New breed of GT3 owner
Discussion
Cblair246 said:
PorscheGT4 and Oso out for a Sunday afternoon blast and keeping it old Skool 
Each to their own guys so live and let live.
I must confess I loved The Flintstones when I was a kid... up there with Knight Rider and Street Hawk to be sure Each to their own guys so live and let live.
How about some adaptive dampers for the motor, Barney? Gee, I don't know Fred, isn't that what your arse is for?
sidicks said:
Understood, my comment wasn't aimed only at you, others have said many similar things!
You don't seem to understand that for many the 991 gt3 is a step too far in terms of driver aids/electronics. You don't have to get your knickers in a twist and constantly dive into the fray all the time. It's still a great car! And it doesn't mean the 997 variants have no electronic trickery either!Patent said:
You don't seem to understand that for many the 991 gt3 is a step too far in terms of driver aids/electronics.
I do understand that and people are entitled to their own opinion. I would of course recommend people trying it out for themselves!My key point is that, rather than being black and white as some try and portray, it's all about different shades of grey...
Patent said:
You don't have to get your knickers in a twist and constantly dive into the fray all the time.
I'll post my thoughts as and when I like, thanks very much!Patent said:
It's still a great car! And it doesn't mean the 997 variants have no electronic trickery either!
Tell that to those that appear to claim otherwise!Edited by sidicks on Thursday 20th August 11:16
Edited by sidicks on Thursday 20th August 11:18
Oso said:
sidicks said:
Yes, I understand that.
Also, you are right he is talking about the 991 GT3 but ALSO about the 991 C2S manual he was loaned as a courtesy car which I figured brought the 'regular' PDK box into the discussion i.e. why might you spec a non-GT 991 with a manual.OP I think your Typhoon/ Spitfire analogy is very interesting. The Typhoon is designed intentionally to be inherently unstable in low speed flight in order to enhance its manoeuvrability, with the computers assisting the pilot to control the aircraft. The pilots are of course trained in a succession of more complex aircraft that help develop their skills away from the computers. There are I think some interesting (although obviously imperfect) parallels with the 911. In some situations the rear mounted engine is helpful, in others a challenge; the electronic systems help manage those situations where it is challenging, the idea being to give the best of both worlds.
I love flying too and am learning in a Cirrus which is packed full of pilot assistance systems
- I am certainly not against them per se!!
I love flying too and am learning in a Cirrus which is packed full of pilot assistance systems
- I am certainly not against them per se!!Oso said:
I've invested a lot of time in the skills required to drive a manual, heel-toe shifts, transitioning from left-foot braking to right-foot braking to change gear etc. Also in the roadcraft around planning what gear to be in. I enjoy using those skills. I want to be the one driving the car, not the computer, because that's part of the fun for me.
Oso, great summary. Ignore the 991 Gt3 fanboy. You just can't win with him.I have taken this part of you response as it does cry out for someone to acknowledge that beautiful skill of transitioning from left foot to right while braking and heel and toeing.
It is a wonderful skill to master.
Unfortunately for us luddites it is also a dying skillset but for those who can master this, even driving on a straight bit of road can be rewarding and make you feel at one with the car. This man/horse thingy that mazda has beeyn campaigning on can never be replicated on a 991 Gt3. There is this switch to having the fastest weapon from having the best analogue car and the manual gear change with the 3rd pedal is the single most interactive piece of equipment in an automobile.
There is a place for everyone. I adore my M3 CSL as I do the 997 Gt3 as I will do with the new Gt4
[quote=Oso]OP I think your Typhoon/ Spitfire analogy is very interesting. The Typhoon is designed intentionally to be inherently unstable in low speed flight in order to enhance its manoeuvrability, with the computers assisting the pilot to control the aircraft. The pilots are of course trained in a succession of more complex aircraft that help develop their skills away from the computers. There are I think some interesting (although obviously imperfect) parallels with the 911. In some situations the rear mounted engine is helpful, in others a challenge; the electronic systems help manage those situations where it is challenging, the idea being to give the best of both worlds.
I love flying too and am learning in a Cirrus which is packed full of pilot assistance systems - I am certainly not against them per se!!
