aventador exhaust
Discussion
graeme4130 said:
sone said:
ZeusF said:
sone said:
ZeusF said:
paddy328 said:
I was going to suggest that, but wasn't sure what they used. Though, the best one I've seen is yours Jason.
Thank you 
Its coming off now to make room for the turbo conversion.iandc said:
ZeusF said:
The only exhaust we have tested that gives power on the aventador is the oakley design system.
I had an Oakley on mine. It is titanium so weighs next to nothing and great sound. Oakley did a superb job of fitting and never got warning lights etc.can I ask, what pleasure do you get from making such a comment ?
Not many engines are developed to take that type of abuse
It'd be interesting to see how L-uk handle a potential warranty claim if the ECU shows that type of abuse backed up with various youtube videos ?
I also don't understand the issue with people revving so others can take pics. Remember that many owners allow people to gain pleasure from their cars wether thats at a show or a meet or as you drive by. The only issue I would question is noise at a reasonable time. other than that, whats the issue ?
I've spoken to Lambo and they told me they have a race exhaust which i can have. It can cost anything up to £9k and doesn't void the warranty.
Even though it's better then the sports exhaust it's still not as good as the ones mentioned above. And it's a continuous sound therefore you cannot turn it off.
Also Lambo have said any other aftermarket exhaust used on their cars will void warranty no matter what. I'm sure i read somewhere that they can't do this lawfully but lambo are adamant that they can.
Even though it's better then the sports exhaust it's still not as good as the ones mentioned above. And it's a continuous sound therefore you cannot turn it off.
Also Lambo have said any other aftermarket exhaust used on their cars will void warranty no matter what. I'm sure i read somewhere that they can't do this lawfully but lambo are adamant that they can.
gmarsh said:
And will insurance become invalid due to the modification, unless they have been told?
I'd guess the insurance will be invalid whether you tell them it's modified or not. A modern decat car cannot pass an MOT and is therefore illegal. Someone please set me straight if I'm wrong!I think the ultimate power of the law could be to confiscate the vehicle also (?), if they thought to have a good nosey round it.
If you look here, a few pics in you can see the two factory exhausts together, the race exhaust is a lot smaller.
http://instagram.com/lamborghinimiami
http://instagram.com/lamborghinimiami
70proof said:
Surely you want more weight over the rear wheels to help put the power down... So I've never understood these lighter sports exhausts? Weight saving has to be elsewhere, surely?
Losing a large amount of weight from the exhaust is a good thing. It will not effect downforce, the Aventador is a 4wd car.The manufacturer can't avoid warranty even though some suggest it will. The biggest Lambo dealers on earth sell sports exhausts and have zero issues.
I would however never fit decals on the Aventador. This is a bad thing !
Intakes, Exhaust and software convert the stock LP700 too LP760 which really is nice on this car.
70proof said:
Surely you want more weight over the rear wheels to help put the power down... So I've never understood these lighter sports exhausts? Weight saving has to be elsewhere, surely?
If that was true we'd all be driving around in 3 ton cars. There's more than enough weight in an Aventador to keep the power down.Weight saving on these is normally in the order of 10-20kg, its not really significant on a 1500kg car, you will not feel any improvement based on the weight alone. Its a good selling point for the systems though.
My understanding from a warranty perspective was that Lamborghini will be amenable to warranty issues not directly related to the exhaust but anything would more than likely depend on your relationship with the garage!
ZeusF said:
The manufacturer can't avoid warranty even though some suggest it will. The biggest Lambo dealers on earth sell sports exhausts and have zero issues.
You're referring to the American market? The US is a very different market.Edited by threesixty on Thursday 20th November 10:50
threesixty said:
70proof said:
Surely you want more weight over the rear wheels to help put the power down... So I've never understood these lighter sports exhausts? Weight saving has to be elsewhere, surely?
If that was true we'd all be driving around in 3 ton cars. There's more than enough weight in an Aventador to keep the power down.Weight saving on these is normally in the order of 10-20kg, its not really significant on a 1500kg car, you will not feel any improvement based on the weight alone. Its a good selling point for the systems though.
