Shocked by this...
Discussion
Once again Willy Nilly tarring your vast experience of 2 horsey people as all the same, how very ignorant of you. You have no idea whatsoever what you're talking about, my horse is fed a very basic diet, has never had garlic whatsoever and I won't even bore you with his breeding as going on your vast experience, it'd go over your very small head.
What you've said is like me saying that an M3 is akin to a Reliant Robin, that a Merc SLS is like a Punto. So if I were you, I'd shut up...
What you've said is like me saying that an M3 is akin to a Reliant Robin, that a Merc SLS is like a Punto. So if I were you, I'd shut up...
Baldybong said:
Once again Willy Nilly tarring your vast experience of 2 horsey people as all the same, how very ignorant of you. You have no idea whatsoever what you're talking about, my horse is fed a very basic diet, has never had garlic whatsoever and I won't even bore you with his breeding as going on your vast experience, it'd go over your very small head.
What you've said is like me saying that an M3 is akin to a Reliant Robin, that a Merc SLS is like a Punto. So if I were you, I'd shut up...
I went to agricultural college, the place was infested with horsey girls. Where I work now has had a livery yard for about 10 years with up to 30 clients. We also supply hay to another yard with about 20 on there and various other private yards in the locality. What you've said is like me saying that an M3 is akin to a Reliant Robin, that a Merc SLS is like a Punto. So if I were you, I'd shut up...
If horses eat a very basic diet, why is the feed shed full of apples, swedes, carrots, a cheese grater, bales and bales of that alfalfa from Dengie and all sorts of other crap? You won't let them eat long grass, but will feed them long hay, yet you insist that the grazing paddocks have less grass on them than the crease at The Oval but won't sweep up the short bits of hay because they are too short? Every time I go to the horsey yard I think I've seen it all but they always raise the bar. You're right, I never got my head around genetics at college
I could go on
Have you ever seen one of these http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/like/191003162876?hlpht=... and if so, would you know how to operate it?
Dressage Horse Owners Explained
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRRLCSnzjxw
The Dressage Horse
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x54Jr-NPDCc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRRLCSnzjxw
The Dressage Horse
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x54Jr-NPDCc
Willy Nilly said:
Baldybong said:
Once again Willy Nilly tarring your vast experience of 2 horsey people as all the same, how very ignorant of you. You have no idea whatsoever what you're talking about, my horse is fed a very basic diet, has never had garlic whatsoever and I won't even bore you with his breeding as going on your vast experience, it'd go over your very small head.
What you've said is like me saying that an M3 is akin to a Reliant Robin, that a Merc SLS is like a Punto. So if I were you, I'd shut up...
I went to agricultural college, the place was infested with horsey girls. Where I work now has had a livery yard for about 10 years with up to 30 clients. We also supply hay to another yard with about 20 on there and various other private yards in the locality. What you've said is like me saying that an M3 is akin to a Reliant Robin, that a Merc SLS is like a Punto. So if I were you, I'd shut up...
If horses eat a very basic diet, why is the feed shed full of apples, swedes, carrots, a cheese grater, bales and bales of that alfalfa from Dengie and all sorts of other crap? You won't let them eat long grass, but will feed them long hay, yet you insist that the grazing paddocks have less grass on them than the crease at The Oval but won't sweep up the short bits of hay because they are too short? Every time I go to the horsey yard I think I've seen it all but they always raise the bar. You're right, I never got my head around genetics at college
I could go on
2. Nicely assuming that I am the above when I am not
3. I do not do dressage so once again you're way off the mark there
4. I have a vanner cob which is nothing like the horses you are probably trying to pigeon-hole me with
5. Tar brush and thanks for spoiling an interesting debate with your narrow minded, selfish ignorant views - you are what the car fraternity does not need.
Vipers said:
If I am out on the mountain bike at the weekends and approach a rider, I will ding my bell on approach, until the rider turns around and sees me.
Where I ride is just about empty of cars, so plenty of space to pull over and pass, but it doesnt hurt to make sure the rider knows you are coming up behind them.
