GT3 RS 1st road test.
Discussion
isaldiri said:
From the article -
""Instead of being deliberately conservative with your entry speeds and guiding it into the corner, you fling it in on a trailing throttle deliberately too fast, trusting in the tyre, the car’s inherent balance and the agility of its four-wheel steering system to cope""
That is completely counter to everything one has ever been taught to do by professional 911 drivers surely...? Even on the Cup cars with much more front tyre, I was told only recently on the 991 Cup you still always turn in on the brakes.
Chuck a car into a corner (on trailing throttle to boot) awfully quick and trust the car's systems to sort itself out - that's what one does in the GT-R....
That is exactly what I was thinking as I watched the Chris Harris video.""Instead of being deliberately conservative with your entry speeds and guiding it into the corner, you fling it in on a trailing throttle deliberately too fast, trusting in the tyre, the car’s inherent balance and the agility of its four-wheel steering system to cope""
That is completely counter to everything one has ever been taught to do by professional 911 drivers surely...? Even on the Cup cars with much more front tyre, I was told only recently on the 991 Cup you still always turn in on the brakes.
Chuck a car into a corner (on trailing throttle to boot) awfully quick and trust the car's systems to sort itself out - that's what one does in the GT-R....
RDMcG said:
I do like the video at the 35second mark where they show the driver aggressively putting the car into park...
"But, and I don't think this is just me, with the old GT3 RS I really enjoyed the compromises it forced on you. Yes, it had a manual gearbox, and that's a big part of it (pulling a paddle is only ever going to be charmless in comparison), but the fabled Mezger engine was chuntery and guttural and lumpy at low speed. It needed to warm itself thoroughly. It had charisma to spare. It felt like a proper racing car.
The new one? The sophisticated new drivetrain means it's lost a bit of that. Mechanical rawness has given way to a more controlled release of energy."
The new one? The sophisticated new drivetrain means it's lost a bit of that. Mechanical rawness has given way to a more controlled release of energy."
All seems predictable enough. Very fast, bonkers levels of grip, stellar turn-in, lightning fast gear-shifts, monsters the track, good enough on the road, very wide, not as exciting as the last one, sold out. Most people on here could have written that review before the thing came out. Not sure I want to own one, but would definitely like to try one.
DT398 said:
All seems predictable enough. Very fast, bonkers levels of grip, stellar turn-in, lightning fast gear-shifts, monsters the track, good enough on the road, very wide, not as exciting as the last one, sold out. Most people on here could have written that review before the thing came out. Not sure I want to own one, but would definitely like to try one.
What did you expect, the second coming of the messiah?Where are the reviews concluding it isn't as exciting as the last one?
AndrewD said:
What did you expect, the second coming of the messiah?
Where are the reviews concluding it isn't as exciting as the last one?
"Is it fun then?Where are the reviews concluding it isn't as exciting as the last one?
Hmm, tricky one.
The Cayman GT4, well that's pure fun, but this one's so full-on, so grown up that it's a bit beyond easy-going entertainment. Massively rewarding, quite draining, with limits that are off the charts. Too much, maybe. After my first stint around Bilster Berg I got out of the car and had to have a stern word with myself. It's that sort of car."
Alpinestars said:
AndrewD said:
What did you expect, the second coming of the messiah?
Where are the reviews concluding it isn't as exciting as the last one?
"Is it fun then?Where are the reviews concluding it isn't as exciting as the last one?
Hmm, tricky one.
The Cayman GT4, well that's pure fun, but this one's so full-on, so grown up that it's a bit beyond easy-going entertainment. Massively rewarding, quite draining, with limits that are off the charts. Too much, maybe. After my first stint around Bilster Berg I got out of the car and had to have a stern word with myself. It's that sort of car."
AndrewD said:
I read that too. He's calling himself too much of a pussy!
Meow. Serious point though, the latest batch of "supercars" (with a small s), have just become too efficient, too clinical, and too fast to be fun. All the criticisms that were quite rightly aimed at the GTR by many 911 fans when it came out.
Hammond no doubt respects the car, but eludes to the steering, engine character of the Mezger, manual gearbox and lower limits of the earlier RS' being better - for the road at least.
Alpinestars said:
AndrewD said:
I read that too. He's calling himself too much of a pussy!
Meow. Serious point though, the latest batch of "supercars" (with a small s), have just become too efficient, too clinical, and too fast to be fun. All the criticisms that were quite rightly aimed at the GTR by many 911 fans when it came out.
Hammond no doubt respects the car, but eludes to the steering, engine character of the Mezger, manual gearbox and lower limits of the earlier RS' being better - for the road at least.
A lot of people seem to think the prev gen was some sort of holy grail. IMO the car was already much much easier to drive even say than the 996 GT3 (mk 1 or 2). So the rose tints are out for what, that it has a manual box and a mezger? You could argue it fell between two stools. I don't, but you could do. It is just different.
I think people are not really getting the downforce in the RS. If this is a seriously material thing, it changes the character massively. People new to cars with downforce have to totally reassess.
AndrewD said:
I'll let you know when I've driven the RS. i don't agree about the GT3. It is awesome. Just different.
A lot of people seem to think the prev gen was some sort of holy grail. IMO the car was already much much easier to drive even say than the 996 GT3 (mk 1 or 2). So the rose tints are out for what, that it has a manual box and a mezger? You could argue it fell between two stools. I don't, but you could do. It is just different.
I think people are not really getting the downforce in the RS. If this is a seriously material thing, it changes the character massively. People new to cars with downforce have to totally reassess.
How does "downforce" equate to fun, especially on the road? I agree it can change the character of a car, but in this instance won't it make it more boring to drive at legal speeds ? A lot of people seem to think the prev gen was some sort of holy grail. IMO the car was already much much easier to drive even say than the 996 GT3 (mk 1 or 2). So the rose tints are out for what, that it has a manual box and a mezger? You could argue it fell between two stools. I don't, but you could do. It is just different.
I think people are not really getting the downforce in the RS. If this is a seriously material thing, it changes the character massively. People new to cars with downforce have to totally reassess.
Well, in all honesty my 7.1 and 7.2 never stuck me as fascinating to drive at legal speeds in the first place. You never get to open it up.
I hung onto the 7.1 so I will have something to compare. For sure the 997s are fun to drive, but I recall all the outcry about them being too soft compared to the 996RS. Of course it was compared to the 993 RS and so on. Sometimes I think that Porsche started with a perfect car in 1948 and since then people have made great efforts to ruin it
.
I have no idea if this new one will be less fun. I think it depends how and where you drive it. Doubtless, the Chuck Norris- effort clutch in the earlier cars is no fun to use in heavy traffic, though great on an open road.
I hung onto the 7.1 so I will have something to compare. For sure the 997s are fun to drive, but I recall all the outcry about them being too soft compared to the 996RS. Of course it was compared to the 993 RS and so on. Sometimes I think that Porsche started with a perfect car in 1948 and since then people have made great efforts to ruin it
.I have no idea if this new one will be less fun. I think it depends how and where you drive it. Doubtless, the Chuck Norris- effort clutch in the earlier cars is no fun to use in heavy traffic, though great on an open road.
ThirtySomething said:
AndrewD said:
I'll let you know when I've driven the RS. i don't agree about the GT3. It is awesome. Just different.
A lot of people seem to think the prev gen was some sort of holy grail. IMO the car was already much much easier to drive even say than the 996 GT3 (mk 1 or 2). So the rose tints are out for what, that it has a manual box and a mezger? You could argue it fell between two stools. I don't, but you could do. It is just different.
I think people are not really getting the downforce in the RS. If this is a seriously material thing, it changes the character massively. People new to cars with downforce have to totally reassess.
How does "downforce" equate to fun, especially on the road? I agree it can change the character of a car, but in this instance won't it make it more boring to drive at legal speeds ? A lot of people seem to think the prev gen was some sort of holy grail. IMO the car was already much much easier to drive even say than the 996 GT3 (mk 1 or 2). So the rose tints are out for what, that it has a manual box and a mezger? You could argue it fell between two stools. I don't, but you could do. It is just different.
I think people are not really getting the downforce in the RS. If this is a seriously material thing, it changes the character massively. People new to cars with downforce have to totally reassess.
ThirtySomething said:
How does "downforce" equate to fun, especially on the road? I agree it can change the character of a car, but in this instance won't it make it more boring to drive at legal speeds ?
Not more boring because at legal speeds there will hardly be any significant downforce, especially not enough to be easily felt on a >1450kg car where one wouldn't be running on the firm suspension mode and the road surface isn't track smooth. Downforce on road cars I have to say is probably overrated though, makes for great marketing by manufacturers to claim big numbers and likely at high speeds on track it significantly changes the feel of the car but on the road, how many a/b roads can one regularly and safely reach or exceed say ~66mph while cornering to generate ~45-50kg of downforce (assuming my calcs are roughly accurate) for the df to be sufficient to start to be felt?
Edited by isaldiri on Thursday 21st May 22:56
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