RE: Lorries to be banned from overtaking?
Discussion
My suggestions:
1. From 0500-1000 and from 1700-2200, in addition to current restrictions:
1.1 No HGVs may use lane 2 of 2 lane carriageways.
1.2 No LGVs may use lane 3 of 3 lane carriageways.
2. All HGVs shall, when fully laden, be capable of maintaining 90 kph (56 mph) on any motorway gradient with the exception of designated 'crawler lanes'.
3. Motorway speed limit to be raised to 80 mph for passenger cars and motorcycles, 70 mph for all other traffic.
1. From 0500-1000 and from 1700-2200, in addition to current restrictions:
1.1 No HGVs may use lane 2 of 2 lane carriageways.
1.2 No LGVs may use lane 3 of 3 lane carriageways.
2. All HGVs shall, when fully laden, be capable of maintaining 90 kph (56 mph) on any motorway gradient with the exception of designated 'crawler lanes'.
3. Motorway speed limit to be raised to 80 mph for passenger cars and motorcycles, 70 mph for all other traffic.
Works fine in most European countries along with other measures such as no trucks in some places on a Sunday or weekends and so on, their shops and stores etc are still fully stocked.
No reason why it shouldn't be intoduced here. That being said there are some drivers of cars that need their driving licences removed, their cars crushed and made to take a train !!! and what the story with these 40mph mopeds that go on the busy dual carrageways causing allsorts of tailbacks on the way up the A19 to Newcastle every morning and night.
Come to think of it why doesn't the government get off it's arse and get a decent public and frieght transport on the railways set up so that it doesn't take me the best part of 2 hours to drive to work some mornings.
J.
No reason why it shouldn't be intoduced here. That being said there are some drivers of cars that need their driving licences removed, their cars crushed and made to take a train !!! and what the story with these 40mph mopeds that go on the busy dual carrageways causing allsorts of tailbacks on the way up the A19 to Newcastle every morning and night.
Come to think of it why doesn't the government get off it's arse and get a decent public and frieght transport on the railways set up so that it doesn't take me the best part of 2 hours to drive to work some mornings.
J.
JHL said:
so that it doesn't take me the best part of 2 hours to drive to work some mornings.
J.
Here is the root of the whole problem. You and I (and many other PHers) travel further and further on our daily commute.
The workforce no longer lives right next door to their place of work. I for example travel 80 miles round trip every time I go to work. Why? Because I want the money that is on offer in London, but there is absolutely no way I would want to live there. Given the unsocial hours that I work, public transport or car share is not an option.
As someone who has been travelling the A23 since the early eighties (joke there somewhere I think), I have seen the morning rush get earlier and earlier. There is now traffic from as early as 5.30am.
What is the answer? - I haven`t a clue. I could not find work within 5 miles of my house, let alone well paying wort. Even as recently as 50 years ago, the majority of people living in my village would have either worked on the land or in local businesses. Now most of the houses are owned by relatively wealthy people who leave for work at 6am and dont get home until after 7.
Excuse the ramblings, but there is a point buried amongst it somewhere.
Steve
Why are there governors fitted to trucks anyway? I mean, it's not really practical for them to go seriously, dangerously fast - even the new 650-horsepower American aero 18-wheelers can only do about 90-100 anyway.
Why aren't they capable of maintaining the speed limit, with a limited "blow by 'em" overtake function built in?
Why aren't they capable of maintaining the speed limit, with a limited "blow by 'em" overtake function built in?
Interesting reading all the comments, it’s fun but why are you all squabbling amongst yourselves? The problems are not just caused by lorry drivers and car drivers, successive governments have failed to engage intelligence but think speed cameras etc. are the answers to it all.
I used to drive 50,000 miles per year in my job in the UK and it’s a nightmare for everyone, especially on a Friday after 3.00 pm when everyone wants to go home at the same time to spend some time with their families. Some never make it.
I switched to commuting 250 miles each way to the smoke by train but after being stuck loads of times for hours in trains packed with 400 or 500 people because of floods, suicides, breakdowns, derailments, train crashes etc. etc. I realized that perhaps the UK is not quite as good as it used to be at getting people and goods around fast and safely.
Why are we looking at what the other countries do? Why are we trying to patch up a rail system that was built by the Great Victorians, one line north, one line south, one breakdown and the whole thing grinds to a halt. Why are we still playing around with motorway networks that were primarily built in the 70’s?
Come on government, forget the bureaucrats and the speed cameras, forget the patch and make do mentality. Engage some of our best whiz kids and engineers, let them power up their brains and starting thinking for Britain. Time for brand new ideas and the cash to develop new technologies and ideas to lead the rest of the world with. This problem will never go away, so stick your necks out and do something useful and stop the squabbling. Come on the rest of you and make them listen, we don’t want old, broken down patched up systems and networks, do we? Is there anyone called Winston in government?
I used to drive 50,000 miles per year in my job in the UK and it’s a nightmare for everyone, especially on a Friday after 3.00 pm when everyone wants to go home at the same time to spend some time with their families. Some never make it.
