KOX972W - FHC+2
Discussion
Hello everybody.
I wondered if you guys had any information about this car? It's a black 1981 FHC +2.
So far, the only part of its history that I know is that it came over to Germany in 2005, and then sat in a barn... it's never been registered in Germany. Towards the end of last year, somebody spotted it, liked its "Lotus-like" looks and bought it. Then he realised it was heart over head and put it up for sale, and I came along and bought it (I'm still at the heart over head stage - I love the look of the FHCs and it's a nice contrast to the curvier Tuscan).
It's still at the place I bought it and I hope to bring it back here (Luxembourg, of all places) in the next couple of weeks, at which point I will take proper photos etc.
The state of the car is as follows:
Any information is much appreciated.
Incidentally, I got this one shortly after I "missed" a blue FHC - don't think it was a +2 - that was also sold in northern Germany. Does anybody know about that one? It was missing a radiator and I would be interested to know more about it. (I was told it was sold the day before I was to see it... but we'd already booked a hotel so spent a weekend near it in Bremen).
I wondered if you guys had any information about this car? It's a black 1981 FHC +2.
So far, the only part of its history that I know is that it came over to Germany in 2005, and then sat in a barn... it's never been registered in Germany. Towards the end of last year, somebody spotted it, liked its "Lotus-like" looks and bought it. Then he realised it was heart over head and put it up for sale, and I came along and bought it (I'm still at the heart over head stage - I love the look of the FHCs and it's a nice contrast to the curvier Tuscan).
It's still at the place I bought it and I hope to bring it back here (Luxembourg, of all places) in the next couple of weeks, at which point I will take proper photos etc.
The state of the car is as follows:
- the interior is pretty good, though I think there may be some trim missing around the centre console as there are heater hoses all over the place (unless that's normal). The wood needs some TLC; the varnish has split off the wood (or veneer, I presume).
- the body-work, I think, is complete and in "reasonable" condition, with some crazed paint that I need to look better at when it arrives here. It's going to need a respray at some point.
- all the glass is fine
- all electrics seem to behave themselves, including lights and electric windows. The gauges are all "SW" and I think they're newer than the car?
- the engine starts and runs but the guy selling it says it misfires sometimes. Sounded fine to me and a friend.
- the outriggers and where they mount the front suspension are knackered
- there's chassis damage on one of the tubes in the middle of the boxy bit towards the diff
- all of the mechanics (suspension, brakes, exhaust) under the car are going to need to be stripped off and sorted; it was supposedly in a dry barn, but it's all pretty rusty
- it currently has no door mirrors, but there are some chromed mirrors in a box in the car. I assume they're not original.
- both doors have dropped... I hope that's usually an adjustment issue?
- the SW gauges mentioned above
- there are two rusted round metal "caps" on the passenger side of the top of the bonnet... with nothing on the other side (not even a screw/bolt/etc). Any idea what that might have been?
Any information is much appreciated.
Incidentally, I got this one shortly after I "missed" a blue FHC - don't think it was a +2 - that was also sold in northern Germany. Does anybody know about that one? It was missing a radiator and I would be interested to know more about it. (I was told it was sold the day before I was to see it... but we'd already booked a hotel so spent a weekend near it in Bremen).
wedgeman said:
Taken at the BBWF 2005
Image courtesy of Pie Man
Oh wow, that's fantastic, thank you so much. Image courtesy of Pie Man
I hope it will look that good again soon.It also answers another question I was going to ask about wheel originality: my wheels aren't original because it (currently) has the lattice wheels.
For the plate:
Engine: 1257-111
Chassis: FH5123FI2
Body code: 807
Hi mate..Looks like the chrome mirrors were on it previously..Probably not original but the flag mirrors are really hard to source..I think someone found something similar.
Again you may be pushed to find an original set of the early wheels and with the centres....
The doors could of dropped and just need adjusting or the nylon bushes have become oval...Someone made some on here so I'm sure they can be sourced.
Engine misfire...Please tell me that you didn't start the car after it has sat for years?....I would of drained some petrol out of the tank from the T or swirl pot to see if it contains rust..Then i would change fuel filters and pump if needed, Most certainly fuel hoses...Fill up with fresh fuel and a heavy dose of injector cleaner...
I had a lot of problems with the 280i i owned that was sat for 11 years and somebody did that...Although i never had a mis-fire on the V6..Just cutting out dead....
Well done for rescuing it....
Again you may be pushed to find an original set of the early wheels and with the centres....
The doors could of dropped and just need adjusting or the nylon bushes have become oval...Someone made some on here so I'm sure they can be sourced.
Engine misfire...Please tell me that you didn't start the car after it has sat for years?....I would of drained some petrol out of the tank from the T or swirl pot to see if it contains rust..Then i would change fuel filters and pump if needed, Most certainly fuel hoses...Fill up with fresh fuel and a heavy dose of injector cleaner...
