RE: Government blamed for increase in road deaths
Discussion
robinessex said:
Thanks Zebedee, there's me been thinking it was to prevent accidents, and make the roads safer.......................!!!
Driving fast does not cause accidents, driving badly does !!!Want to reduce accidents - ban slow drivers on B roads, ban mobile phone use in cars, ban anyone who drives too closely in rain or fog,improve driver eductaion etc.
The whole blinkered lobby who maintain that driving fast is the cause of accidents are misleading themselves and the public and diverting resources away from the real cause of accidents.
Perversely the go-slow lobby are the cause of the increase in fatal accidents.
macdeb said:
Any death is tragic. [imagine brother, sister, mother?] But, as far as I can see there is NO education anymore as far as road safety is concerned. People [especially the young] just walk out in front of cars almost enticing the driver to hit them with their arrogant attitude. Also, people are not taught to drive anymore, they are mearly taught how to pass a test.
PS; My comment is as I see it, let it be known that I am NOT a fan of the current government coalition. They are the THE most useless incompetant shower of s
t ever to take office as one of their own ministers pointed out 'they don't know the price of milk' they are so out of touch so we'd be foolish to think they'd improve things on the roads safety wise or not 
rant over, didn't want to be mistaken.Redlake27 said:
My solution:
Urban areas: No traffic calming, speedbumps etc but instead go for the Dutch style 'no road markings' shared space idea. Make drivers, cyclists and pedestrians think about each other
Rural areas: Remove road signs for bends and hazards. People depend on them until they crash at a corner where there is no sign. Like gantry signs that say 'Fog' or 'rain' they are unnecessary. Teach people to make their decisions based on looking ahead rather than condition them on having to be told what to do.
The urban design aspect is now policy and has been since 2007. Have a look at a document called "Manual for Streets" or MfS. There's additional guidance in MfS2.Urban areas: No traffic calming, speedbumps etc but instead go for the Dutch style 'no road markings' shared space idea. Make drivers, cyclists and pedestrians think about each other
Rural areas: Remove road signs for bends and hazards. People depend on them until they crash at a corner where there is no sign. Like gantry signs that say 'Fog' or 'rain' they are unnecessary. Teach people to make their decisions based on looking ahead rather than condition them on having to be told what to do.
As well as promoting the idea of shared surfaces, the document relaxed visibility standards from the standards set out in DB32 and the DMRB for most roads. (I.E. not trunk, and its open to interpretation when it comes to rural areas to some extent)
For an emerging vehicle in a 30mph limit the current visibility standard from a 2.4m set back is now 43m where it was 90m.
I do wonder if this has something to do with the rise in accidents. I doubt it though.
There has also been a change in the way speed limits are evaluated, de-restricted roads are now having speed limits posted that equate to the 85th percentile. (This is a little out of my field so I'm open to correction on this.)
I suspect the big crash on the M5 caused by the bonfire may have had some bearing on the overall rise... (Nov 2011).
Taking the figure in isolation is pretty pointless. For it to have any significance it should be a comparison between km driven per road death.
I also feel that all the bits of read tarmac, flashing VIS signs, the plethora of non essential road signs etc have not done anything to improve things, I think the accident death rate has decreased year on year though improvements in car safety features. We've not had anything in the way of groundbreaking safety features introduced for a while now which may explain why the rate has effectively levelled off.
Edited by Zombie on Thursday 19th July 22:11
macdeb said:
macdeb said:
Any death is tragic. [imagine brother, sister, mother?] But, as far as I can see there is NO education anymore as far as road safety is concerned. People [especially the young] just walk out in front of cars almost enticing the driver to hit them with their arrogant attitude. Also, people are not taught to drive anymore, they are mearly taught how to pass a test.
PS; My comment is as I see it, let it be known that I am NOT a fan of the current government coalition. They are the THE most useless incompetant shower of st ever to take office as one of their own ministers pointed out 'they don't know the price of milk' they are so out of touch so we'd be foolish to think they'd improve things on the roads safety wise or not rant over, didn't want to be mistaken.The road have been left totally f
ked by those shaved ape s who were thankfully kicked out a couple of years back and we're seeing those particular pigeons coming home to roostirocfan said:
The road have been left totally fked by those shaved ape s who were thankfully kicked out a couple of years back and we're seeing those particular pigeons coming home to roost
What are you on about? LG budgets have been slashed by the Tories and as a consequence so has their road maintenance bugets.ked by those shaved ape s who were thankfully kicked out a couple of years back and we're seeing those particular pigeons coming home to roostI'm not saying one party or the other is to blame for our crumbling roads, they're both guilty of not adequately investing in them. The fundmental problem is any increase in public spending tends to be in education (and health care), they're elso protected to some extent from cuts being made as it's seen as it's not PC to make the cuts despite their being plenty of excess fat there.
Edited by Zombie on Friday 20th July 13:07
Edited by Zombie on Friday 20th July 13:25
irocfan said:
100% in agreement about the 1st part about the tragedy - as for the second we'll just agree to difer on this. So a minister doesn't know the price of a pint, so what? That has to be one of the most pointless stupid questions I can think of. I don't know the price of a pint either (ditto eggs, rice, steak etc), I need a pint and I go and get it as part of my weekly shop.
The road have been left totally fked by those shaved ape s who were thankfully kicked out a couple of years back and we're seeing those particular pigeons coming home to roost
Ahh, thought this might've happened. The comment on 'price of milk' is a generalisation of how distant Cameron/osbourne are from real life, she could've used tea or paint, and she is a conervative MP too The road have been left totally f
ked by those shaved ape s who were thankfully kicked out a couple of years back and we're seeing those particular pigeons coming home to roost
Good on her for being honest.You think the last lot where bad, phuck you've seen nothing yet with this lot, though they've made some mighty f
k-ups already and the sooner they're gone the better.PS; Whoever is in power will not for one moment benefit you or me, they feather their nest, f
k up then fk off not giving a st about us.Edited by macdeb on Friday 20th July 13:15
Edited by macdeb on Friday 20th July 13:16
Yeloperil said:
Over many years it has never ceased to amaze me that cycle racing continues to be held on several stretches of the A1 dual carriageway trunk road. Only recently on a Sunday morning I came across it again. Bonkers IMHO.
Was it dangerous though? Or did it just slow you down a bit, the same way that a tractor and trailer might have done?macdeb said:
You think the last lot where bad (I do - hate them with a passion!!)
PS; Whoever is in power will not for one moment benefit you or me, they feather their nest, fk up then fk off not giving a st about us.
can't disagree with that last though - suspect we're on the same page PS; Whoever is in power will not for one moment benefit you or me, they feather their nest, f
k up then fk off not giving a st about us.
What is the problem?
Driving a car is a dangerous activity and it will never be 100% safe.
Add to this already dangerous recreation the extreme level of idiocy apparant in most drivers and thats your answer right there.
Morons kill people!
Cars are safe!
Get rid of the moron,,, now thats a campaign I would support.
Driving a car is a dangerous activity and it will never be 100% safe.
Add to this already dangerous recreation the extreme level of idiocy apparant in most drivers and thats your answer right there.
Morons kill people!
Cars are safe!
Get rid of the moron,,, now thats a campaign I would support.
Most accidents are caused by big, overgrown, spoilt kids-in-adult-bodies that drive like tts whenever they don't get their own way.
The country is hideously overcrowded and we're all trying to get somwehere. Unfortunatley there's always the aforementioned bellends that think they have the right to be in front of everyone else - hence needless accidents.
ts whenever they don't get their own way. The country is hideously overcrowded and we're all trying to get somwehere. Unfortunatley there's always the aforementioned bellends that think they have the right to be in front of everyone else - hence needless accidents.
Roadster25 said:
Surely fatalities can't keep on decreasing for ever? There must be some natural level which will never be eradicated, no matter what measures are put in place. Once that level is found there is bound to be some sort of variance year on year.
Tell that to the Swedes!http://www.visionzeroinitiative.com/en/Concept/
carinaman said:
...How many died in that pile up on the M5 on Nov. 4? People driving into fog and hurtling down the outside despite the tailback was due to the coalition? Hasn't subsequent press coverage cited the failure to commission fog warning lights/signs on that stretch of the M5? Drivers can't tell it's foggy?...
Well they can't tell when it's not foggy (judging by the proliferation of high-intensity rear lamps whenever there's a slight mist), so...Edited by gareth_r on Sunday 22 July 15:58
I found this govenment article . Gives readers some idea how mant tests were taken last year.Over 400,000 between October and December 2011.
The key findings from Driver and Rider Test and Instructor Statistics: Quarter 3 2011/12 include:

A total of 437,038 tests were conducted across all test categories1 between October and December 2011 (Q3 2011/12). This represents an overall increase of 14 per cent in comparison with the same period the year before.

The increase in the number of tests conducted during the quarter in comparison with the previous year (Q3 2010/11) is due to the milder winter weather in late 2011. The heavy snowfall throughout most of Great Britain in December 2010 led to a reduction in the number of tests conducted and lowered candidate demand for tests.

Overall, the practical car test pass rate has increased slightly from 44 per cent in 2007/08 to 46 per cent in 2010/11. The pass rate for the first three quarters of 2011/12 is 47 per cent.

The number of car tests taken by females is higher than for males largely due to females having a lower pass rate than males, hence taking higher number of tests before passing.
Interesting figures.By my sums thats roughly 1.6million tests taken in 2011, with a 46% pass rate thats 736000 new drivers on the road, just for 2011.
As usual, important info that is not included in the scaremongering story about accident increases.
When is the driving test going to start covering motorway use?!
Mark, Derby, Impreza driver.
The key findings from Driver and Rider Test and Instructor Statistics: Quarter 3 2011/12 include:

A total of 437,038 tests were conducted across all test categories1 between October and December 2011 (Q3 2011/12). This represents an overall increase of 14 per cent in comparison with the same period the year before.

The increase in the number of tests conducted during the quarter in comparison with the previous year (Q3 2010/11) is due to the milder winter weather in late 2011. The heavy snowfall throughout most of Great Britain in December 2010 led to a reduction in the number of tests conducted and lowered candidate demand for tests.

Overall, the practical car test pass rate has increased slightly from 44 per cent in 2007/08 to 46 per cent in 2010/11. The pass rate for the first three quarters of 2011/12 is 47 per cent.

The number of car tests taken by females is higher than for males largely due to females having a lower pass rate than males, hence taking higher number of tests before passing.
Interesting figures.By my sums thats roughly 1.6million tests taken in 2011, with a 46% pass rate thats 736000 new drivers on the road, just for 2011.
As usual, important info that is not included in the scaremongering story about accident increases.
When is the driving test going to start covering motorway use?!
Mark, Derby, Impreza driver.
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