I switched to commuting 250 miles each way to the smoke by train but after being stuck loads of times for hours in trains packed with 400 or 500 people because of floods, suicides, breakdowns, derailments, train crashes etc. etc. I realized that perhaps the UK is not quite as good as it used to be at getting people and goods around fast and safely.
Why are we looking at what the other countries do? Why are we trying to patch up a rail system that was built by the Great Victorians, one line north, one line south, one breakdown and the whole thing grinds to a halt. Why are we still playing around with motorway networks that were primarily built in the 70’s?
Come on government, forget the bureaucrats and the speed cameras, forget the patch and make do mentality. Engage some of our best whiz kids and engineers, let them power up their brains and starting thinking for Britain. Time for brand new ideas and the cash to develop new technologies and ideas to lead the rest of the world with. This problem will never go away, so stick your necks out and do something useful and stop the squabbling. Come on the rest of you and make them listen, we don’t want old, broken down patched up systems and networks, do we? Is there anyone called Winston in government?
I drive a truck for a brewery, up and down motorways, dual carriageways and single lane roads every working day. I can see where this argument is leading, to have all trucks in single file wherever there is more than one lane. I don't blame people for wanting to see this as it annoys me sometimes, but as a driver myself, it will inconvenience me immensely, and all the trucks out there, as well as the hauliers, supermarkets, shops, companies etc.
We can only drive for 9 hours in a day, that has to be split by a 45 min break after 4.5 hours. you'd be surprised just how quickly driving time runs out at work. The working time directive is also going to make a huge difference to our driving and working time, and hauliers are probably going to have to employ more people to drive trucks. it all comes down to cost. And it will be passed on to the consumer through shop prices.
remember the fact that just about everything you own has made it's way to you at some point in a truck.
I hate to see trucks edging past each other at half a mile an hour's difference, and i hate doing it myself, but i wonder if cars had speed limiters, would we sit behind each other behaving ourselves and not trying to get past the car in front? i think not!
I would also put the point across that all motorways and dual carriageways were built as 'trunk' routes.
>> Edited by Sooty_1970 on Sunday 12th December 11:46
We can only drive for 9 hours in a day, that has to be split by a 45 min break after 4.5 hours. you'd be surprised just how quickly driving time runs out at work. The working time directive is also going to make a huge difference to our driving and working time, and hauliers are probably going to have to employ more people to drive trucks. it all comes down to cost. And it will be passed on to the consumer through shop prices.
remember the fact that just about everything you own has made it's way to you at some point in a truck.
I hate to see trucks edging past each other at half a mile an hour's difference, and i hate doing it myself, but i wonder if cars had speed limiters, would we sit behind each other behaving ourselves and not trying to get past the car in front? i think not!
I would also put the point across that all motorways and dual carriageways were built as 'trunk' routes.
>> Edited by Sooty_1970 on Sunday 12th December 11:46
zebedee said:
oh well done thrush - lets knock another nail into the overtaking coffin. FFS - overtaking be it on a motorway or an A road is a skill involving observation and timing. It is safe if done correctly. Just because numpties can't do it doesn't mean people like you should harp on about how it shouldn't happen at all. I am sick of people flashing their lights and sounding their horn after I have completed a perfectly safe overtaking manouevre.
to tell u the truth i am sick of this as well, i drive a fast hot hatch and i overtake in places where i know i can, other people might not think that bit of road is safe but when u drive a road everyday u know what that road is like,
but even wwhen passingt on long straights u still get people flashing and tootin there horns at u, it is very annoying
good new on this one all lorries should traval at the same speed or at lest the good one will. and the old nails will be forced out of it to the scrap yard. then we get on to the caravans,old grans, Sunday drivers,three wheelers,tractors,combines,large loads,
green drivers,fourwheel drive school buses,drivers with (baby on board)in the back window,and any car or var not capible of running at over 100 mph and the driver must have over 9 points to show they can drive fast.in face why not close the M1 on sundays to all but racers in fast car. charge entry to services as a start fee by the service roads. pay and play.
green drivers,fourwheel drive school buses,drivers with (baby on board)in the back window,and any car or var not capible of running at over 100 mph and the driver must have over 9 points to show they can drive fast.in face why not close the M1 on sundays to all but racers in fast car. charge entry to services as a start fee by the service roads. pay and play.
Next step - the speed limit is 70 on motorways and most of the traffic does that, so lets ban overtaking altogether. Lorries use inside lane in single file, cars use middle lane in single file, politicians and royalty use outside lane. You know it makes sense.
Thin end, thick wedge. No-one should be happy about this proposal. But then no-one should have voted Labia at the last election either, but they did.
Thin end, thick wedge. No-one should be happy about this proposal. But then no-one should have voted Labia at the last election either, but they did.
My solution- simple really
Remove all speed limiters from trucks as the speed limit for these goods vehicles is still 60mph on motorways. The vast majority of drivers do not want to travel in excess of 60mph on motorways (44 tons takes some stopping). Drivers would be able to accelerate to 62mph (100kph) and overtake without fuss.
Speed limiters are causing more congestion by causing bunching and accidents as drivers are adopting a "flat out" style of driving ie braking at the last minute etc.