I had a lot of problems with the 280i i owned that was sat for 11 years and somebody did that...Although i never had a mis-fire on the V6..Just cutting out dead....
Well done for rescuing it....
Hi - unfortunately the horse was well bolted on the engine start-up before I arrived. The seller is a "master mechanic" so hopefully trod carefully. I could not ask because he spoke little English and I have zero German (his girlfriend did admirably at English but technical terms ... We failed to communicate a lot even with Google translate).
TimLux said:
Hi - unfortunately the horse was well bolted on the engine start-up before I arrived. The seller is a "master mechanic" so hopefully trod carefully. I could not ask because he spoke little English and I have zero German (his girlfriend did admirably at English but technical terms ... We failed to communicate a lot even with Google translate).
Close to the face, slow and loud in English would surely have worked? Great car!!
General Zod said:
Close to the face, slow and loud in English would surely have worked?
Great car!!
I'll have a go at that tomorrow when I pick up the car. Great car!!
(And thanks for the kind comment.. it's not great yet but it will definitely get there). I will try and get the seller to put it back on a lift so I can take photos before I stick it on the back of the van to bring it here. Is there anything else I should take a proper look at while I'm under it?In terms of a restoration, I'm not sure which order to do things in. This is only my second restoration project and my first - a TR7 - is still in many many pieces in the barn. I want to make sure the engine isn't dodgy before taking everything off the chassis, which means sorting out the fuel system. Should I assume that the whole lot is knackered and replace everything, or are there pieces that might be alright? Once the engine is definitely fine, I'll strip everything off the chassis and get it sorted while I re-condition the brakes/diff/suspension/etc.
Hi Tim,
Fellow FHC owner from Belgium here ... Main issue with the wedges is sourcing parts, certain things are hard to find so hope you have a complete car with all the bits & pieces.
Just a heads up on the front lights which is probably the most difficult part (was for mine), you'll need these in EU (LHD) configuration and as far as I know these cannot be found anymore. S-series lights can be converted & will fit.
Grts
Fellow FHC owner from Belgium here ... Main issue with the wedges is sourcing parts, certain things are hard to find so hope you have a complete car with all the bits & pieces.
Just a heads up on the front lights which is probably the most difficult part (was for mine), you'll need these in EU (LHD) configuration and as far as I know these cannot be found anymore. S-series lights can be converted & will fit.
Grts
Hi Tim...If the car has sat for a while then be careful starting it...I would first check ALL the fuel hoses, Especially while you are under there..And then check the condition of the oil...Change the bulkhead fuel filter...Check the plugs, You could whip them all out and then get a 19mm on the crank pulley and gently hand crank to make sure nothing is sticking...Add fresh fuel and at least a full bottle of injector cleaner then go for it...Ziga
Hi guys.
Thanks for the comments, and apologies for the lack of updates. I'm still waiting for bits and pieces - including the wedge bible - to arrive, and to have the time to have a proper poke and a go at the engine.
Now I have some picture galleries for you to poke through at your leisure. (Regarding jack points... don't look!).
The car is, I think, complete; well, missing a spare 15x7J lattice wheel. There are a couple of bits that are non-original, though, including the driver side rear quarter glass. The tops of the doors have also been solidly rebuilt, which means at least somebody took care of the car... but the fit of the rebuild against the door aperture is "poor". Both the doors and the quarter panel are the kind of thing that will bug me, but I won't be going out of my way to pay to have that rebuilt unless somebody finds a good source for the parts.
Regarding the LHD lights, I think my plan for this car is to get it re-registered in the UK before I attempt to register it over here, so the RHD lights can stay for now.
Other comments:
Thanks for the comments, and apologies for the lack of updates. I'm still waiting for bits and pieces - including the wedge bible - to arrive, and to have the time to have a proper poke and a go at the engine.
Now I have some picture galleries for you to poke through at your leisure. (Regarding jack points... don't look!).
The car is, I think, complete; well, missing a spare 15x7J lattice wheel. There are a couple of bits that are non-original, though, including the driver side rear quarter glass. The tops of the doors have also been solidly rebuilt, which means at least somebody took care of the car... but the fit of the rebuild against the door aperture is "poor". Both the doors and the quarter panel are the kind of thing that will bug me, but I won't be going out of my way to pay to have that rebuilt unless somebody finds a good source for the parts.
Regarding the LHD lights, I think my plan for this car is to get it re-registered in the UK before I attempt to register it over here, so the RHD lights can stay for now.
Other comments:
- the detritus comes off the car to leave a reasonable paint-job underneath; it's hard work removing it even with cleaning products, but it comes off. The respray won't be needed short or medium term.
