porsche buy disaster--advice please

[fidgits]

DucatiGary said:

if I was the OP, this sounds like an ideal time to start praticing my very best "I told you so" dance.

?

[Vesuvius 996]

[DucatiGary]

the I told you so dance is a unique and personal dance, the one I use was originally coreographed by Homer Simpson.

it goes:-

point point (left finger) clap and sing "told ya so"
point point (right finger) clap and sing "told ya so"
then hop onto right foot whilst:-
point point (left finger) clap twice and sing "told ya so"
point point (right finger) clap twice and sing "told ya so"
then hop onto left foot whilst:-
point point (left finger) clap and sing "told ya so"
point point (right finger) clap and sing "told ya so"

its very much like the clap point point clap point point point clap and squat that can be found here.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?doc

HTH

[chillerman]

DucatiGary said:

the I told you so dance is a unique and personal dance, the one I use was originally coreographed by Homer Simpson.

it goes:-

point point (left finger) clap and sing "told ya so"
point point (right finger) clap and sing "told ya so"
then hop onto right foot whilst:-
point point (left finger) clap twice and sing "told ya so"
point point (right finger) clap twice and sing "told ya so"
then hop onto left foot whilst:-
point point (left finger) clap and sing "told ya so"
point point (right finger) clap and sing "told ya so"

its very much like the clap point point clap point point point clap and squat that can be found here.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?doc

HTH

Priceless ! LMFAO

[Andy T]

I'm pretty sure that you still have some comeback from the garage you bouoght it from. The term "sold as seen" means nothing in law. You are still covered by consumer rights. Get in touch with the consumer advice service.

www.consumerdirect.gov.uk/

A

[bumcrack]

If you buy something and it goes faulty within 28 days you're entitled to a full refund or a replacement, the choice is yours

[Boosted LS1]

Was payment made using plastic?

Boosted.

[ragtop]

can you please post a link to the previous thread?

ta

[UFO 2 NOB]

fidgits said:

well.

Firstly, i take it he approved Porsche to fix the tappets etc as he paid for them?

I personally would've called the garage at the point this was made aware and under the consumer rights act threaten to reject the car and get my money back...

Didnt the garage offer a warranty/guarantee? If they explicitly stated 'sold as seen', then he doesnt have a leg to stand on..

It is ilegal for a motor trader to even use the words "sold as seen no warrant implied or given"

[thegoose]

Andy T said:

I'm pretty sure that you still have some comeback from the garage you bouoght it from. The term "sold as seen" means nothing in law. You are still covered by consumer rights. Get in touch with the consumer advice service.

www.consumerdirect.gov.uk/

A

You could, but the advice in my original post is from Trading Standards. If the dealer can prove that the car was OK (including any known faults that were declared and agreed), which in this case the OPC check proves for him quite conclusively, then only faults inconsistent with the car's age & mileage can even be considered to be his responsibility. It would certainly seem morally wrong to try to get the seller to pay for repairing a car you have bought at a discount on the basis you are taking all risks with it. However, the public often seem to forget their morals when dealing with car dealers, especially when they think they may be able to get out of a cost that they should really bear themselves.

To answer a couple of other points:
1) There is no law stating what can and can't be stated on an invoice. If something like this goes to court, whatever is written will be considered by a judge in so much as he/she will determine what each party took the wording of any agreement to mean, and make both parties abide by his determination of that. Therefore if he/she determines that the buyer understood they were taking all risk in making the particular purchase then they will get no recompense.
2) There is no automatic 28 day refund entitlement on used goods, unless it's something the seller chooses to offer.

[DanH]

UFO 2 NOB said:

fidgits said:

well.

Firstly, i take it he approved Porsche to fix the tappets etc as he paid for them?

I personally would've called the garage at the point this was made aware and under the consumer rights act threaten to reject the car and get my money back...

Didnt the garage offer a warranty/guarantee? If they explicitly stated 'sold as seen', then he doesnt have a leg to stand on..

It is ilegal for a motor trader to even use the words "sold as seen no warrant implied or given"

I've always wondered if/when that would happen to Henry with his bug price cars!

[graeme73s]

I'm sorry to read about your friends dilemer but I can only suggest two things. Get another opinion on the problem and another price as this this does seem rather expensive. Then tell him to wipe his mouth and just enjoy the car.

[chemical ali]

thegoose said:

Andy T said:

I'm pretty sure that you still have some comeback from the garage you bouoght it from. The term "sold as seen" means nothing in law. You are still covered by consumer rights. Get in touch with the consumer advice service.

www.consumerdirect.gov.uk/

A

You could, but the advice in my original post is from Trading Standards. If the dealer can prove that the car was OK (including any known faults that were declared and agreed), which in this case the OPC check proves for him quite conclusively, then only faults inconsistent with the car's age & mileage can even be considered to be his responsibility. It would certainly seem morally wrong to try to get the seller to pay for repairing a car you have bought at a discount on the basis you are taking all risks with it. However, the public often seem to forget their morals when dealing with car dealers, especially when they think they may be able to get out of a cost that they should really bear themselves.

To answer a couple of other points:
1) There is no law stating what can and can't be stated on an invoice. If something like this goes to court, whatever is written will be considered by a judge in so much as he/she will determine what each party took the wording of any agreement to mean, and make both parties abide by his determination of that. Therefore if he/she determines that the buyer understood they were taking all risk in making the particular purchase then they will get no recompense.
2) There is no automatic 28 day refund entitlement on used goods, unless it's something the seller chooses to offer.

Very nearly spot on but the overiding position would be dictated by the the Sale of Goods Act and actually seems to indicate this chap cannot go after the dealer:

First of all, the goods are sold in the course of business and Stevenson -v- Rogers 1999 firmly stated that any business that sells anything then, for the purpose of s.14, it does so in the course of a business. In other words, and of significance to your pal, you would be entitled to your money back under section 14(2)of SoGA if it can be proved that the the goods were not of "satisfactory quality".

This is a strict implied term put in by statute and that cannot be negated by the invoice alone.

However, this term can be rendered not to be implied if a: the defect was bought to the buyer's specific attention by the seller prior to sale or b: where the buyer examines the goods before the contract is made and that examination ought to have revealed a particular defect in the goods.

In other words, your mate would have a case except for the fact he has carried out an inspection that in effect enables the seller to say tough luck. That inspection should have picked up a defect so bad as to render the car undrivable. So far as s.14 (2) is concerned, a buyer who does not examine the goods at all might well find himself in a better position than a buyer who does.

Any judge would consider the age and condition, but the overridng problem is it was inspected.

You would therefore be best served, in my humble and subjective opinion, looking very closely at the conditions of the inspection contract. I would be suprised, however, if the inspection contract is not tied up very well by whoever did the inspection.

As Versuvius the Barista said "he took the risk and it hasn't paid off". But, given the cost, it is probably worth getting an opinion from a specialist lawyer.

Best of luck.

[johnmaddox]

Some good advice has been given.

It does highlight the danger of getting the work done and then trying to sort out who pays after the event.

We all want our car to be perfect but in this case he should have got quotes for the job and then approached the Vehicle Examiner and the Retailer for resolution before going ahead.

Has he retained the old parts ? If not then an extra difficult case as an engineers report can't be obtained.

[The Saint 911]

Thanks All for your Advice and Comments- Its disappointing that something so serious on the car wasnt noticed on the check. I appreciated as someone said earlier they dont strip the engine but thought tappets/noise would have been. He did get 2k off the car for the things that needed doing and a bit of bargaining. I guess as he had his heart set on a Targa/Tiptronic when the car came out clean {in the end} he went for it. I have mentioned a couple of other places to get 2nd opinion and get the car fixed, he just wants to enjoy it and he will- being a new Porsche owner. He is taking Legal Advice, but something like this you could be throwing more money away for little gain- All - Thanks Again-

[LuckyP]

Check out under SoGA the term - Reverse burdon of proof.

It put the onus on the seller (if a trader)to prove that the fault wasn't there when you bought it.

I think this could fit in this this case.

Lucky

[Globulator]

It sounds very much ike when you buy a house, pay a fortune for a big survey and then it falls down. In court (small claims?) you could argue that the point of the inspection was to prevent yourself being in this situation. I do not think you can blame the seller or buyer because the inspection was clear.

Go after the inspection company, who may in turn go after the company that alledges the fault.

[glugcom]

I was in a similar position when I bought my tt from nonOPC. Pre sale it had opc check and warranty attached but a week after delivery it lost coolant. OPC said 3 Rad's were leaking £2k+ bill. Warranty wouldn't cover corrosion so I took it back to the dealer as 'unfit for purpose'. They wriggled but eventually paid up full amount as the fault was already present at time of sale. That's when I lost faith in the OP warranty.

[The Saint 911]

hi, just for the record, for the Tappets at PARRS gatwick, WHERE I VE BEEN a few times, they ve quoted £786+vat---bit different to £3,500

[911wise]

There is no such thing as a cheap porsche to either purchase or run.There is no such thing as a cheap porsche to either purchase or run.There is no such thing as a cheap porsche to either purchase or run.There is no such thing as a cheap porsche to either purchase or run.There is no such thing as a cheap porsche to either purchase or run.There is no such thing as a cheap porsche to either purchase or run.Do you get it or do I have to copy and paste some more!
Think your gonna have to fork out for this one. If it goes to court dealer is simply gonna point to report and say, what more could I do? If the dealer has a reputation he values perhaps a agreement, or compromise can be reached before it goes this far.