Engine crane boom length
Discussion
A quick question for those of you who have removed an AJP8 from a Cerb...
I need an engine crane and I'm looking to buy one for delivery to the sunny midlands, however I'm not sure of the boom length required.
I've heard that the balance point with the gearbox attached is 2/3rds of the way back along the engine. Going from further back and measuring from the bulkhead to the front of the nose whilst trying to be as square as possible, it looked to be roughly 1450mm.
I see plenty of cranes for not a great deal of money which seem to be 1447mm to 1600mm, but I'd like to know what everyone else has used to do this because as the fulcrum tips forwards, some of this boom length will disappear in relation to the front of our cars once it is jacked up.
At the moment it's on the top of the axle stands, but I imagine it will need to come down a peg for the engine to lift nicely over the front because of how high the crane would need to go to accommodate balancer + engine.
Alternatively, if any of you kind people have a crane that would pack up in to the folded-flat rear of a battered old Forester, I'd be grateful to rent it from you.
Thanks all.
I need an engine crane and I'm looking to buy one for delivery to the sunny midlands, however I'm not sure of the boom length required.
I've heard that the balance point with the gearbox attached is 2/3rds of the way back along the engine. Going from further back and measuring from the bulkhead to the front of the nose whilst trying to be as square as possible, it looked to be roughly 1450mm.
I see plenty of cranes for not a great deal of money which seem to be 1447mm to 1600mm, but I'd like to know what everyone else has used to do this because as the fulcrum tips forwards, some of this boom length will disappear in relation to the front of our cars once it is jacked up.
At the moment it's on the top of the axle stands, but I imagine it will need to come down a peg for the engine to lift nicely over the front because of how high the crane would need to go to accommodate balancer + engine.
Alternatively, if any of you kind people have a crane that would pack up in to the folded-flat rear of a battered old Forester, I'd be grateful to rent it from you.
Thanks all.
DISCLAIMER: DON'T TRY THIS AT HOME, FOLKS!
I wouldn't recommend this, but...
I just made a longer jib for my 'standard reach' crane
I was b
d if I was going to fork out for a 'long reach' crane (£300?) for just one application when I have a perfectly good crane already.I've never liked the idea of lifting engine and box out together, such is the angle required, and the clearance needed under the car too, which increases the height of required lift. But I removed my gearbox and bell-housing to also reduce the weight of the lift and to move the C of G in my favour. I reckoned that, if it would happily take the weight without tipping whilst the jib was horizontal, then matters would only improve as the load was raised (because, as you say, this works to progressively reduce the over-reach).
Looks all wrong I know, but it worked. Have to say that a load balancing device is an invaluable aid.
So, it's probably best you don't borrow nor replicate my highly dubious set-up, Mr NR!
If you are going to buy a crane, be aware that the quoted jib length may be from the pivot to the hook, but what is important is the horizontal distance between the ram (which will be kissing your number plate) and the hook. You will need this to be 1.15m if you lift just the engine as I did. I'd suggest that it needs to be 1.35m if you want to lift with 'box attached
At first that looks brave, but knowing that the engine only weighs a third of what the maximum load would be at full extension ordinarily, I can see how that would be fine.
Finding the right crane seems to be the most difficult part of removing the engine, everything else has been relatively pain free.
Thanks for the estimate, it works with what I supposed I'd need. I might even have to lift with the crank pulley on as well, which increases my angle, therefore height required for the lift, just because I can't get it off.
.... Complicates crane.
Finding the right crane seems to be the most difficult part of removing the engine, everything else has been relatively pain free.
Thanks for the estimate, it works with what I supposed I'd need. I might even have to lift with the crank pulley on as well, which increases my angle, therefore height required for the lift, just because I can't get it off.
.... Complicates crane.
steveo3002 said:
what did you pay for the extended boom ? wouldnt mind something like that
Home made I would think.When I removed my chim engine with box on, I lifted from the side of the car then rolled the car back.
Put it in this way as well.
You can alter the tilt of the lump that you are inserting by using a ratchet strap around the front of the engine to the hook.
A little ratcheting changes the angle easily.
Just placed an order for a Sealey SC1000LR 1 tonne Long Reach Extendable Legs Crane for £200 as I had no crane at all to modify either.
Supposed length as confirmed by Clarke over the phone from the top pivot to the hook is 1500mm with the ram perpendicular to the floor. The lower pivot to hook therefore should be the same.
I don't feel mortified by the price as it's reasonably cheap for what it is, but it's still on the verge of
grumble territory. I'm tight, but I own a TVR.... 
I'll let you all know how I get on.
Supposed length as confirmed by Clarke over the phone from the top pivot to the hook is 1500mm with the ram perpendicular to the floor. The lower pivot to hook therefore should be the same.
I don't feel mortified by the price as it's reasonably cheap for what it is, but it's still on the verge of
grumble territory. I'm tight, but I own a TVR.... I'll let you all know how I get on.
NuddyRap said:
At first that looks brave, but knowing that the engine only weighs a third of what the maximum load would be at full extension ordinarily, I can see how that would be fine.