I believe that car drivers have a part to play in this as well by giving way to a truck wishing to overtake instead of accelerating to close the gap. This may lead to a little bit of common understanding and less road rage
Remove all speed limiters from trucks as the speed limit for these goods vehicles is still 60mph on motorways. The vast majority of drivers do not want to travel in excess of 60mph on motorways (44 tons takes some stopping). Drivers would be able to accelerate to 62mph (100kph) and overtake without fuss.
Speed limiters are causing more congestion by causing bunching and accidents as drivers are adopting a "flat out" style of driving ie braking at the last minute etc.
I believe that car drivers have a part to play in this as well by giving way to a truck wishing to overtake instead of accelerating to close the gap. This may lead to a little bit of common understanding and less road rage
Just done 1000 miles, 7 countries, 3 days in a heavy. Much of it on roads with trucks restricted to inside lane only. If you are driving a high powered truck it really sucks, especially if you have a retarder fitted and can come down the hills a lot faster that those holding it back with the gearbox.
No thanks.
No thanks.
Could it not be as simple as "1-2 lanes = no truck overtaking...3 lanes or more = truck can overtake"?
Or perhaps having this ban in place on timed basis, ie between the hours of 7-9am and 4-6pm
Apologies haven't read all 4 pages of this, and when I first saw this story I was quite relieved at the possibility of a ban...whilst motorways were built for haulage, so were canals but they don't get used properly and times have changed. However we do live in a country where the human traffic cop is scarce so we must also live with un-skilled, scared, old, inept drivers in cars, van and lorries all driving too slow on motorways and holding up law abiding HGVs...compromise is the name of the game isn't it?
Or perhaps having this ban in place on timed basis, ie between the hours of 7-9am and 4-6pm
Apologies haven't read all 4 pages of this, and when I first saw this story I was quite relieved at the possibility of a ban...whilst motorways were built for haulage, so were canals but they don't get used properly and times have changed. However we do live in a country where the human traffic cop is scarce so we must also live with un-skilled, scared, old, inept drivers in cars, van and lorries all driving too slow on motorways and holding up law abiding HGVs...compromise is the name of the game isn't it?
I drive a LOT of business miles a year, so I'm well used to how traffic looks between 6 and 9am and equally 4-7pm or so.
Contrary to popular opinion, on the inside lane, traffic moves at a steady 55-56mph with spaces for a car between lorries. Next time you're fighting an outside lane that's bouncing from knots at 60mph to space at 80mph, try pulling over and following the inside lane for 15 minutes until the bunching has settled out to a steady 80. It's very refreshing, try it.
It's not really lorries doing slow overtakes that destroy the flow. It's:
* CLODs
* Holier-than-thous driving at 69.9999mph in the outside lane
* Slower outside lane traffic assuming the car behind can't possibly be approaching at 90+
* Conversely, cars approaching 65mph traffic at 90+ and braking late - which stops anyone in the middle lane from moving out smoothly
* General lack of anticipation and consideration
And then around junctions, merges, etc, failure to merge in turn and use all the space in all the lanes.
In fact come to think of it, all of the points above are at a basic level a failure to understand traffic merging.
A lot of autobahns have only two lanes - but they flow. This is because the Clios expect to be overtaken by the SLKs, and don't begrudge it.
I agree with one of the earlier posts - a lot of more recent motorway junctions seem to be designed to make it as complicated as possible to get where you are going. M56/A5103/M60 is just plain bloody dangerous, for instance, 50mph limit or not.
It's also interesting how long stretches of 40mph (Thirlwell for most of the decade so far, Staffordshire currently, M60 round airport) seem to lead to more consistent driving generally, and traffic possibly flows better on average.
Contrary to popular opinion, on the inside lane, traffic moves at a steady 55-56mph with spaces for a car between lorries. Next time you're fighting an outside lane that's bouncing from knots at 60mph to space at 80mph, try pulling over and following the inside lane for 15 minutes until the bunching has settled out to a steady 80. It's very refreshing, try it.
It's not really lorries doing slow overtakes that destroy the flow. It's:
* CLODs
* Holier-than-thous driving at 69.9999mph in the outside lane
* Slower outside lane traffic assuming the car behind can't possibly be approaching at 90+
* Conversely, cars approaching 65mph traffic at 90+ and braking late - which stops anyone in the middle lane from moving out smoothly
* General lack of anticipation and consideration
And then around junctions, merges, etc, failure to merge in turn and use all the space in all the lanes.
In fact come to think of it, all of the points above are at a basic level a failure to understand traffic merging.
A lot of autobahns have only two lanes - but they flow. This is because the Clios expect to be overtaken by the SLKs, and don't begrudge it.
I agree with one of the earlier posts - a lot of more recent motorway junctions seem to be designed to make it as complicated as possible to get where you are going. M56/A5103/M60 is just plain bloody dangerous, for instance, 50mph limit or not.
It's also interesting how long stretches of 40mph (Thirlwell for most of the decade so far, Staffordshire currently, M60 round airport) seem to lead to more consistent driving generally, and traffic possibly flows better on average.
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