How about something NEW
Discussion
Well people, we've seen them come and seen them go. But how about something new on the Automotive scene?
All we are getting is the same thing in a re-shaped box. What am I talking about? Well Automotive Performance in general. Lets take suspension. Every Honda Prelude from about '86 onwards has the same suspension as most so-called kit cars and production cars - A Arms. There are not that many different ways you can set them up - they all do the same job. For instance if you have an Ultima, you havent got technology, you just have a remodelled Honda etc suspension. Even braking systems these days are old hat. The word 'performance car' comes down to what ?? Most so called high end sports vehicles and a hell of a lot of production cars will do 250km easy and even 300 isnt too far out for some. There is nothing new out there .... still people trying to make a buck out of yet another 7 replica or mainstream manufacturer pulling the wool over your eyes with facts and figures which dont amount to much more than a paint job on last years model.
I think automotive performance has reached a plateau. Remember the 50's, 60's and 70's when manufactureres more or less had a free hand in evolving the car??
Its just not happening now. How about the automotive dreamers amongst you come up with a different suspension design, or braking system or driveline. Lotus's Active Suspension design is like what Im talking about.
How would you now define "performance"?? 100mph 40 years ago was a milestone and yet it is taking 4 times as long to get only serious machinery to 200?
Your views and comments please!
All we are getting is the same thing in a re-shaped box. What am I talking about? Well Automotive Performance in general. Lets take suspension. Every Honda Prelude from about '86 onwards has the same suspension as most so-called kit cars and production cars - A Arms. There are not that many different ways you can set them up - they all do the same job. For instance if you have an Ultima, you havent got technology, you just have a remodelled Honda etc suspension. Even braking systems these days are old hat. The word 'performance car' comes down to what ?? Most so called high end sports vehicles and a hell of a lot of production cars will do 250km easy and even 300 isnt too far out for some. There is nothing new out there .... still people trying to make a buck out of yet another 7 replica or mainstream manufacturer pulling the wool over your eyes with facts and figures which dont amount to much more than a paint job on last years model.
I think automotive performance has reached a plateau. Remember the 50's, 60's and 70's when manufactureres more or less had a free hand in evolving the car??
Its just not happening now. How about the automotive dreamers amongst you come up with a different suspension design, or braking system or driveline. Lotus's Active Suspension design is like what Im talking about.
How would you now define "performance"?? 100mph 40 years ago was a milestone and yet it is taking 4 times as long to get only serious machinery to 200?
Your views and comments please!
Maybe I'm lacking imagination, but I'd actually rather things stopped progressing, at least down the road they seem to be currently.
Progress, at least in the eyes of the likes of Mercedes, would appear to mean cars steering, braking, clearing up after themselves. This, in my opinion, is rather bad news.
I use my car purely for transportation. That's the transportation of my soul to new, giddy heights as I break the law and worry those who don't share my own confidence in my and my car's abilities.
I'm convinced we've reached a watershed, a peak beyond which our fun will gradually diminish, to be replaced by more secure, vicarious pleasures.
I can't see that the quest for 300mph is worthwhile, or realistic, and I think we'll be yearning for Honda wishbones when the 'active' suspension combines with active steering and active internet access to mean that we as drivers, are fundamentally inactive.
Progress, at least in the eyes of the likes of Mercedes, would appear to mean cars steering, braking, clearing up after themselves. This, in my opinion, is rather bad news.
I use my car purely for transportation. That's the transportation of my soul to new, giddy heights as I break the law and worry those who don't share my own confidence in my and my car's abilities.
I'm convinced we've reached a watershed, a peak beyond which our fun will gradually diminish, to be replaced by more secure, vicarious pleasures.
I can't see that the quest for 300mph is worthwhile, or realistic, and I think we'll be yearning for Honda wishbones when the 'active' suspension combines with active steering and active internet access to mean that we as drivers, are fundamentally inactive.
Certain developments in supercars, like the Porsche GT2 and Calloway vettes, will eventually trickle down to mainstream models. Stuff like ceramic brakes that vastly increase performance and last 100k miles. More cars will use carbon fibre shellls too, for better economy and performance.
What worries me is when oil, therefore petrol, runs out in a predicted (unanamously by top science journos) 20ish years. We had better get the performance of those leccy cars sorted out sharpish, or we'll be facing a new era of poor performance cars.
What worries me is when oil, therefore petrol, runs out in a predicted (unanamously by top science journos) 20ish years. We had better get the performance of those leccy cars sorted out sharpish, or we'll be facing a new era of poor performance cars.