That is NOT what I am talking about, If you can't see that, then I think I'm not the stupid one.Where I ride is just about empty of cars, so plenty of space to pull over and pass, but it doesnt hurt to make sure the rider knows you are coming up behind them.
Gary C said:
Should we limit horses to 30mph roads ?
It's the 60mph country roads that are the worst (I don't mean single track with blind bends, more the wider but still twisty ones). It's easy to drive at a 'safe' 50mph enjoying the drive then meet a horse and rider. Even if the road is safe at that speed for all other traffic, pedestrians etc, a horse by its nature is a different matter and needs to be approached and passed slowly.
Maybe more country roads should be restricted to 30 and horses likewise?
I like the fact that people can ride freely, but even considerate drivers can occasionally be caught out on faster roads.
Just an idea.
Driving without due care attention springs to mind. If you cant see around the corner, approach with caution, could be a stationary vehicle, and if you cant see a rider on a horse, either your blind, or just stupid. Could just be a cyclist around the corner. Drive carefully.It's the 60mph country roads that are the worst (I don't mean single track with blind bends, more the wider but still twisty ones). It's easy to drive at a 'safe' 50mph enjoying the drive then meet a horse and rider. Even if the road is safe at that speed for all other traffic, pedestrians etc, a horse by its nature is a different matter and needs to be approached and passed slowly.
Maybe more country roads should be restricted to 30 and horses likewise?
I like the fact that people can ride freely, but even considerate drivers can occasionally be caught out on faster roads.
Just an idea.
Edited by Vipers on Monday 16th December 09:55
Edited by Vipers on Monday 16th December 09:56
On an A road for example where you can easily pass a cyclist at 60 safely, and make reasonable progress, i would not pass a horse at that speed, it would be dangerous. You need longer straight sections to pass slow and wide and I don't think that is good for the driver's or the rider. It can cause stress, anger and belligerent behaviour (from both sides).
If the road was a 30mph road ( by limit or being sufficiently narrow and bendy) then I think it is more reasonable to be more accepting of the compromise that a horse puts on other traffic (if it's a 30, then why get stressed when passing a horse slowly) As such I think it would be a good idea to limit horses to 30mph max roads but to limit country lanes that really are too narrow and twisty to 30mph.
I think it would make riding safer and more enjoyable and stop horses being on roads where they are clearly not suited.
Edited by Gary C on Wednesday 18th December 08:41
Willy Nilly said:
Dressage Horse Owners Explained
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRRLCSnzjxw
The Dressage Horse
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x54Jr-NPDCc
What the fhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRRLCSnzjxw
The Dressage Horse
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x54Jr-NPDCc
k has that got to do with this topic ?Fair and good point Gary. I can remember seeing one of the Motorway cop style shows where they said that the majority of fatalities are on NSL unlit roads in rural areas, they are usually at night and the drivers are going to fast for the conditions.
The problem is that many horse yards are on lanes, or A/B roads and although there are road signs saying horses, not many people would actually think they're going to encounter a horse. I must say that about 30% of the drivers I encounter pass a bit too fast (fortunately my horse is excellent in traffic including heavy farm machinery, huge lorries, noisy trailers etc.) and about 10% make zero effort to slow down. So the majority of people are very considerate, however I'm in a village location where there are plenty of horses, the villagers are used to them and it's usually the people visiting the posh pub from larger towns/cities who can be the ones who aren't country road savvy... I've seen people leave their food to come outside and see the horses passing and to see if they can pet them.
It would be good to see a lower limit on country roads, I can never get over single track roads with NSL, but who in their right mind would drive at 60mph down a road like that?!?
The problem is that many horse yards are on lanes, or A/B roads and although there are road signs saying horses, not many people would actually think they're going to encounter a horse. I must say that about 30% of the drivers I encounter pass a bit too fast (fortunately my horse is excellent in traffic including heavy farm machinery, huge lorries, noisy trailers etc.) and about 10% make zero effort to slow down. So the majority of people are very considerate, however I'm in a village location where there are plenty of horses, the villagers are used to them and it's usually the people visiting the posh pub from larger towns/cities who can be the ones who aren't country road savvy... I've seen people leave their food to come outside and see the horses passing and to see if they can pet them.
It would be good to see a lower limit on country roads, I can never get over single track roads with NSL, but who in their right mind would drive at 60mph down a road like that?!?
Gary C said:
What the fk has that got to do with this topic ?
Willy (quite appropriate name) seems to think that I am like that from the way he seems to lump everyone into the same boat as people he knows who have horses. My horse is more like something from Appleby/Steptoe & Son, a traditional hairy thing who is very sensible with a fantastic temperament and is well trained like a big dog ;-) The others who I assume he is referring to are in the minority, not the majority from what I know of horsey people. And I know a lot who fall into all camps...k has that got to do with this topic ?I'm going to get lynched by some here but I'll say it anyway.
I grew up in a very horsey village. I even rode horses myself many moons back but I do have a problem with them on some roads. While I think its fine to ride a horse on a quiet road, I'm seeing horses more and more often on busy A roads (and even some busy B roads), which is I think very crass and careless. These are fast roads with 60mph limits and sometimes long corners prevent you seeing what's ahead.
Then you have the other problem. Horse crap. I almost wrote off my 2 week old motorcycle because of a damp lump of horse crap in the middle of a B road corner. I wasn't speeding and the road was dry however you can't always swerve for a flattened out slippery piece of st on the road. In fact, my very first post on PH was exactly about this!
I completely sympathise for the gentleman and the loss of his horse but ultimately, there is an increasing amount of traffic on the roads and eventually something will give and we have to adapt our ways.
I think horses should be banned from A roads completely, and some B roads too. I also think as one person suggested, proper training, licensing and responsibility for those that allow their horses to crap on the road, just like dog owners. I know there are special pouches used for catching horse crap but they are rarely used. They should be mandatory if riding your horse on a road.
I await my lynching but stand firm on my views.
I grew up in a very horsey village. I even rode horses myself many moons back but I do have a problem with them on some roads. While I think its fine to ride a horse on a quiet road, I'm seeing horses more and more often on busy A roads (and even some busy B roads), which is I think very crass and careless. These are fast roads with 60mph limits and sometimes long corners prevent you seeing what's ahead.
Then you have the other problem. Horse crap. I almost wrote off my 2 week old motorcycle because of a damp lump of horse crap in the middle of a B road corner. I wasn't speeding and the road was dry however you can't always swerve for a flattened out slippery piece of s
t on the road. In fact, my very first post on PH was exactly about this!I completely sympathise for the gentleman and the loss of his horse but ultimately, there is an increasing amount of traffic on the roads and eventually something will give and we have to adapt our ways.
I think horses should be banned from A roads completely, and some B roads too. I also think as one person suggested, proper training, licensing and responsibility for those that allow their horses to crap on the road, just like dog owners. I know there are special pouches used for catching horse crap but they are rarely used. They should be mandatory if riding your horse on a road.
I await my lynching but stand firm on my views.
Vipers said:
beanbag said:
I'm going to get lynched by some here but I'll say it anyway. Etc etc"......
I await my lynching but stand firm on my views.
Agree your points, only bummer for horsey people is those places which exit onto B roads, if you ban horses on those roads, they won't be happy.I await my lynching but stand firm on my views.
Ultimately, I think proper licensing, insurance (no idea if they pay this already??), and equal liability for horse riders is necessary. (Enforcing poop bags for example and big fines and prosecution for those who don't).
No doubt some will say that cyclists should have to be on par with this and I also agree. I already carry 3rd party liability insurance as a cyclist so if I were to cause any damage, I know I can pay for it without any worry.
Hi Beanbag,
I'm not out to lynch or castrate anyone, if anything I'm the lynchee, not the lyncher as I'm the one with the horse ;-)
I personally have public liability insurance via the British Horse Society, as well as other insurance such as injury to me or my horse/vet fees etc. It's about £450 a year, give or take. Yes horses are a luxury, my horse is my hobby, I choose to spend my money on him and he has a lovely life and he will be with me until he pops his hooves (which hopefully will be many years as he's only 5). On the flip side, I could say that cars are a luxury, in our house are 2 adults, 3 cars and a motorbike - don't really need all that, but it's our choice, just as someone who wants to commute to work in their Astra, but at the weekend takes their vintage car out for a spin or bring the Ferrari out of the garage for a blast. Would you deny people their hobbies of choice because you personally aren't keen?