- I think it's had a fuel tank upgrade to an alloy tank
- I presume rear quarter panels are like hens' teeth?
- has anybody got a spare 15x8J lattice wheel knocking about?
- I need a better cleaning product to remove the "dust" off the car (not sure what dust it is, as it looks very white when it gets together)
- anybody got a good idea on what's going on with the lumps in the bonnet?
- is the interior - other than the gauges - original? (or at least re-trimmed to match the original).
- I presume that the heater tubes are normally behind some sort of cover? Hens' teeth?
TimLux said:
Regarding jack points... don't look!
Well I did and you're jacking up in the wrong place (IMHO).At the front I always jack under where the 5 tubes meet just behind the back wheels but inboard at the front of the transmission tunnel.
At the rear it depends what job I'm doing but typically on the U-channel next to the diff with a 19mm or thicker block of wood.
If you jack up near the outrigger ends that's not such a strong point as you have found, luckily they are not hugely structural so you could just have that split welded up for now.
Good luck with it though and keep that damn cat off the paintwork - it's scratched enough already ;^)
That car looks really good to me, pretty much original and a great project. What makes you think the gauges are not original? They look like the right ones for an early car to me.
The sill tubes are an easy repair, when you get the sill covers off you can access them quite easily:
There's no need to go to a TVR specialist; I had mine done by a competent local garage for a fraction of the cost of a 'specialist'. Check out Ian's Wedgeneering site for more info.
My 350i has covers over the heater ducts either side of the transmission tunnel, however they are roughly moulded glassfibre panels trimmed in vinyl and just stuffed into position with no fixings. They would be easy to replicate. They do obstruct the heater output though so I'm not surprised that they're missing.
I wouldn't expect the headlights to be a problem, they're standard parts. I've replaced mine with Land Rover Defender lights bought secondhand, you'd be able to get RH dip versions of those surely? Original Mini ones would also fit.
Good luck with it!
The sill tubes are an easy repair, when you get the sill covers off you can access them quite easily:
There's no need to go to a TVR specialist; I had mine done by a competent local garage for a fraction of the cost of a 'specialist'. Check out Ian's Wedgeneering site for more info.
My 350i has covers over the heater ducts either side of the transmission tunnel, however they are roughly moulded glassfibre panels trimmed in vinyl and just stuffed into position with no fixings. They would be easy to replicate. They do obstruct the heater output though so I'm not surprised that they're missing.
I wouldn't expect the headlights to be a problem, they're standard parts. I've replaced mine with Land Rover Defender lights bought secondhand, you'd be able to get RH dip versions of those surely? Original Mini ones would also fit.
Good luck with it!
Hi Tim...
That white mist looks like paint dust...You can try isopropyl alcohol but test on a small area first..You can also use gasoline but be careful with both..Don't over do it...You will then need to wash down with warm soapy water and then use a wax but let it soak in...You will need a few layer but do not hard buff after..You could try clay bar instead of the alcohol but without knowing what the dust is then i would be wary in case it acts as an aggressive cutting compound and takes off layer of paint..If its hard to remove from the vinyl interior then Meguiars number 57 will do it no problem ..In fact check all their products.
The velour on the door cards and seat inners can be cleaned with an automotive fabric/Carpet cleaner but again nothing too aggressive and always test on a small area....They may just brush up with a soft upholstery brush...Not hard nylon!.Oh and its always best to hoover the interior first including the seats.
The interior looks original or at least trimmed original..The heater hoses are in the right place... The heater matrix is behind the centre console..And up a bit...
The side glass is like rocking horse poo....As are the flag door mirrors.
The chassis looks a bit rough in places,Especially around the outriggers... I think the sills are moulded to the body on the FHC?....
I have a space saver wheel as did most but thats in the garage and i carry a tin of tyre weld and have breakdown cover...
Also as Adam says be careful where you jack it up from!...Here is an old thread as regards..
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=123...
Hope this helps...
Still a cracking Wedge.....Cheers...Ziga
That white mist looks like paint dust...You can try isopropyl alcohol but test on a small area first..You can also use gasoline but be careful with both..Don't over do it...You will then need to wash down with warm soapy water and then use a wax but let it soak in...You will need a few layer but do not hard buff after..You could try clay bar instead of the alcohol but without knowing what the dust is then i would be wary in case it acts as an aggressive cutting compound and takes off layer of paint..If its hard to remove from the vinyl interior then Meguiars number 57 will do it no problem ..In fact check all their products.
The velour on the door cards and seat inners can be cleaned with an automotive fabric/Carpet cleaner but again nothing too aggressive and always test on a small area....They may just brush up with a soft upholstery brush...Not hard nylon!.Oh and its always best to hoover the interior first including the seats.