Finding the right crane seems to be the most difficult part of removing the engine, everything else has been relatively pain free.
Thanks for the estimate, it works with what I supposed I'd need. I might even have to lift with the crank pulley on as well, which increases my angle, therefore height required for the lift, just because I can't get it off.
.... Complicates crane.
Everyone says how compact and light they are; I've not manhandled the bare block yet as it's still on my engine stand, but it is relatively tiny, full credit to A, J and P. Finding the right crane seems to be the most difficult part of removing the engine, everything else has been relatively pain free.
Thanks for the estimate, it works with what I supposed I'd need. I might even have to lift with the crank pulley on as well, which increases my angle, therefore height required for the lift, just because I can't get it off.
.... Complicates crane.
Beauty is, that without a 'box on, it lifts almost straight up. I didn't even attempt to remove my front pulley.
NuddyRap said:
... Sealey SC1000LR 1 tonne Long Reach Extendable Legs Crane for £200...
...boom length as confirmed by Clarke over the phone from the top pivot to the hook is 1500mm with the ram perpendicular to the floor...
I can gladly confirm that this crane was perfect for the job. I put it at maximum extension and there was a very comfortable amount of clearance to the front of the car. 100mm easily....boom length as confirmed by Clarke over the phone from the top pivot to the hook is 1500mm with the ram perpendicular to the floor...
It also lifted well above the required height with the car sat on the top height of 4 bog standard axle stands.
As an open invitation if any Cerb owners passing the midlands want to use my crane drop me a PM.
I did fetch the engine and box out together, then separated them afterwards.
I've honestly done worse brake jobs on cars than fetching the engine out of this thing. I'd never done it before, but it still only took three quite pleasant afternoons and a morning, including several hours cleaning up sand that I foolishly scattered beneath some tarp on a patterned driveway to soak up the various fluids that might leak through.
It is just a one man job, but if you can get a second pair of hands do, as you'll get it done faster.
I'll post up a pictoral guide job when I get time so as others can see exactly what is involved.
I advise trying to remove the front pulley because it is very tight for clearance with it on. I could just about see daylight between the front pulley bolt and chassis. At one point, the whole front of the car was lifted up off the stands when this pulley bolt caught the chassis rail.
An engine load leveller is nice to have because the balance point is 2/3 of the way back along the engine and the attitude needs to be changed as you lift it. At first lift dead vertically, then tilt the gearbox end down once the front pulley bolt is clear of the chassis. then lift vertically again, walk backwards and reduce the angle as it clears the chassis.
I've honestly done worse brake jobs on cars than fetching the engine out of this thing. I'd never done it before, but it still only took three quite pleasant afternoons and a morning, including several hours cleaning up sand that I foolishly scattered beneath some tarp on a patterned driveway to soak up the various fluids that might leak through.
It is just a one man job, but if you can get a second pair of hands do, as you'll get it done faster.
I'll post up a pictoral guide job when I get time so as others can see exactly what is involved.
I advise trying to remove the front pulley because it is very tight for clearance with it on. I could just about see daylight between the front pulley bolt and chassis. At one point, the whole front of the car was lifted up off the stands when this pulley bolt caught the chassis rail.
An engine load leveller is nice to have because the balance point is 2/3 of the way back along the engine and the attitude needs to be changed as you lift it. At first lift dead vertically, then tilt the gearbox end down once the front pulley bolt is clear of the chassis. then lift vertically again, walk backwards and reduce the angle as it clears the chassis.
And having recently lifted mine out solo, I am in favour or separating it from the 'box beforehand. There was no need to remove the pulley and a it was a really easy almost vertical extraction without the extra length and weight of a 'box hanging off the back which not only has to be allowed for in terms of space beneath the car but then has to be lifted up and over the front of the car too.
Each to their own.
Each to their own.
I had my car on the top of some axle stands imagining I'd need bags of room beneath. In reality I could probably have done it on the bottom of these axle stands as the first part, lifting vertically, means that the tail end of the gearbox doesn't actually drop as low as you'd expect.
By the time the engine and gearbox have moved towards the front of the car, you'll have levelled the whole assembly anyway and clearance over the front is not an issue.
If I were to do it again I would consider taking the gearbox off first to make extra room, providing I could safely support the weight as I removed it (No gearbox stand) solely to prevent the heart stopping moment when my engine crane was just lifting the whole front of the car by the AC pulley bolt.
I'd say it's by no means essential to remove the gearbox, but it certainly becomes safer by doing so as you're not risking the pulley bolt catching your chassis.
By the time the engine and gearbox have moved towards the front of the car, you'll have levelled the whole assembly anyway and clearance over the front is not an issue.
If I were to do it again I would consider taking the gearbox off first to make extra room, providing I could safely support the weight as I removed it (No gearbox stand) solely to prevent the heart stopping moment when my engine crane was just lifting the whole front of the car by the AC pulley bolt.
I'd say it's by no means essential to remove the gearbox, but it certainly becomes safer by doing so as you're not risking the pulley bolt catching your chassis.
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