RE: Marcos Engineering Appoints Administrator
Discussion
How sad, RIP Marcos. The new TSO looked a far better product than the more modern TVRs.
Impossible for such a small company to successfully compete nowadays, the market is resticted by safety and emissions laws and the threat of litigation which sadly make the sale of cars to Europe or America impossible. This effectively constrains the market to the UK only which isn't profitable.
The only successful small companies are those which overcome these difficulties, e.g. Morgan and Lotus.
Another sad day for the British sports car.
Impossible for such a small company to successfully compete nowadays, the market is resticted by safety and emissions laws and the threat of litigation which sadly make the sale of cars to Europe or America impossible. This effectively constrains the market to the UK only which isn't profitable.
The only successful small companies are those which overcome these difficulties, e.g. Morgan and Lotus.
Another sad day for the British sports car.
This really does suck. The UK was probably the last place on the planet where you could get a hand built, simple, kick arse car that didn't cost the queens jewels. I don't know about the Marcos, but I owned a TVR, and there is just something about driving this type of car that can not be duplicated in a Porsche, Merc, or even a Vette.
At least you have to give someone credit for trying !
At least you have to give someone credit for trying !
Podie said:
Horse_Apple said:
Hopefully, this is the final nail in a coffin which say the Griff and Chimp as the industry's last hurrah.
Hmm…. So explain why prices continue to drop in the second hand market. Seems to be an influx of decent(ish) cars out there going for (quite frankly) peanuts.What are people buying..?
Don't think you get what I was meaning.
I meant that the launch of the Griff and Chimp was basically the pinnacle of this type of home built, home sold car business. That was back in the 90s. That was the last hoorah and the industry has been in strong decline ever since.
As for an explanation as to why the prices of second hand cars falls, it is a natural phenomina that allows a product to find the real value at which the demand appears.
Essentially, it shows even more strongly as supply must be greater than demand and so there really can't be too much moeny washing around for this type of product.
Horse_Apple said:
Podie said:
Horse_Apple said:
Hopefully, this is the final nail in a coffin which say the Griff and Chimp as the industry's last hurrah.
Hmm…. So explain why prices continue to drop in the second hand market. Seems to be an influx of decent(ish) cars out there going for (quite frankly) peanuts.What are people buying..?
Don't think you get what I was meaning.
I meant that the launch of the Griff and Chimp was basically the pinnacle of this type of home built, home sold car business. That was back in the 90s. That was the last hoorah and the industry has been in strong decline ever since.
As for an explanation as to why the prices of second hand cars falls, it is a natural phenomina that allows a product to find the real value at which the demand appears.
Essentially, it shows even more strongly as supply must be greater than demand and so there really can't be too much moeny washing around for this type of product.
My comment regarding S/H values was that they appear to be in freefall at the moment. Good, solid cars that were trading for £15+ are now closer to the £10k mark.
Friend of mine picked up a 4.3 needing some minor fettling for peanuts, absolute peanuts.
Another sad day
I guess that leaves Ginetta as one of the few sports car makers in the UK. I hope the road going version of their G50 is a success. We need home made light weight powerful sports cars, a product we seem to be good at designing but trrible and making and selling profitably.
I guess that leaves Ginetta as one of the few sports car makers in the UK. I hope the road going version of their G50 is a success. We need home made light weight powerful sports cars, a product we seem to be good at designing but trrible and making and selling profitably.
Podie said:
Friend of mine picked up a 4.3 needing some minor fettling for peanuts, absolute peanuts.
What exactly constitutes 'peanuts' for a car that's at least 13 years old? I shopped at the lower end of the market last year - but what I paid was still 10x the amount I'd have paid for a tintop of similar value when new, of the same age... Given that I've yet to see one which I'd describe as 'mint/not needing anything' I'd say it's been unrealistic of folks to expect these would always continue to fetch ~£10K at least (that's a whopping 40% of list price when new BTW). As with all older and somewhat desirable cars, we're quickly heading for a situation where condition is reflected in the price, and being a 'later/newer' car doesn't add a premium anymore simply becasue all of them are old cars by now and conversely, the price level at which one can buy clean(ish), useable examples won't drop much if at all anymore. Prices of cars with problems/work needed will fall through the floor no doubt - it's not like labour rates or parts prices will drop within the next years...
Edited by 900T-R on Thursday 11th October 12:32
Podie said:
Hmm…. So explain why prices continue to drop in the second hand market. Seems to be an influx of decent(ish) cars out there going for (quite frankly) peanuts.
What are people buying..?
MX-5s... and I so want a Griff too, but I can't part with what is a cheap, ultra reliable, fun car for something that's potentially gonna be hard work and massively expensive to run. Running costs are what's hurting these cars. They're dirt cheap to buy as a result. Newer ones pay for it in massive depreciation, again scaring away buyers to safer German brands. It's a shame.What are people buying..?
juansolo said:
and massively expensive to run. Running costs are what's hurting these cars. They're dirt cheap to buy as a result.
Not sure about that... got a stack of paperwork with mine.... basically all the receipts of the past 5-6 years prior to my ownership the vast majority being from main dealers (Brundle, The TVR Centre, TMS), and although it looked like there was always something the car needed, I had a good chuckle at the prices in the invoices... stuff like brake pads and discs, recon steering racks, alternators and starters... all these cost quite literally peanuts compared to what I'm used to with the Saab, let alone a Porker or prancing donkey of the era...Some more very sad news for sports car fans.
I think the inevitable conclusion is that the market for highly specialised hand-built sports cars is contracting. Taxation, speedcameras, petrol costs etc etc are just taking too much of the fun out of ownership.
If you live in the South East as I do, the chances of you getting your growling, snorting V8 road eater up to above about 40mph without losing your licence are slim and few and far between.
The conclusion I am forced to reach is that the future for mid-price specialist sports cars is quite bleak.
I think any new manufacturers need to aim to produce interesting, reliable, fun little sports cars that focus on looks and handling rather than power, and to sell them for less than 20k.
And people will buy them - just consider the MX5 et al.
I think the inevitable conclusion is that the market for highly specialised hand-built sports cars is contracting. Taxation, speedcameras, petrol costs etc etc are just taking too much of the fun out of ownership.
If you live in the South East as I do, the chances of you getting your growling, snorting V8 road eater up to above about 40mph without losing your licence are slim and few and far between.
The conclusion I am forced to reach is that the future for mid-price specialist sports cars is quite bleak.
I think any new manufacturers need to aim to produce interesting, reliable, fun little sports cars that focus on looks and handling rather than power, and to sell them for less than 20k.
And people will buy them - just consider the MX5 et al.
juansolo said:
I suppose I'm more on about the cheaper end of the spectrum where these once unattainable cars are available to the more cash strapped enthusiast, who'd love one, but are scared off by things like the Readers Cars section of this site...
Erm, I am on the cheaper end of the spectrum...Gassing Station | Motoring News | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff