599 GTO

[Camlet]

FWIW, I bought a 599 GTB new in 07, a 599 GTO new in 2011, and sold the GTB last year. The two cars are obviously similar in appearance but very different in execution.

The GTB is one of the greatest GTs ever made. An incredible range of capabilities, from lazy high speed cruising to genuine supercar acceleration (0-100mph in 7.5) with decent handling for a big car. It's able to be Jekyll and Hyde. Mine was in Silverstone and was beautiful too. IMO what an Aston should have always been but never could.

The 599 GTO on the other hand is simply all Hyde. Massively sharper, harder, louder, meaner. I also noticed when they were back to back many items in the GTO were different. It's epic.

[Camlet]

......also, why would Tom Hartley post his new RHD 599 GTO at £695K and then almost immediately change it to POA? I'm not buying for obvious reasons but curious why.

[Anjum]

Believe it sold last weekend.....

[Camlet]

Anjum said:

Believe it sold last weekend.....

That's quick. Thanks.

[_Superleggera_]

Camlet said:

......also, why would Tom Hartley post his new RHD 599 GTO at £695K and then almost immediately change it to POA? I'm not buying for obvious reasons but curious why.

Because they get more enquiries with POA's. Then you have another contact on the books for a potential future sale.

[Camlet]

_Superleggera_ said:

Camlet said:

......also, why would Tom Hartley post his new RHD 599 GTO at £695K and then almost immediately change it to POA? I'm not buying for obvious reasons but curious why.

Because they get more enquiries with POA's. Then you have another contact on the books for a potential future sale.

Yeah, I get that but why post a number and then change it to POA? Feels mucky. Perhaps they have a summer intern who was a little too keen

[FalconWood]

Camlet said:

_Superleggera_ said:

Camlet said:

......also, why would Tom Hartley post his new RHD 599 GTO at £695K and then almost immediately change it to POA? I'm not buying for obvious reasons but curious why.

Because they get more enquiries with POA's. Then you have another contact on the books for a potential future sale.

Yeah, I get that but why post a number and then change it to POA? Feels mucky. Perhaps they have a summer intern who was a little too keen

Because he had it on at £695k for a few weeks when last week out of the blue two more came on the market, in red, a RHD and a LHD, similar miles at a staggering £795k each and he therefore wanted to move his understated price. That's what happens in a fast moving rising market - seller reserves his right to change his price to reflect the alleged market conditions.

[mattf93]

FalconWood said:

Camlet said:

_Superleggera_ said:

Camlet said:

......also, why would Tom Hartley post his new RHD 599 GTO at £695K and then almost immediately change it to POA? I'm not buying for obvious reasons but curious why.

Because they get more enquiries with POA's. Then you have another contact on the books for a potential future sale.

Yeah, I get that but why post a number and then change it to POA? Feels mucky. Perhaps they have a summer intern who was a little too keen

Because he had it on at £695k for a few weeks when last week out of the blue two more came on the market, in red, a RHD and a LHD, similar miles at a staggering £795k each and he therefore wanted to move his understated price. That's what happens in a fast moving rising market - seller reserves his right to change his price to reflect the alleged market conditions.

Theres now one on for £850k yes you read that right! Absolute madness!

And Camlet thanks for the info on the comparison. Know what you mean about the Astons DBS/Vanquish just don't seem to rev high enough or fast enough (from people I know who've driven or owned both) apparently the words used Ive heard is 'lethargic power delivery' by comparison to the 599/F12.

GTO looks special, what colour is yours Camlet?

[Camlet]

FalconWood said:

Camlet said:

_Superleggera_ said:

Camlet said:

......also, why would Tom Hartley post his new RHD 599 GTO at £695K and then almost immediately change it to POA? I'm not buying for obvious reasons but curious why.

Because they get more enquiries with POA's. Then you have another contact on the books for a potential future sale.

Yeah, I get that but why post a number and then change it to POA? Feels mucky. Perhaps they have a summer intern who was a little too keen

Because he had it on at £695k for a few weeks when last week out of the blue two more came on the market, in red, a RHD and a LHD, similar miles at a staggering £795k each and he therefore wanted to move his understated price. That's what happens in a fast moving rising market - seller reserves his right to change his price to reflect the alleged market conditions.

Seriously? 795? R and LHD? 695 understated? I shouldn't complain, it means my car has more than doubled in value in less than 5 years. But while few markets are rational, a bunch of dart throwing monkeys would make more sense of current pricing.