As for horse poo on the road... yes it can be a hazard, if it's in the middle of the road I would ask why as most horses should be on the left unless the horse was being used on a trap or cart. The reason why horse poo isn't cleared up like dog poo (and there are still plenty of people who don't clean up after their dog) is it doesn't pose the health risks to humans like dog poo does, horses are vegetarians and as it's veg matter it will break down much quicker than any other poo. I would much rather tread in horse poo than dogs. As for the practicalities of dismounting/mounting on a road to clear up the poo, this in itself would be dangerous for both the horse, rider and other road users, where could the horse be tethered, bags of poo on the side of the road, having to carry a shovel/equipment to clear it up... it will never happen, despite it being a problem for some road users. The same danger, if not more so, also comes from tractors coming out of muddy fields leaving a trail of mud on the road, or diesel being spilt on the road (I myself have spun out on a roundabout after following a lorry who had diesel leaking and I was not driving like an idiot), they are also hazards...
At the end of the day, we all choose to use the roads, I can assure you that riders who do use the roads will only be on them to get to a bridle-path and not there just to annoy the hell out of other drivers. Our horses are valuable animals whom we care very much about and do not want to see them hurt, any more than you would want your vehicle damaged or yourself put in any danger, or potentially hurt any other road user. But like anything, there is the small minority who will ruin it for everyone else. My personal pet peeve is not being thanked by riders when I pass carefully, gives us all a bad name and also when they don't wear high viz - that really is stupid ;-)
I'm not out to lynch or castrate anyone, if anything I'm the lynchee, not the lyncher as I'm the one with the horse ;-)
I personally have public liability insurance via the British Horse Society, as well as other insurance such as injury to me or my horse/vet fees etc. It's about £450 a year, give or take. Yes horses are a luxury, my horse is my hobby, I choose to spend my money on him and he has a lovely life and he will be with me until he pops his hooves (which hopefully will be many years as he's only 5). On the flip side, I could say that cars are a luxury, in our house are 2 adults, 3 cars and a motorbike - don't really need all that, but it's our choice, just as someone who wants to commute to work in their Astra, but at the weekend takes their vintage car out for a spin or bring the Ferrari out of the garage for a blast. Would you deny people their hobbies of choice because you personally aren't keen?
As for horse poo on the road... yes it can be a hazard, if it's in the middle of the road I would ask why as most horses should be on the left unless the horse was being used on a trap or cart. The reason why horse poo isn't cleared up like dog poo (and there are still plenty of people who don't clean up after their dog) is it doesn't pose the health risks to humans like dog poo does, horses are vegetarians and as it's veg matter it will break down much quicker than any other poo. I would much rather tread in horse poo than dogs. As for the practicalities of dismounting/mounting on a road to clear up the poo, this in itself would be dangerous for both the horse, rider and other road users, where could the horse be tethered, bags of poo on the side of the road, having to carry a shovel/equipment to clear it up... it will never happen, despite it being a problem for some road users. The same danger, if not more so, also comes from tractors coming out of muddy fields leaving a trail of mud on the road, or diesel being spilt on the road (I myself have spun out on a roundabout after following a lorry who had diesel leaking and I was not driving like an idiot), they are also hazards...
At the end of the day, we all choose to use the roads, I can assure you that riders who do use the roads will only be on them to get to a bridle-path and not there just to annoy the hell out of other drivers. Our horses are valuable animals whom we care very much about and do not want to see them hurt, any more than you would want your vehicle damaged or yourself put in any danger, or potentially hurt any other road user. But like anything, there is the small minority who will ruin it for everyone else. My personal pet peeve is not being thanked by riders when I pass carefully, gives us all a bad name and also when they don't wear high viz - that really is stupid ;-)
I thought bridle paths were for mountain biking on? Actually, if we brought up an argument between cyclists and horse riders we could create a self perpetuating power source that would solve the worlds energy problems.