Cirrus, very nice also with the ultimate 'Airframe Parachute System' get out of jail card, cool planes with all the toys
I love flying too and am learning in a Cirrus which is packed full of pilot assistance systems
- I am certainly not against them per se!!Cirrus, very nice also with the ultimate 'Airframe Parachute System' get out of jail card, cool planes with all the toys
sidicks said:
jh001ace said:
That was my point, not GT3 specific, just pdk vs manual.
Fair enough, in that case I apologise.(But I think there are plenty of reasons to favour a good manual over a poor (or event quite good) automatic!
Must be a new PH record. Only 9 posts and 75 minutes before the barrage of 991 GT3 multi-quote defensiveness started. Really articulate posts by the OP and Oso about why they like what they like, followed by quite a lot of "my dad's better than your dad" playground nonsense. All IMHO of course, which is probably also wrong.
DT398 said:
Must be a new PH record. Only 9 posts and 75 minutes before the barrage of 991 GT3 multi-quote defensiveness started. Really articulate posts by the OP and Oso about why they like what they like, followed by quite a lot of "my dad's better than your dad" playground nonsense. All IMHO of course, which is probably also wrong.
I guess you just aren't very good at reading.From what I can see its just a discussion about personal opinions and issues being shades of grey rather than black or white.
jh001ace said:
I think I must be one of the much maligned 'New Breed' GT3 owners, I've had my car since June 14 and never tracked it as frankly I'm too concerned about it getting damaged by either me or another track user. I'm not overly concerned by the mileage (currently just over 8,000) but I do wonder why so many cars are for sale on PH with ridiculously low miles. I use mine every day, to and from work, the shops etc. I'm not too concerned with residuals, I'm used to losing money on cars, I lost £30k on my Cayenne S diesel in 18 months.
Mine is comfort spec with PCCBs, lift, leather, carbon etc.(oh, and red stitching!!) which I'm very happy with as I'm not a track jockey but I do prefer the feel of the PCCBs and they do look rather cool - sad I know.
My car is currently at the OPC for warranty work (minute hand of the chrono clock fell off!!)and a campaign on the lift system, I've be loaned a 991 CS2 with a manual box and here's my main point - I really can't understand why anyone would choose a manual 7 speed over the pdk, if feels totally archaic to me, most modern race cars, to my knowledge, have semi-auto boxes so why do purists still want a manual? Surely if you want this type of car buy an old one without all the technology and enjoy.
The GT3 is my first 911, I've previously owned several R8's both manual and R Tronic (which was nowhere as good as the pdk) so do have previous experience of this type of car.
I know I'm going to get shot to pieces here but I just don't get it, perhaps this is why I'm a 'New Breed'!
I love my manual GT3 but I can see the appeal of the 991 GT3 but personally I think I would get bored with it after a while.Mine is comfort spec with PCCBs, lift, leather, carbon etc.(oh, and red stitching!!) which I'm very happy with as I'm not a track jockey but I do prefer the feel of the PCCBs and they do look rather cool - sad I know.
My car is currently at the OPC for warranty work (minute hand of the chrono clock fell off!!)and a campaign on the lift system, I've be loaned a 991 CS2 with a manual box and here's my main point - I really can't understand why anyone would choose a manual 7 speed over the pdk, if feels totally archaic to me, most modern race cars, to my knowledge, have semi-auto boxes so why do purists still want a manual? Surely if you want this type of car buy an old one without all the technology and enjoy.
The GT3 is my first 911, I've previously owned several R8's both manual and R Tronic (which was nowhere as good as the pdk) so do have previous experience of this type of car.
I know I'm going to get shot to pieces here but I just don't get it, perhaps this is why I'm a 'New Breed'!
I borrowed my brother in laws R8 for a weekend in Wales a few years back, it was an R Tronic. I have since driven a S Tronic equipped R8 and even though everyone else says its better, as far as automatic R8's go, I prefer the R Tronic as it required a lift of the accelerator before flipping the paddle to smooth the changes and that 'interaction' with the gearbox is missing with the S Tronic as its just pull the paddle and its super smooth gear changes all day. I would still take a manual every time though.
I wouldn't worry about trying to work out why some don't like it as people prefer different things...... I can't understand those that go out and buy something like a big French saloon brand new either
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