[Camlet]

mattf93 said:

FalconWood said:

Camlet said:

_Superleggera_ said:

Camlet said:

......also, why would Tom Hartley post his new RHD 599 GTO at £695K and then almost immediately change it to POA? I'm not buying for obvious reasons but curious why.

Because they get more enquiries with POA's. Then you have another contact on the books for a potential future sale.

Yeah, I get that but why post a number and then change it to POA? Feels mucky. Perhaps they have a summer intern who was a little too keen

Because he had it on at £695k for a few weeks when last week out of the blue two more came on the market, in red, a RHD and a LHD, similar miles at a staggering £795k each and he therefore wanted to move his understated price. That's what happens in a fast moving rising market - seller reserves his right to change his price to reflect the alleged market conditions.

Theres now one on for £850k yes you read that right! Absolute madness!

And Camlet thanks for the info on the comparison. Know what you mean about the Astons DBS/Vanquish just don't seem to rev high enough or fast enough (from people I know who've driven or owned both) apparently the words used Ive heard is 'lethargic power delivery' by comparison to the 599/F12.

GTO looks special, what colour is yours Camlet?

The GTO is very special, in fairness most Ferraris are. I adore the Aston heritage but for reasons well known while they've always been beautiful they're just off the pace in handling and performance, compared to Ferrari. I nearly bought the first Vanquish in 1998, until I drove a 550. The Maranello was a different league. Blew it away in everything except looks. I still have my 550, and it's better with each passing year, including its design, which to me now looks way better than the old Vanquish.

Per my GTO, it's Grigio Ferro, Silverstone roof, grey alloys, aluminium calipers and CF. Interior: charcoal alcantara, nero leather and lots of CF. She has siblings inc the 550 and others but the one Mrs C likes most? The 599 GTO. So it isn't going anywhere. I'd be packed off first.

Regarding current pricing of the 599 GTO, I understand what's driving this but it doesn't make it any less remarkable. Makes a good F40 and F50 seem cheap. That can't be right. But in an environment of long term low interest rates (and given the Yuan reduction yesterday) assets like LE Ferraris are clearly extremely desirable. The recent craving for Speciale Apertas and the feeding frenzy on the yet to be launched LE F12 VS, crazy times continue.

Edited by Camlet on Wednesday 12th August 07:10

[flemke]

FalconWood said:

Camlet said:

_Superleggera_ said:

Camlet said:

......also, why would Tom Hartley post his new RHD 599 GTO at £695K and then almost immediately change it to POA? I'm not buying for obvious reasons but curious why.

Because they get more enquiries with POA's. Then you have another contact on the books for a potential future sale.

Yeah, I get that but why post a number and then change it to POA? Feels mucky. Perhaps they have a summer intern who was a little too keen

Because he had it on at £695k for a few weeks when last week out of the blue two more came on the market, in red, a RHD and a LHD, similar miles at a staggering £795k each and he therefore wanted to move his understated price. That's what happens in a fast moving rising market - seller reserves his right to change his price to reflect the alleged market conditions.

Sounds like classic case of a dealer trying to talk up the market, with nothing have actually changed.

At present on www.mobile.de there are 6 cars for sale for less than £500k. On that basis I'm not sure that one could say that £695k is understated!

[mattf93]

flemke said:

Sounds like classic case of a dealer trying to talk up the market, with nothing have actually changed.

At present on www.mobile.de there are 6 cars for sale for less than £500k. On that basis I'm not sure that one could say that £695k is understated!

I thought Dick Lovett were having a laugh with their TDF RHD one at £700k, then that advert was put out at£850, surely that's fake? At going the 599 GTO is a gorgeous looking, sounding and driving car I worry that those values are unsustainable in comparison compared to F40s and F50s. I guess quite a few people are jumping on the bandwagon of cars being investments where they don't have to deal with capital gains tax with their profits.

Another issue is that I know of a few people with Speicales and they're considering how much they should be driving them slightly on the basis of the market at the moment and how desirable they seem to be!

[mattf93]

Camlet said:

The GTO is very special, in fairness most Ferraris are. I adore the Aston heritage but for reasons well known while they've always been beautiful they're just off the pace in handling and performance, compared to Ferrari. I nearly bought the first Vanquish in 1998, until I drove a 550. The Maranello was a different league. Blew it away in everything except looks. I still have my 550, and it's better with each passing year, including its design, which to me now looks way better than the old Vanquish.

Per my GTO, it's Grigio Ferro, Silverstone roof, grey alloys, aluminium calipers and CF. Interior: charcoal alcantara, nero leather and lots of CF. She has siblings inc the 550 and others but the one Mrs C likes most? The 599 GTO. So it isn't going anywhere. I'd be packed off first.

Regarding current pricing of the 599 GTO, I understand what's driving this but it doesn't make it any less remarkable. Makes a good F40 and F50 seem cheap. That can't be right. But in an environment of long term low interest rates (and given the Yuan reduction yesterday) assets like LE Ferraris are clearly extremely desirable. The recent craving for Speciale Apertas and the feeding frenzy on the yet to be launched LE F12 VS, crazy times continue.

Edited by Camlet on Wednesday 12th August 07:10

Perhaps with the Astons it's something you should do later on in life (thinking of vanquish and DB9) when you don't want to be absolutely on it. I. Think they will always lack the ferocity of a Ferrari, but I don't think they've ever tried to go toe to toe dynamically with Ferrari. The new vanquish in my eyes is beautiful and sounds lovely, it looks like the perfect GT car in coupe or Volante form (I would love either) a friend just sold his DBS Volante and its one of my favourite cars I've been in, there's just something about them - perhaps it's an itch you still need to scratch at some point?

Your GTO sounds like a lovey spec, I presume considering your other toys you've had from new and RHD - lovely Speciale Aperta you have btw - my choice of colour on one! Have you driven her much?

Some dealers are pushing the 599 GTO as the next big thing ( I realised this when they were sat at £300-£350k they were next as Falcon well knows buying his car That I at the time(late 2013/early2014) earmarked lottery money with haha). Lovetts I think at 700k won't sell and Stering Autos are having an absolute Laugh at £850k although the market is favouring limited edition Ferraris there has to be a line somewhere?

Edited by mattf93 on Wednesday 12th August 08:49

[f1ten]

I genuinely would love to ask and know anyone that has bought an F40 (legendary classic) at £750k+ or even on a different slant (as mentioned above)a 599GTO at £650k+ and has purely bought as a driving toy. I think the answer is above - No they are all bought as investments. One surely cant possibly justify buying at these prices without being an investor / (I mean Gambler!) Which means no longer are they driving around London (the gtos) (btw I get that F40s will remain here and not bounce much on price as it is after all now a proper classic having had its 25th birthday)

I remember in 2012 there were about 15 GTOs in Knightsbridge driving around daily...

I admit if it was mine and it was now worth double then I probably would only take it out 4-5 times a year also.

I just don't see this lasting with the GTO as its still a modern car and obviously great to drive but it must be at risk that if the new f12 special is priced at 500 or whatever then surely gtos will have to dip?

[Camlet]

mattf93 said:

Camlet said:

The GTO is very special, in fairness most Ferraris are. I adore the Aston heritage but for reasons well known while they've always been beautiful they're just off the pace in handling and performance, compared to Ferrari. I nearly bought the first Vanquish in 1998, until I drove a 550. The Maranello was a different league. Blew it away in everything except looks. I still have my 550, and it's better with each passing year, including its design, which to me now looks way better than the old Vanquish.

Per my GTO, it's Grigio Ferro, Silverstone roof, grey alloys, aluminium calipers and CF. Interior: charcoal alcantara, nero leather and lots of CF. She has siblings inc the 550 and others but the one Mrs C likes most? The 599 GTO. So it isn't going anywhere. I'd be packed off first.

Regarding current pricing of the 599 GTO, I understand what's driving this but it doesn't make it any less remarkable. Makes a good F40 and F50 seem cheap. That can't be right. But in an environment of long term low interest rates (and given the Yuan reduction yesterday) assets like LE Ferraris are clearly extremely desirable. The recent craving for Speciale Apertas and the feeding frenzy on the yet to be launched LE F12 VS, crazy times continue.

Edited by Camlet on Wednesday 12th August 07:10

Perhaps with the Astons it's something you should do later on in life (thinking of vanquish and DB9) when you don't want to be absolutely on it. I. Think they will always lack the ferocity of a Ferrari, but I don't think they've ever tried to go toe to toe dynamically with Ferrari. The new vanquish in my eyes is beautiful and sounds lovely, it looks like the perfect GT car in coupe or Volante form (I would love either) a friend just sold his DBS Volante and its one of my favourite cars I've been in, there's just something about them - perhaps it's an itch you still need to scratch at some point?

Your GTO sounds like a lovey spec, I presume considering your other toys you've had from new and RHD - lovely Speciale Aperta you have btw - my choice of colour on one! Have you driven her much?

Some dealers are pushing the 599 GTO as the next big thing ( I realised this when they were sat at £300-£350k they were next as Falcon well knows buying his car That I at the time(late 2013/early2014) earmarked lottery money with haha). Lovetts I think at 700k won't sell and Stering Autos are having an absolute Laugh at £850k although the market is favouring limited edition Ferraris there has to be a line somewhere?

Edited by mattf93 on Wednesday 12th August 08:49

Great points per Aston analysis. Hadn't thought of it quite like that but what you say makes much sense. Will be interesting to see where Andy Palmer takes AM, he's a very smart guy. Per my 599 GTO, I've attached a pic of her. Yes, I bought her from new and it's 100% UK RHD spec! Do I drive her much? I've other wonderful distractions but hell yes. These cars must be driven - it's not just an emotive thing, they're bloody machines and laid up for too long you've nothing but issues. Thanks re the Speciale, she's fab - just completed a superb drive to Italy in her. The Aperta is not due until end September, I've done it in the exact same spec as the coupe. Finally, I agree with your point about the upper price points. About 6 months ago a large indie dealer offered me £ 525K for my GTO even though I wasn't asking and definitely wasn't selling. Gives you some idea of the spread. Cheers.

Edited by Camlet on Wednesday 12th August 11:43

[WCZ]

re: the 550

my neighbour has more cars than pairs of socks and changes them as frequently too - he's gone through just about every ferrari/porsche/aston martin that they've made in the last 15 years since I've lived near him and the only car he's kept throughout this time is his 550

I think a few of us were naive about the 599gto and genuinely thought it wouldn't appreciate out of their price range - £850k is nuts

- also those examples on mobile.de are LHD

[mon the fish]

Camlet said:

Great points per Aston analysis. Hadn't thought of it quite like that but what you say makes much sense. Will be interesting to see where Andy Palmer takes AM, he's a very smart guy. Per my 599 GTO, I've attached a pic of her. Yes, I bought her from new and it's 100% UK RHD spec! Do I drive her much? I've other wonderful distractions but hell yes. These cars must be driven - it's not just an emotive thing, they're bloody machines and laid up for too long you've nothing but issues. Thanks re the Speciale, she's fab - just completed a superb drive to Italy in her. The Aperta is not due until end September, I've done it in the exact same spec as the coupe. Finally, I agree with your point about the upper price points. About 6 months ago a large indie dealer offered me £ 525K for my GTO even though I wasn't asking and definitely wasn't selling. Gives you some idea of the spread. Cheers.

Edited by Camlet on Wednesday 12th August 11:43

How do you find the GTO compares to the Speciale, in that they are similar in concept at least?

[Camlet]

mon the fish said:

Camlet said:

Great points per Aston analysis. Hadn't thought of it quite like that but what you say makes much sense. Will be interesting to see where Andy Palmer takes AM, he's a very smart guy. Per my 599 GTO, I've attached a pic of her. Yes, I bought her from new and it's 100% UK RHD spec! Do I drive her much? I've other wonderful distractions but hell yes. These cars must be driven - it's not just an emotive thing, they're bloody machines and laid up for too long you've nothing but issues. Thanks re the Speciale, she's fab - just completed a superb drive to Italy in her. The Aperta is not due until end September, I've done it in the exact same spec as the coupe. Finally, I agree with your point about the upper price points. About 6 months ago a large indie dealer offered me £ 525K for my GTO even though I wasn't asking and definitely wasn't selling. Gives you some idea of the spread. Cheers.

Edited by Camlet on Wednesday 12th August 11:43

How do you find the GTO compares to the Speciale, in that they are similar in concept at least?

That's a tough question. Think perhaps Mike Tyson (in his prime) compared with Floyd Mayweather Jnr?

The Speciale is the best point to point sports car I've ever driven. It's razor sharp, beautiful to drive, remarkable in its turn of speed. Now before people pounce on me yes, Chris Harris is smarter about sportscars asleep than I am awake. But I've driven and/or own a fair few silly cars and the Speciale is incredible. And crazy as it is, the reason I am taking the Aperta but keeping the coupe is because the Speciale is so exceptional that I can't believe the Aperta can match 100% the Speciale's extraordinary capability.

The 599 GTO is bigger in every way. It's obviously larger than the Speciale, heavier, demands far much more attention, feels like way Tyson looked before a fight, very mean. I'm not saying it's difficult to drive, just it kind of grabs you by the scruff of your neck and asks, so what have you got.

Similar in concept? Yes but per my boxing analogy, different. If I took both to a race track, I'd be excited to go play in the Speciale. But my heart rate would double in the GTO.

[Anjum]

Agree re: speciale - I love mine!

But - as much as I love the GTO - and it IS a great car - is it now worth the same as an F40? I'm not so sure personally. I guess it's supply v's demand - but I'm now going cool about about any more acquisitions right now....

[mattf93]

Camlet said:

mattf93 said:

Camlet said:

The GTO is very special, in fairness most Ferraris are. I adore the Aston heritage but for reasons well known while they've always been beautiful they're just off the pace in handling and performance, compared to Ferrari. I nearly bought the first Vanquish in 1998, until I drove a 550. The Maranello was a different league. Blew it away in everything except looks. I still have my 550, and it's better with each passing year, including its design, which to me now looks way better than the old Vanquish.

Per my GTO, it's Grigio Ferro, Silverstone roof, grey alloys, aluminium calipers and CF. Interior: charcoal alcantara, nero leather and lots of CF. She has siblings inc the 550 and others but the one Mrs C likes most? The 599 GTO. So it isn't going anywhere. I'd be packed off first.

Regarding current pricing of the 599 GTO, I understand what's driving this but it doesn't make it any less remarkable. Makes a good F40 and F50 seem cheap. That can't be right. But in an environment of long term low interest rates (and given the Yuan reduction yesterday) assets like LE Ferraris are clearly extremely desirable. The recent craving for Speciale Apertas and the feeding frenzy on the yet to be launched LE F12 VS, crazy times continue.

Edited by Camlet on Wednesday 12th August 07:10

Perhaps with the Astons it's something you should do later on in life (thinking of vanquish and DB9) when you don't want to be absolutely on it. I. Think they will always lack the ferocity of a Ferrari, but I don't think they've ever tried to go toe to toe dynamically with Ferrari. The new vanquish in my eyes is beautiful and sounds lovely, it looks like the perfect GT car in coupe or Volante form (I would love either) a friend just sold his DBS Volante and its one of my favourite cars I've been in, there's just something about them - perhaps it's an itch you still need to scratch at some point?

Your GTO sounds like a lovey spec, I presume considering your other toys you've had from new and RHD - lovely Speciale Aperta you have btw - my choice of colour on one! Have you driven her much?

Some dealers are pushing the 599 GTO as the next big thing ( I realised this when they were sat at £300-£350k they were next as Falcon well knows buying his car That I at the time(late 2013/early2014) earmarked lottery money with haha). Lovetts I think at 700k won't sell and Stering Autos are having an absolute Laugh at £850k although the market is favouring limited edition Ferraris there has to be a line somewhere?

Edited by mattf93 on Wednesday 12th August 08:49

Great points per Aston analysis. Hadn't thought of it quite like that but what you say makes much sense. Will be interesting to see where Andy Palmer takes AM, he's a very smart guy. Per my 599 GTO, I've attached a pic of her. Yes, I bought her from new and it's 100% UK RHD spec! Do I drive her much? I've other wonderful distractions but hell yes. These cars must be driven - it's not just an emotive thing, they're bloody machines and laid up for too long you've nothing but issues. Thanks re the Speciale, she's fab - just completed a superb drive to Italy in her. The Aperta is not due until end September, I've done it in the exact same spec as the coupe. Finally, I agree with your point about the upper price points. About 6 months ago a large indie dealer offered me £ 525K for my GTO even though I wasn't asking and definitely wasn't selling. Gives you some idea of the spread. Cheers.

Edited by Camlet on Wednesday 12th August 11:43

This was a Rosso Fuoco with Tricolore Stripe 599 GTO I saw at the FOC concours at Stapleford park, look beautiful when the sun came out! (click to enlarge the photo if it appears blurred)

The GTO really does look special. and yours is a lovely example. have you got many miles on yours now? (not that its overly relevant to you as its good to hear you drive it)
Yup the V12 GT Cars will never be as hyper sensitive as a ferrari, respond at the flip of a switch, the thing that Ive been told most is the engine doesnt rev high enough it needs another 500-1000rpm over its red line (I think its 6.85k) a Mclaren 12c which is turbocharged revs higher than that! Also you should try a vanquish with the updated 8 speed gearbox as apparently it transforms the car (64 reg on), worth at least a test drive? But if you're used to 599GTO/F12 its an entirely different drive.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BMHpMCVIuEc This video by Evo is well worth a watch on the cars (compares F12 with Aventador and Vanquish with the 6 speed automated manual gearbox rather than 8 speed ZF unit in the updated car (also does over 200mph now and 0-62 has dropped to 3.7/3.8 I think which for a heavier car is good going)