RE: Merkel blocks autobahn speed limit

[Marki]

MK4 Slowride said:

[I was under the impression that he built the Autobahn's for obvious transport reasons but also to give the population a job to do as the country was still in recesion from WW1.

I belive a lot of slave workers were used

[The Curn]

[/quote] Actually I find the 60 SC NSL far more bearable than than the 70 limit on the motorway. Never understood why you're only allowed 10mph more given the superior quality of a motorway.
[/quote]

The 60mph NSL on SC would be a lot more bearable if people actually drove at 60. I really think that half the motoring public think that single carriageways NSL is 50mph.

The A4074 between Reading & Oxford moves at anything between 36 & 48mph for no reason other than some b*stard (normally in a underpowered 1.2 hatchback) 14 cars ahead travelling at that speed.

Any attempt at overtaking is met with rage and furious anger by the herd of little people following them all sat about 3 inches from the car in front.

As much as I would love derestricted roads in this country it will never work when the level of skill is so low and the general attitude of "you're not coming past me" is so prolific.

We urgently need harder driving tests including motorway driving and a national change in attitude.

(Slightly off the point there, but I needed to get it off my chest after this mornings catastrophe of a commute)

Back on subject; Good on her...

[oagent]

Makes you wonder why we bothered fighting the war doesnt it. We get the draconian laws regarding civil liberty, traffic etc, the Germans seem to have got a far better balance.
Mind you. I guess having limit free roads in this country would be utter carnage. Theres far too much traffic and far too many idiots for it to be safe over here.

[Marki]

oagent said:

Mind you. I guess having limit free roads in this country would be utter carnage. Theres far too much traffic and far too many idiots for it to be safe over here.

I guess it just what you are brought up with Germans are generally good drivers

[derestrictor]

oagent said:

Mind you. I guess having limit free roads in this country would be utter carnage. Theres far too much traffic and far too many idiots for it to be safe over here.

That's it, optimism uber alles.

[beasto]

Compare with our own spineless politicians and rampant bureaucrats, dressing madness in eco-safety clothes.

Right now, they're insidiously - and with no apparent discussion - converting Oxfordshire into a 50 mph zone, for no reason that I can see.

And part and parcel of the exercise is the uglification of our county with a mass of often dangerously-sited signs, stripes and other hideous and unnecessary road furniture.

Where in f***'s name do they get the budget for this insanity ?

[corozin]

hahithestevieboy said:

Here here!!

German autobarns are (if I recall correctly) mostly made of concrete which is much more hardwearing and longlasting than tarmac/bitumen roads requireing less maintanence (even if like on a runway you then cover them in tarmac). Then, when they do break the germans (at night) throw men and machinery at them in order to get the problem solved in a couple of hours minimising disruption.

What you say is true, but compared with properly chipped tarmac road surfaces, the minimum braking distances available on concrete are something like 15% greater in the dry and more like 35% in the wet.

It might be cheap, but I'd personally rather have safer roads rather than cheaper ones. We pay more than enough for them to justify the expense I think...

[The Curn]

beasto said:

Compare with our own spineless politicians and rampant bureaucrats, dressing madness in eco-safety clothes.

Right now, they're insidiously - and with no apparent discussion - converting Oxfordshire into a 50 mph zone, for no reason that I can see.

And part and parcel of the exercise is the uglification of our county with a mass of often dangerously-sited signs, stripes and other hideous and unnecessary road furniture.

Where in f***'s name do they get the budget for this insanity ?

Hear, hear...

[alphadog]

derestrictor said:

oagent said:

Mind you. I guess having limit free roads in this country would be utter carnage. Theres far too much traffic and far too many idiots for it to be safe over here.

That's it, optimism uber alles.

Mind you, our motorways are the safest roads in the world and given the right conditions traffic merrily and safely moves at speeds of up to 90 or 100.

[rusti]

PhantomPH said:

I recently saw a documentary about the Autobahns and how they were efficiently managed and maintained. How any incident resulted in immediate closure od a lane and a temporary speed limit being enforced. All seemed like a lot of common sense was being used.

It also strikes me that just because people can go a million mph if they want to, not very many do. Would I be right in guessing that cruising speeds are between 80-90mph for the majority of traffic on the un-restricted sections?

The majority of drivers do have common sense. I would not horse everywhere at 130mph because I could - I would just not be so bloody nervous of getting nicked when I travelled at 85/90mph like I usually do.

P~

Well, I don´t want to spoil the party and destroy your picture of German efficiency regarding Autobahn maintenance but the situation if often a real pain with construction sites on the main autobahns for months. Lets do some math. Only 2% of German roads are autobahns and more than 50% of those have already a speed limit. If you factor in the construction site mess with speed limits and all the vehicles that are limited anyway (lorries, etc.) we´re just talking political bullshit here. Hope common sense prevails.

[dcb]

rusti said:

more than 50% of those have already a speed limit.

Reference ?

My experience is that about 10% of the network
has a speed limit.

I've seen most or all the autobahns in Bavaria,
Baden Wuertemburg, Hesse, Rheinland-Pfalz, NRW, Sachsen,
Thuringia - basically anywhere south of
a line from Dusseldorf to Kassel to Erfurt to Dresden.

Don't mix up autobahns which have a fixed limit
permanantly applied [ eg the A61 Dutch caravanners'
route ] to those which have overhead gantries
and have the *possibility* of a limit applied if
traffic gets a bit heavy.

[Stealth997]

I've never driven in Germany. Where's the "nearest" autobahn to the UK? I want to get into my car this weekend and go and drive like a German.

[dcb]

Stealth997 said:

I've never driven in Germany. Where's the "nearest" autobahn to the UK?

Aachen to Koln. Three hours east of Calais.

I find it tricky over 120 mph.

Stealth997 said:

I want to get into my car this weekend and go and drive like a German.

You might own a fast car, but have you got the
skills to match ?

If you are anything like the average UK driver,
you will need a *big* skills upgrade to cope
with the autobahn.

Even if you aren't Vmaxing it, folks around you
will be. You need to be able to cope.

I recommend keeping it below 120 mph or so for
a couple of years until you get the hang of it.

The first time you learned to swim, did you
try to swim the Channel ?

[DPX]

From :-
"Makes you wonder why we bothered fighting the war doesnt it. We get the draconian laws regarding civil liberty, traffic etc, the Germans seem to have got a far better balance."

Another little gem is that they seem to have a train service that works and have some nice rolling stock. Would love to see one of those ICE class 403 trains blowing a SWT class 158 from the track .

And just as a final insult anyone with a UK season ticket should take a look for a BahnCard-100 on the web and see what 3300 euros a year gets you.

[jamoor]

cowellsj said:

Mr_C said:

I've noticed on the 'bahns that most people do drive at 80 ish, their lane discipline is usually spot on, they move over for faster cars and if you do want to drive faster they let you get on with it.

Over here people would much rather have an accident than let someone pass them safely.

Brilliant! Had me in tears anyway.

More to the point, driving on an autobahn makes you look ahead, NOT at the speedo, which is what's important at the end of the day.

Also most people will be too tight to pay for the fuel to drive at 120mph everywhere.

[jamoor]

Mr_C said:

Is there any truth in the fact that Adolf built the autobahn's to move his troops as quickly as possible, hence there being no speed limit?

apparently it was to kill off all the people who couldnt drive properly.

[LewisR]

Don't think for a minute that they all drive at about 80-90mph on the limitless sections of Autobahn. I drove a Pug 306 diesel at about 90mph and it was regularly being overtaken, at some speed, by Passat, Audi, BM & Merc estates flying along. On two occasions I drove to Germany in my Elise. I thought that would fare better. Nope. At 110mph the Elise was all over the place, the engine was screaming its nut off and I was being bounced about like I was on a roller coaster and yet the Passat diesel estates still flew past me like I was going backwards and there were BM & Mercs overtaking THEM. What a top country.

Oh yes, Ich kann viel Deutsch sprechen und ich hoffe, dass mein folgender Beruf in Deutschland ist!

[dcb]

LewisR said:

Oh yes, Ich kann viel Deutsch sprechen und ich hoffe, dass mein folgender Beruf in Deutschland ist!

I can much German speak and I hope, that my following profession in
Germany is.

It's all very well being able to speak High German, but there
are many accents over there.

Swiss German is almost impossible, Bavarian's a lot different,
and Austrian's different again.

Being able to speak some lingo from 500 miles away is all
very well, but you need to be able to speak the
local lingo as well.

And even *after* you've understood the lingo, you need
to understand the culture behind it that drives it
all.

Nanny State Britain is a lot different to
"You must think for Yourself" Germany.

And as far as the ruinous fuel consumption
at high speed is concerned, that's just another
fallacy.

In my experience, 2 mpg is well worth it
- 450 miles in four hours anyone ?

[jamoor]

LewisR said:

Don't think for a minute that they all drive at about 80-90mph on the limitless sections of Autobahn. I drove a Pug 306 diesel at about 90mph and it was regularly being overtaken, at some speed, by Passat, Audi, BM & Merc estates flying along. On two occasions I drove to Germany in my Elise. I thought that would fare better. Nope. At 110mph the Elise was all over the place, the engine was screaming its nut off and I was being bounced about like I was on a roller coaster and yet the Passat diesel estates still flew past me like I was going backwards and there were BM & Mercs overtaking THEM. What a top country.

Oh yes, Ich kann viel Deutsch sprechen und ich hoffe, dass mein folgender Beruf in Deutschland ist!

lol elise on an autobahn, but yes, you really do need a large saloon to drive fast over long distances, that's why I love my e39
can't beat it for that guess what speed I'm doing factor.

Managed to do around 200km at an average of 115mph, seems to max out at 140 though and requires a good bit of tarmac to get there, 125 can be got very easily.

330d sport is faster by a long way, can get that to 140 with ease, however just doesn't feel safe

[CommanderJameson]

cowellsj said:

Mr_C said:

I've noticed on the 'bahns that most people do drive at 80 ish, their lane discipline is usually spot on, they move over for faster cars and if you do want to drive faster they let you get on with it.

Over here people would much rather have an accident than let someone pass them safely.

Which is remarkable, given that motorway accident rates are greater in Germany than they are here.

Autobahns are fab, and I want them here, but I'm under no illusions that they're safer overall.