I agree, Lawrence, that's why I but TVR's!
Safety at all costs is the problem, and manufacturers have realised that the best way of selling cars, at least at the moment, is to add lashings of active driver aids, to compensate for the average Joe's complete inability to drive properly. No woder Merc are developing a visual sensing system, which can see human and car shapes, and take action to avoid accidents - it seems that there are a lot of drivers out there who can't be bothered with observation and think their car will do it all for them.
Safety at all costs is the problem, and manufacturers have realised that the best way of selling cars, at least at the moment, is to add lashings of active driver aids, to compensate for the average Joe's complete inability to drive properly. No woder Merc are developing a visual sensing system, which can see human and car shapes, and take action to avoid accidents - it seems that there are a lot of drivers out there who can't be bothered with observation and think their car will do it all for them.
quote:
What worries me is when oil, therefore petrol, runs out in a predicted (unanamously by top science journos) 20ish years. We had better get the performance of those leccy cars sorted out sharpish, or we'll be facing a new era of poor performance cars.
I read that demand was projected to exceed supply at around 2020. This isn't quite the same as running out?
Oil supplies have been supposedly about to run out for as long as I can remember.
Estimates of oil supply tend to be based on what is economic to extract. As technology improves, more and more deposits become economical to extract. If prices start to rise, it also becomes economical to extract from locations which may not have previously been feasible.
Estimates of oil supply tend to be based on what is economic to extract. As technology improves, more and more deposits become economical to extract. If prices start to rise, it also becomes economical to extract from locations which may not have previously been feasible.
about 11 hours a day!
quote:
The latest theory seems to be that we have sufficient oil reserves for between 40 and 50 years, and that we will have no need of it by then because other forms of energy will be far more efficient.
Oh good. This means I can selfishly burn hydrocarbons with a big engine, die at my appointed time, and let some one elses bastard kids pick up the tab. Excellent! At last I get to see my point in life. As long as petrol is available, I will use it. Cool. Sorry if this is an anti-social view, but I need it like a junkie needs dope.
Admit it, you lot do too.
C
Lawrence - interesting post! Agree that most car design is stagnating (just check out new vectra..Ug!!) but there are still lots of diverse project out there that will make the future for petrol heads very interesting.
Just look at what was on show at genveva: supercars from vw, bugatti, cadillac.. and some fantastic concept cars - e.g. ItalDesign Brera
I think that the car industry is much more radical than it was say 12 years ago - before MX5 no-one thought there was any point in doing 'niche' cars. Maxda proved everyone wrong and without that you probably wouldn't have got boxster, mgf, barchetta, z3 etc. The emergence of these also gave so many people their first taste of sportscars, that it was actually good news for the likes of tvr and lotus etc (imo) as people who'd had a taste of open top motoring decided to go and get something that also performed!
Car makers now realise that these niche cars add 'kudos' to the brand, and also help them sell their mainstream tat.
The future is bright i believe, and you only have to look at cars like the AUTOnomy concept to see how radical even the conservative General Motors can be..
Ital Design Alfa Romeo Brera:
www.cardesignnews.com/autoshows/2002/geneva/highlights/index.html
GM Autonomy:
www.edmunds.com/news/conceptcarspotlight/articles/48581/article.html
www.michelinchallengedesign.com/1_16_gmautonomy.htm
http://gm.com/company/gmability/environment/products/adv_tech/autonomy1_010702.html
Just look at what was on show at genveva: supercars from vw, bugatti, cadillac.. and some fantastic concept cars - e.g. ItalDesign Brera
I think that the car industry is much more radical than it was say 12 years ago - before MX5 no-one thought there was any point in doing 'niche' cars. Maxda proved everyone wrong and without that you probably wouldn't have got boxster, mgf, barchetta, z3 etc. The emergence of these also gave so many people their first taste of sportscars, that it was actually good news for the likes of tvr and lotus etc (imo) as people who'd had a taste of open top motoring decided to go and get something that also performed!
Car makers now realise that these niche cars add 'kudos' to the brand, and also help them sell their mainstream tat.
The future is bright i believe, and you only have to look at cars like the AUTOnomy concept to see how radical even the conservative General Motors can be..
Ital Design Alfa Romeo Brera:
www.cardesignnews.com/autoshows/2002/geneva/highlights/index.html
GM Autonomy:
www.edmunds.com/news/conceptcarspotlight/articles/48581/article.html
www.michelinchallengedesign.com/1_16_gmautonomy.htm
http://gm.com/company/gmability/environment/products/adv_tech/autonomy1_010702.html
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