Really though, if you must have a hobby, do you have to have one that blocks up the modern road system, as well as prevents mountain bikers from enjoying a nice ride out on their traditional pathways? Horses were cool back in the 1800's when they were a genuine, irreplaceable mode of transport. These days having a horse is nothing more than crochet or knitting, a hobby, apart from the fact granny's don't crochet on busy roads made for cars!!
Yes, I said it, made for cars. Let's not get hung up on some outdate law about the right to ride a horse. I have lots of rights I don't exercise because they would cause inconvenience to others. Did you know that we as citizens have the right to own air raid horns, and sound them at the first sign of danger, like an aeroplane flying overhead, or a german made car coming down the road, or even some nutcase riding a giant horse down a tarred road!! Of course you didn't, ears to full of manure to even consider that just because something is legal, doesn't mean you have to be a pain in the rear and do it.
But in all seriousness, I fully accept horses and their riders need to use the roads, and always give them lots of room. I would hate to see the end of jodphers on our roads, so make sure I am extra courteous wherever possible.
Really though, if you must have a hobby, do you have to have one that blocks up the modern road system, as well as prevents mountain bikers from enjoying a nice ride out on their traditional pathways? Horses were cool back in the 1800's when they were a genuine, irreplaceable mode of transport. These days having a horse is nothing more than crochet or knitting, a hobby, apart from the fact granny's don't crochet on busy roads made for cars!!
Yes, I said it, made for cars. Let's not get hung up on some outdate law about the right to ride a horse. I have lots of rights I don't exercise because they would cause inconvenience to others. Did you know that we as citizens have the right to own air raid horns, and sound them at the first sign of danger, like an aeroplane flying overhead, or a german made car coming down the road, or even some nutcase riding a giant horse down a tarred road!! Of course you didn't, ears to full of manure to even consider that just because something is legal, doesn't mean you have to be a pain in the rear and do it.
But in all seriousness, I fully accept horses and their riders need to use the roads, and always give them lots of room. I would hate to see the end of jodphers on our roads, so make sure I am extra courteous wherever possible.
Edited by Iklwa on Wednesday 18th December 13:04
Baldybong said:
Hi Beanbag,
I'm not out to lynch or castrate anyone, if anything I'm the lynchee, not the lyncher as I'm the one with the horse ;-)
I personally have public liability insurance via the British Horse Society, as well as other insurance such as injury to me or my horse/vet fees etc. It's about £450 a year, give or take. Yes horses are a luxury, my horse is my hobby, I choose to spend my money on him and he has a lovely life and he will be with me until he pops his hooves (which hopefully will be many years as he's only 5). On the flip side, I could say that cars are a luxury, in our house are 2 adults, 3 cars and a motorbike - don't really need all that, but it's our choice, just as someone who wants to commute to work in their Astra, but at the weekend takes their vintage car out for a spin or bring the Ferrari out of the garage for a blast. Would you deny people their hobbies of choice because you personally aren't keen?
As for horse poo on the road... yes it can be a hazard, if it's in the middle of the road I would ask why as most horses should be on the left unless the horse was being used on a trap or cart. The reason why horse poo isn't cleared up like dog poo (and there are still plenty of people who don't clean up after their dog) is it doesn't pose the health risks to humans like dog poo does, horses are vegetarians and as it's veg matter it will break down much quicker than any other poo. I would much rather tread in horse poo than dogs. As for the practicalities of dismounting/mounting on a road to clear up the poo, this in itself would be dangerous for both the horse, rider and other road users, where could the horse be tethered, bags of poo on the side of the road, having to carry a shovel/equipment to clear it up... it will never happen, despite it being a problem for some road users. The same danger, if not more so, also comes from tractors coming out of muddy fields leaving a trail of mud on the road, or diesel being spilt on the road (I myself have spun out on a roundabout after following a lorry who had diesel leaking and I was not driving like an idiot), they are also hazards...
At the end of the day, we all choose to use the roads, I can assure you that riders who do use the roads will only be on them to get to a bridle-path and not there just to annoy the hell out of other drivers. Our horses are valuable animals whom we care very much about and do not want to see them hurt, any more than you would want your vehicle damaged or yourself put in any danger, or potentially hurt any other road user. But like anything, there is the small minority who will ruin it for everyone else. My personal pet peeve is not being thanked by riders when I pass carefully, gives us all a bad name and also when they don't wear high viz - that really is stupid ;-)
Hello! I'm not out to lynch or castrate anyone, if anything I'm the lynchee, not the lyncher as I'm the one with the horse ;-)
I personally have public liability insurance via the British Horse Society, as well as other insurance such as injury to me or my horse/vet fees etc. It's about £450 a year, give or take. Yes horses are a luxury, my horse is my hobby, I choose to spend my money on him and he has a lovely life and he will be with me until he pops his hooves (which hopefully will be many years as he's only 5). On the flip side, I could say that cars are a luxury, in our house are 2 adults, 3 cars and a motorbike - don't really need all that, but it's our choice, just as someone who wants to commute to work in their Astra, but at the weekend takes their vintage car out for a spin or bring the Ferrari out of the garage for a blast. Would you deny people their hobbies of choice because you personally aren't keen?
As for horse poo on the road... yes it can be a hazard, if it's in the middle of the road I would ask why as most horses should be on the left unless the horse was being used on a trap or cart. The reason why horse poo isn't cleared up like dog poo (and there are still plenty of people who don't clean up after their dog) is it doesn't pose the health risks to humans like dog poo does, horses are vegetarians and as it's veg matter it will break down much quicker than any other poo. I would much rather tread in horse poo than dogs. As for the practicalities of dismounting/mounting on a road to clear up the poo, this in itself would be dangerous for both the horse, rider and other road users, where could the horse be tethered, bags of poo on the side of the road, having to carry a shovel/equipment to clear it up... it will never happen, despite it being a problem for some road users. The same danger, if not more so, also comes from tractors coming out of muddy fields leaving a trail of mud on the road, or diesel being spilt on the road (I myself have spun out on a roundabout after following a lorry who had diesel leaking and I was not driving like an idiot), they are also hazards...
At the end of the day, we all choose to use the roads, I can assure you that riders who do use the roads will only be on them to get to a bridle-path and not there just to annoy the hell out of other drivers. Our horses are valuable animals whom we care very much about and do not want to see them hurt, any more than you would want your vehicle damaged or yourself put in any danger, or potentially hurt any other road user. But like anything, there is the small minority who will ruin it for everyone else. My personal pet peeve is not being thanked by riders when I pass carefully, gives us all a bad name and also when they don't wear high viz - that really is stupid ;-)
Ta for not lynching me!
I still stand by my comments, especially with the horse manure on the road. It might not be hazardous to touch but it is very dangerous to motorcyclists and even cyclists. You mention diesel spills and tractors leaving mud trails. Both are criminally liable for any damages / accidents incurred by their mess on the floor. http://www.norfolk.gov.uk/Travel_and_transport/Roa...
It begs the question why horse owners aren't liable for this either? As I mentioned, manure bags do exist to prevent this but ultimately, the safety of the roads has to be upheld but all it's users. You can't have an exception for one group. In fact, in many other countries (such as Australia), it is against the law to leave animal dung on the road and animal owners are liable for any damages incurred as a result of it on the road.
Regarding your argument stating Ferrari's or sports cars are a luxury etc...they are merely part of a vast majority of road users. Horses have not been the majority for probably a century now so laws should be updated to accommodate owners. If you base your argument around me, the bike I almost crashed was my commuting bike and I was out to see a friend that day. (And to add I only have the one car).
You are quite correct in saying that at the end of the day we all choose to use the roads but we should all use them responsibly and out-of-date bridle laws must be updated for the majority of others and the safety of the riders themselves.
Quite simply, horses should be banned from A-roads and dangerous B roads, and owners need to be held liable for any mess made by their animals and have compulsory insurance to ride on the road. (By the way, I credit you with having insurance but honestly ask yourself how many riders have this?)
P.S. Final comment. I don't know why you get peeved if you're not thanked when passing cyclists or slower road users. British society is about apologising and thanking profusely but lets be honest, why on earth should you be thanked every time for doing the right thing and driving carefully?
Edited by beanbag on Wednesday 18th December 13:39
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