The interior looks original or at least trimmed original..The heater hoses are in the right place... The heater matrix is behind the centre console..And up a bit...
The side glass is like rocking horse poo....As are the flag door mirrors.
The chassis looks a bit rough in places,Especially around the outriggers... I think the sills are moulded to the body on the FHC?....
I have a space saver wheel as did most but thats in the garage and i carry a tin of tyre weld and have breakdown cover...
Also as Adam says be careful where you jack it up from!...Here is an old thread as regards..
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=123...
Hope this helps...
Still a cracking Wedge.....Cheers...Ziga
Hi all, thanks for the kind comments.
Jacking points, sorry, I know none of them were put in the right place, that's why I didn't want you guys to look
(lost in translation when I picked it up... from now onwards I have no excuse). Thanks for the link Zig.
Gauges - mine have yellow SW labels on them - it was my assumption that they weren't original. If that's not the case then I'm happy.
Headlights - mine are RHD and, as far as I know, fine for UK use (the LHD comment was due to Pieter's comment about not being able to find LHD ones). I'll have a poke around for mini/LR LHD ones in case I need them later, thanks.
Paint dust - that would explain why it's a pain to scrape off. I'll have a go with clay bar tonight but I'd need a pretty big lump of clay to take it off the whole car. I was wondering if a rotary polisher might be the way to go (I think a friend has one I can borrow). I'll give the alcohol/petrol a go this weekend.
Interior - great, I'll go through it with some carpet cleaner too.
Sills - not sure if they're molded. Mine certainly have screws underneath, but I'll have a proper look tonight/tomorrow and see how the top part is fitted. I was hoping they'd come off relatively easily to give me a good look at the outriggers.
Spare wheel - just another thing that'll annoy me until I find one. (It's not that I want to use it, it's more that it should have one, if you know what I mean).
Jacking points, sorry, I know none of them were put in the right place, that's why I didn't want you guys to look
(lost in translation when I picked it up... from now onwards I have no excuse). Thanks for the link Zig.Gauges - mine have yellow SW labels on them - it was my assumption that they weren't original. If that's not the case then I'm happy.
Headlights - mine are RHD and, as far as I know, fine for UK use (the LHD comment was due to Pieter's comment about not being able to find LHD ones). I'll have a poke around for mini/LR LHD ones in case I need them later, thanks.
Paint dust - that would explain why it's a pain to scrape off. I'll have a go with clay bar tonight but I'd need a pretty big lump of clay to take it off the whole car. I was wondering if a rotary polisher might be the way to go (I think a friend has one I can borrow). I'll give the alcohol/petrol a go this weekend.
Interior - great, I'll go through it with some carpet cleaner too.
Sills - not sure if they're molded. Mine certainly have screws underneath, but I'll have a proper look tonight/tomorrow and see how the top part is fitted. I was hoping they'd come off relatively easily to give me a good look at the outriggers.
Spare wheel - just another thing that'll annoy me until I find one.
(It's not that I want to use it, it's more that it should have one, if you know what I mean).Here you go mate...But i wheelie wouldn't hang about on it....
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TVR-350-WEDGE-ALLOY-WHEE...
Blimey two at the same time...
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TVR-350-WEDGE-ALLOY-WHEE...
With wheel centres as well...They are like hens teeth...
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TVR-350-WEDGE-ALLOY-WHEE...
Blimey two at the same time...
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TVR-350-WEDGE-ALLOY-WHEE...
With wheel centres as well...They are like hens teeth...
Edited by mrzigazaga on Friday 5th February 13:14
mrzigazaga said:
Here you go mate...But i wheelie wouldn't hang about on it....
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TVR-350-WEDGE-ALLOY-WHEE...
Blimey two at the same time...
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TVR-350-WEDGE-ALLOY-WHEE...
With wheel centres as well...They are like hens teeth...
Thanks Zig. I can't see them here at work... do they have at least the rest of the day left on them?http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TVR-350-WEDGE-ALLOY-WHEE...
Blimey two at the same time...
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TVR-350-WEDGE-ALLOY-WHEE...
With wheel centres as well...They are like hens teeth...
mrzigazaga said:
Hi mate...They both have a "Buy it now" so no auction...Cheers..Ziga
Perfect - got a friend in the UK to buy one of them for me (they visit often enough to chuck it in the back next time they visit instead of paying expensive shipping). Tasmin200 said:
Looks like a great car you've found. It must be a really early one with the high above gearbox exhaust. Thanks for posting your photographs, they are a great source of reference of an original 2+2.
One of the reasons I did it is because when I looked around for photos before buying a car I found no useful interior shots at all; there were a few standard FHC but no plus two. I will take many more photos and upload them as I fix it up. If anybody wants a full quality one or a photo of something particular, please let me know.Gassing Station | Wedges | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff