bad bad comment from a porsche site about bikers
Discussion
I think there is a fundamental difference between a courteous and well trained motorcyle rider who rides "vocationally" of choice, and an untrained scooter pilot who rides through necessity, (either age or urban location), especially when the scooter pilot only sees it as a stop gap until they can get in 4 wheels and so has no interest in learning the craft.
I don`t ride a motorcyle on the road but have an understanding and awareness of those who do. When I see a rider behind me on the motorway and I am waiting for someone in front to pull over I have no problem in making a half lane change to allow them past, their size allows them to make quicker progress through traffic. similarly there is nothing wrong with riding between stationary lanes of traffic and again I will pull the car over to alow them past. The trouble comes when the bike is doing 50mph and I am stationary. By the time I indicate, check my mirrors and instigate a lane change the bike may have passed 4 or 8 cars and so wasn`t there when I did my checks. Then bang. That rider was travelling too fast for the conditions.
Given I race a car it would be very easy for me to drive within inches of other motorists or to carry excess speed through a blind corner. Providing other motorists do nothing wrong I`ll be fine, the problem is you have to drive to the lowest denominator on a public road and bikes can sometimes forget that. Knowing you`re the fastest thing on a given stretch of road makes it very tempting to use that power at will. The trick is to know when to hold back.
For what it`s worth I think riding a motor bike and driving a Porsche, especially a pre `89 911, demand very similar skills re: reading the road ahead. That and the fact we form the upper band of speed capability on the road in our cars means motorcyclists and Porsche drivers might not be as different as you think. We have to show restraint and maturity on the road and we often get tarred with a brush that might not be of our chosing.
Henry
I don`t ride a motorcyle on the road but have an understanding and awareness of those who do. When I see a rider behind me on the motorway and I am waiting for someone in front to pull over I have no problem in making a half lane change to allow them past, their size allows them to make quicker progress through traffic. similarly there is nothing wrong with riding between stationary lanes of traffic and again I will pull the car over to alow them past. The trouble comes when the bike is doing 50mph and I am stationary. By the time I indicate, check my mirrors and instigate a lane change the bike may have passed 4 or 8 cars and so wasn`t there when I did my checks. Then bang. That rider was travelling too fast for the conditions.
Given I race a car it would be very easy for me to drive within inches of other motorists or to carry excess speed through a blind corner. Providing other motorists do nothing wrong I`ll be fine, the problem is you have to drive to the lowest denominator on a public road and bikes can sometimes forget that. Knowing you`re the fastest thing on a given stretch of road makes it very tempting to use that power at will. The trick is to know when to hold back.
For what it`s worth I think riding a motor bike and driving a Porsche, especially a pre `89 911, demand very similar skills re: reading the road ahead. That and the fact we form the upper band of speed capability on the road in our cars means motorcyclists and Porsche drivers might not be as different as you think. We have to show restraint and maturity on the road and we often get tarred with a brush that might not be of our chosing.
Henry
Henry-F said:I broadly agree with all that and always applaud those willing to go out of their way to let us get on our way
When I see a rider behind me on the motorway and I am waiting for someone in front to pull over I have no problem in making a half lane change to allow them past, their size allows them to make quicker progress through traffic.
Just as a nit-picky point though, if you make a half-lane change on the motorway it can be a bit difficult to judge what's going on and I'd be a bit wary of overtaking you in this situation. I've been caught out in the past by people who have changed their minds and people who weren't moving left after all but were just changing radio channels. Boths times I found I needed to take avoiding action so I wasn't smeared down the armco so I wait until they've changed lanes completely.
All the best,
Mark
dern said:
Just as a nit-picky point though, if you make a half-lane change on the motorway it can be a bit difficult to judge what's going on and I'd be a bit wary of overtaking you in this situation.Mark
Which is why I will give a bit of a flick on the indicators and then move accross to let the chap(esse) past. It`s all about understanding other road users. There`s nothing better on a long run than driving with a couple of cars that all understand each other and realise when a car needs to pull out of a lane because it`s catching up a slower car etc.
Happy motoring.
Henry
I always help bikers past if I can - and am often thanked.
I have never once been held up by a biker so why wouldn't I get them past me rather than have them behind getting frustrated and, possibly, causing an accident.
If I'm turning right across traffic, however, I expect all following traffic to pass to my left or not at all.
I have never once been held up by a biker so why wouldn't I get them past me rather than have them behind getting frustrated and, possibly, causing an accident.
If I'm turning right across traffic, however, I expect all following traffic to pass to my left or not at all.
Henry-F said:Nice one
Which is why I will give a bit of a flick on the indicators and then move accross to let the chap(esse) past. It`s all about understanding other road users. There`s nothing better on a long run than driving with a couple of cars that all understand each other and realise when a car needs to pull out of a lane because it`s catching up a slower car etc.
agent006 said:
I see your troll in the bikers forum took off well Steve.
Trolling has worn a bit thin over there, it's all a bit dull now. I always check profiles before replying to provocative threads to see what their motivation is for posting. ESPECIALLY when they just put a link to some heated debate without commenting on it themself.
ADD this to the fact that the Car V Bike thing has been done to DEATH! most intelligent people know that there are idiots in both camps.
P.S. Got caught in the local Porsche dealer by another PHer the other day.... so I may turn Teutonic in the near future myself.
>> Edited by S2rr Kitty on Wednesday 24th August 19:08
>> Edited by S2rr Kitty on Wednesday 24th August 19:35
Henry hit the nail on the head, [quote=Henry-f]It`s all about understanding other road users[quote=Henry-F]
Percieving others moves, keeping an eye on whats going on around you and around the other road users.
let everyone around you, know what your intendting to do before you do it, might not have stopped this chaps boxter being scratched but will make you a better driver, not just for bikers.
Percieving others moves, keeping an eye on whats going on around you and around the other road users.
let everyone around you, know what your intendting to do before you do it, might not have stopped this chaps boxter being scratched but will make you a better driver, not just for bikers.
MOD500 said:
Spot on Henry.
morning coming to donnington next week
henry you are a top motorist there is to many selfish drivers on the road with know consideration for other users the person that started this thread on 911uk.com probadly sits in the outside lane all day think i have a porsche boxter and i should be in the fast lane passed hundreds of these in the middle lane
yeah all agreed. Its not bikes..its women that are dangerous 
p.s. sorry chaps I couldn't resist, but you guys really need to chill out. Like was said earlier somewhere We're all petrol heads! So I don't want to hear that someone is a *anker because he overtook you, or that the 70mph speed limit is too fast etc etc zzzz Yawn.
p.s. sorry chaps I couldn't resist, but you guys really need to chill out. Like was said earlier somewhere We're all petrol heads! So I don't want to hear that someone is a *anker because he overtook you, or that the 70mph speed limit is too fast etc etc zzzz Yawn.
Henry-F said:
For what it`s worth I think riding a motor bike and driving a Porsche, especially a pre `89 911, demand very similar skills re: reading the road ahead.
Totally agree, think years on bikes helped me not spank early 911s when I was let loose driving lots of 'em, cornering principles are just the same, well except for the leaning over bit, oh & Ive not fallen off a 911 yet
steve f said:
thats exactly my point they are a weird lot on there had a few run ins on that site but my name on there dont help [ferrari's rule]
Steve F, you seem to cause mayhem whichever forum you use, including 911uk (which I run), if it's really that bad then please - DONT VISIT! We've built up a great community over the last few years and comments like that do nothing for anyone.
>> Edited by pconibere on Thursday 25th August 21:37
pconibere = not standing up for steve but he was only linking to a thread on your forum, and the thread had a distastful heading which he complained about on this forum.
i think that was his point, FYI, just in case you missed it.
as a biker i have lost a few great friends, posting a thread saying, I quote, "killabiker.com" is not neccisary to get your point across.
my advise is to stop these threads before they become what this has.
I hope you all the best with your forum, lets just moderate it better yeah?
Gary
i think that was his point, FYI, just in case you missed it.
as a biker i have lost a few great friends, posting a thread saying, I quote, "killabiker.com" is not neccisary to get your point across.
my advise is to stop these threads before they become what this has.
I hope you all the best with your forum, lets just moderate it better yeah?
Gary
Not many people on here know this but I've got a full bike licence. Took lessons and test etc just for the hell of it and to make me a more skilled road user in general. As for motorcyclists being t
ts, the generalisation is frankly bollox. Like many areas of life there are skilled and unskilled people. The one thing I will say though is the reason I don't own a bike is shite motorists on the roads rather than fast or perceived crazy bikers.
There are inflamatory statements/comments all over the net, even on PH! Hell Steve even admits his name on the forum is inflamatory. The thread starter on the thread concerned is clearly hacked off with the actions of an irresponsible biker and a few people on the forum are letting rip with a few generalising posts that don't stand up to scrutiny. So what? Either get stuck into the thread and debate with the people concerned or ignore it. Posting links on other forums, to a thread elsewhere with a view of getting outsiders to go in and have a ruck is frankly poor form. (unless it's a lentlists scum forum
)
Someone mentioned posts should be moderated. All well and good but can I suggest people help site owners/moderators out by drawing attention to posts they find offensive. There is normally a reporting procedure or an email link for such purpose.
DAZ
(I'm sure there are car drivers and bikers who think I'm a mad barsteward behind the wheel, they're merely ignorant)
>> Edited by dazren on Thursday 25th August 23:07
ts, the generalisation is frankly bollox. Like many areas of life there are skilled and unskilled people. The one thing I will say though is the reason I don't own a bike is shite motorists on the roads rather than fast or perceived crazy bikers. There are inflamatory statements/comments all over the net, even on PH! Hell Steve even admits his name on the forum is inflamatory. The thread starter on the thread concerned is clearly hacked off with the actions of an irresponsible biker and a few people on the forum are letting rip with a few generalising posts that don't stand up to scrutiny. So what? Either get stuck into the thread and debate with the people concerned or ignore it. Posting links on other forums, to a thread elsewhere with a view of getting outsiders to go in and have a ruck is frankly poor form. (unless it's a lentlists scum forum
) Someone mentioned posts should be moderated. All well and good but can I suggest people help site owners/moderators out by drawing attention to posts they find offensive. There is normally a reporting procedure or an email link for such purpose.
DAZ
(I'm sure there are car drivers and bikers who think I'm a mad barsteward behind the wheel, they're merely ignorant)
>> Edited by dazren on Thursday 25th August 23:07
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