Is the bubble about to burst?
Discussion
355Chris355 said:
"Estimates are meaningless" Did you really write that! These estimates are a guide to where the auction experts think the market is. In reality, most people on this thread agree that the estimates were set to high. I.e. the market is calibrating to a lower level.
Are you sure? I am much more comfortable believing the estimates are just sales/marketing tools. I find it difficult to view them as the views of a lot of pipe smoking experts pontificating on where the market is 
So then the assertion that it shows a correcting market is not very compelling.
But then I am going on a comfortable belief and not actual knowledge of how those estimates are set!
Bert
Steve Rance said:
I absolutely love Caterhams, started racing in them. Have a very soft spot.
Agreed, they are wonderful cars and a lot more trackable in terms of overall and maintenance costs but, once you start racing them (against other drivers with deeper pockets) it gets serious, as a mate of mine is finding out this year.A guy I used to know back in my TVR days began racing in earnest (pay to drive type set-up) and told me that, in his opinion, you could never be really quick driving your own car...
A slow down maybe, at the top end in the middle market were most of us deal in no.
Values are holding well, plus at this time of year many cars like mine even are in storage ready for the summer.
Due to values more people, are also spending money on there upkeep due to this.
This keeps people in jobs garage work, spares, transport car show interest on the up.
Most of my business, is due to classic cars and spares.
Just because a certain DJ sells a few classic is not a sign for people to panic.
Another one I know of has just spent £100k on a old classic car?
Buy a car to enjoy, and put a smile on your face when it stops sell it.
Values are holding well, plus at this time of year many cars like mine even are in storage ready for the summer.
Due to values more people, are also spending money on there upkeep due to this.
This keeps people in jobs garage work, spares, transport car show interest on the up.
Most of my business, is due to classic cars and spares.
Just because a certain DJ sells a few classic is not a sign for people to panic.
Another one I know of has just spent £100k on a old classic car?
Buy a car to enjoy, and put a smile on your face when it stops sell it.
Edited by SEE YA on Monday 9th November 18:49
355Chris355 said:
Why are you so keen for the 'market' to collapse? Not that it matters, and I only ask as I am genuinely curious.roygarth said:
355Chris355 said:
Why are you so keen for the 'market' to collapse? Not that it matters, and I only ask as I am genuinely curious.355Chris355 said:
Good article , thanks 
SEE YA said:
roygarth said:
355Chris355 said:
Why are you so keen for the 'market' to collapse? Not that it matters, and I only ask as I am genuinely curious.Like most contributors on this thread I've been following prices for years, but imagine if you were new to Porsche and found this page on JZM's web site: http://www.jzmporsche.com/porsche-for-sale/911/3 Here is a 997 GT3 advertised for just £1,000 more than a 3 year older, 10,000 mile further, previous model car... and scroll down to see a 996 GT3 advertised for £2,000 more than a 996.2 GT3!
And this is the bad one for me, the 997.2 GT3: http://www.jzmporsche.com/porsche-for-sale/911/gen... Is it really £30k "better" than a 997 GT3? If you follow the logic of the the 996 example above, it should be cheaper!
No need to explain it - we all know why - as I said before, I understand, but just agree that if you were new to the game and looking in, it's all mad!
WindyM said:
The same as me - the chances of getting into a 997.2 GT3 are zero at the moment.
Like most contributors on this thread I've been following prices for years, but imagine if you were new to Porsche and found this page on JZM's web site: http://www.jzmporsche.com/porsche-for-sale/911/3 Here is a 997 GT3 advertised for just £1,000 more than a 3 year older, 10,000 mile further, previous model car... and scroll down to see a 996 GT3 advertised for £2,000 more than a 996.2 GT3!
And this is the bad one for me, the 997.2 GT3: http://www.jzmporsche.com/porsche-for-sale/911/gen... Is it really £30k "better" than a 997 GT3? If you follow the logic of the the 996 example above, it should be cheaper!
No need to explain it - we all know why - as I said before, I understand, but just agree that if you were new to the game and looking in, it's all mad!
Good post - you're right , if you saw this for the first time you'd think it was bonkers Like most contributors on this thread I've been following prices for years, but imagine if you were new to Porsche and found this page on JZM's web site: http://www.jzmporsche.com/porsche-for-sale/911/3 Here is a 997 GT3 advertised for just £1,000 more than a 3 year older, 10,000 mile further, previous model car... and scroll down to see a 996 GT3 advertised for £2,000 more than a 996.2 GT3!
And this is the bad one for me, the 997.2 GT3: http://www.jzmporsche.com/porsche-for-sale/911/gen... Is it really £30k "better" than a 997 GT3? If you follow the logic of the the 996 example above, it should be cheaper!
No need to explain it - we all know why - as I said before, I understand, but just agree that if you were new to the game and looking in, it's all mad!
RSVP911 said:
WindyM said:
The same as me - the chances of getting into a 997.2 GT3 are zero at the moment.
Like most contributors on this thread I've been following prices for years, but imagine if you were new to Porsche and found this page on JZM's web site: http://www.jzmporsche.com/porsche-for-sale/911/3 Here is a 997 GT3 advertised for just £1,000 more than a 3 year older, 10,000 mile further, previous model car... and scroll down to see a 996 GT3 advertised for £2,000 more than a 996.2 GT3!
And this is the bad one for me, the 997.2 GT3: http://www.jzmporsche.com/porsche-for-sale/911/gen... Is it really £30k "better" than a 997 GT3? If you follow the logic of the the 996 example above, it should be cheaper!
No need to explain it - we all know why - as I said before, I understand, but just agree that if you were new to the game and looking in, it's all mad!
Good post - you're right , if you saw this for the first time you'd think it was bonkers Like most contributors on this thread I've been following prices for years, but imagine if you were new to Porsche and found this page on JZM's web site: http://www.jzmporsche.com/porsche-for-sale/911/3 Here is a 997 GT3 advertised for just £1,000 more than a 3 year older, 10,000 mile further, previous model car... and scroll down to see a 996 GT3 advertised for £2,000 more than a 996.2 GT3!
And this is the bad one for me, the 997.2 GT3: http://www.jzmporsche.com/porsche-for-sale/911/gen... Is it really £30k "better" than a 997 GT3? If you follow the logic of the the 996 example above, it should be cheaper!
No need to explain it - we all know why - as I said before, I understand, but just agree that if you were new to the game and looking in, it's all mad!
Mousem40 said:
I watched the auction last night. Quite a few unsold lots tbh, and quite a few below or near low estimates, though some lots went through the roof (Gauguin carving and the Modig)
Is it the same in the art world that relatively mundane stuff that has been unloved for years suddenly is becoming popular as prices are rising, and that people who previously had no interest now suddenly are enthusiasts..?fredt said:
Is it the same in the art world that relatively mundane stuff that has been unloved for years suddenly is becoming popular as prices are rising, and that people who previously had no interest now suddenly are enthusiasts..?
I've been buying relatively mundane stuff (by blue chip names) from Christies for the past 2 years. Prices have been creeping upwards, but for the really good 'mundane' stuff, really strong prices have been had, so I don't think it's the same. Prices at the top end for top end stuff has been flying with new records being set all the time. Mousem40 said:
I've been buying relatively mundane stuff (by blue chip names) from Christies for the past 2 years. Prices have been creeping upwards, but for the really good 'mundane' stuff, really strong prices have been had, so I don't think it's the same. Prices at the top end for top end stuff has been flying with new records being set all the time.
Sounds fairly similar no? What about the demographic of the buyer?
Mousem40 said:
I've been buying relatively mundane stuff (by blue chip names) from Christies for the past 2 years. Prices have been creeping upwards, but for the really good 'mundane' stuff, really strong prices have been had, so I don't think it's the same. Prices at the top end for top end stuff has been flying with new records being set all the time.
what have you been been buying? I've seen various things like very basic sketches of animals etc drawn by by names go for surprisingly cheap prices at auction before - is this kind of thing you're referring to?WCZ said:
Mousem40 said:
I've been buying relatively mundane stuff (by blue chip names) from Christies for the past 2 years. Prices have been creeping upwards, but for the really good 'mundane' stuff, really strong prices have been had, so I don't think it's the same. Prices at the top end for top end stuff has been flying with new records being set all the time.
what have you been been buying? I've seen various things like very basic sketches of animals etc drawn by by names go for surprisingly cheap prices at auction before - is this kind of thing you're referring to?I'm not sure about the age range as a lot of my bidding is online.
To try and make the comparison more helpful, some of the good Picasso ceramics/prints (ie the equivalent of the 993GT2, 2.7RS etc of this world) have been going for double or triple estimates. The more mundane prints/ceramics (the 3.2, the 964s, the 993 equivalents ) have been doing ok/well. So it's not across the board massive spikes like the car world. I'd say it's more selective. (That's all from my experience of watching prices over the past 2 years it's not scientific)
(Sorry to go off topic)
Edited by Mousem40 on Tuesday 10th November 17:40
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