 722 and 991 turbo S with 650hp - give you an idea of how quick this kit is - I'm guessing I may be have leak some where with the symptoms I'm currently suffering

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-J8EbcX5A_c&li...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LBfx4kUgSf4&li...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NSgqHWunipc&in...

[s3nick]

Did you run the 120 mixed?

[IMIA]

s3nick said:

Did you run the 120 mixed?

Nope 100%.

[s3nick]

IMIA said:

Nope 100%.

It could have been that maybe. As our car will only will only cater for a few extra octane points. The fuel you used i would assume would need the car to mapped to run all that extra octane safely. I hope it's nothing serious. Need to get it plugged in and check if there are any errors.

Try plugging the durametrics in if you have the lead.

[s3nick]

IMIA said:

Shyte will probably have to get the car flat bedded to 9e. Will try putting in normal fuel disconnecting battery etc to reset ECU and if that doesn't work will send her to 9e. Ken doesn't think the higher octane fuel should make any difference and its probably a leak somewhere.

Yes could be coils, sparks, fuel, a leak but Ken will sort Im sure. Also check the IPD parts to make sure there is no splits in the metal where the clips go over as this happened to me and hence why I removed the junk from my car.

I just remember some one years ago telling me too much octane is not healthy unless the ECU is aware of it but a mix of v-power with ms109 is fine for a mapped car.

[the other me]

If the other one is "only" a 9e28 you were well "smoked" there. Is it a Tip ? sounded like a manual on the vids (enjoyed all 14 of them, nice to see some very expensive "scalps" being taken . . . was the Zonda driver sleeping ? ? ) & if so, nice shifts there Matey.

Just goes to show the whole 9e "Mantra" of what "you" can achieve is well founded. Hope you haven't hurt your toy, they are pretty tough, I suspect you will be okay.