ZeusF said:
The manufacturer can't avoid warranty even though some suggest it will.
No i called them yesterday and they said all will be voided now - looks like only been put into place in the last few weeks. I think they've spotted the growing number aftermarket exhaust being sold, and want to stop this and sell their own product.
Bunty Killa said:
ZeusF said:
The manufacturer can't avoid warranty even though some suggest it will.
No i called them yesterday and they said all will be voided now - looks like only been put into place in the last few weeks. I think they've spotted the growing number aftermarket exhaust being sold, and want to stop this and sell their own product.
Anti competition laws do not allow for this and its worse in Europe than it is in USA.
Dealers can say whatever they like but the law is very simple on this.
The dealer has to prove that the work you have done is the direct cause of a failure so lets say that the exhaust pops the engine due to bad air/fuel then they can void the warranty but they have to prove this.
ZeusF said:
This is illegal, ask them to put it in writing.
Anti competition laws do not allow for this and its worse in Europe than it is in USA.
Dealers can say whatever they like but the law is very simple on this.
The dealer has to prove that the work you have done is the direct cause of a failure so lets say that the exhaust pops the engine due to bad air/fuel then they can void the warranty but they have to prove this.
As someone who sells aftermarket car products its hardly surprising that you'd take that stance.Anti competition laws do not allow for this and its worse in Europe than it is in USA.
Dealers can say whatever they like but the law is very simple on this.
The dealer has to prove that the work you have done is the direct cause of a failure so lets say that the exhaust pops the engine due to bad air/fuel then they can void the warranty but they have to prove this.
The letter of the law in these cases is irrelevant unless you have the time, inclination and funds to pursue it. The best way to get any warranty issues resolved quickly and efficiently is by being on good terms with the people who supply that warranty, after all determining the cause in the event of significant engine damage can be tricky.
This has all be done to death on PH(reams of this stuff on the Porsche forum).
threesixty said:
ZeusF said:
This is illegal, ask them to put it in writing.
Anti competition laws do not allow for this and its worse in Europe than it is in USA.
Dealers can say whatever they like but the law is very simple on this.
The dealer has to prove that the work you have done is the direct cause of a failure so lets say that the exhaust pops the engine due to bad air/fuel then they can void the warranty but they have to prove this.
As someone who sells aftermarket car products its hardly surprising that you'd take that stance.Anti competition laws do not allow for this and its worse in Europe than it is in USA.
Dealers can say whatever they like but the law is very simple on this.
The dealer has to prove that the work you have done is the direct cause of a failure so lets say that the exhaust pops the engine due to bad air/fuel then they can void the warranty but they have to prove this.
The letter of the law in these cases is irrelevant unless you have the time, inclination and funds to pursue it. The best way to get any warranty issues resolved quickly and efficiently is by being on good terms with the people who supply that warranty, after all determining the cause in the event of significant engine damage can be tricky.
This has all be done to death on PH(reams of this stuff on the Porsche forum).
There have been countless issues relating to dealers voiding claims but I'm yet to hear of a manufacturer doing it. Also, its worth remembering that TUV approved products can't be deemed as warranty voiding which we should all be aware of.
Does anyone remember when dealers used to suggest that warranty was void unless you use them to service your car. This went to the high courts and guess who won !
Anti competition is illegal, no manufacturer would argue this in court, the reason is that even if they won (and they wouldn't) it would cost them millions fighting it.
USA Law: http://lehtoslaw.com/will-modifications-void-new-c...
As for the UK, its a grey area because of the lies and potential fraud committed daily by the various dealers.
Do I have to use the dealer for repairs and maintenance to keep my warranty in effect?
No. An independent mechanic, a retail chain shop, or even you yourself can do routine maintenance and repairs on your vehicle. In fact, the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act, which is enforced by the FTC, makes it illegal for manufacturers or dealers to claim that your warranty is void or to deny coverage under your warranty simply because someone other than the dealer did the work.
Will using 'aftermarket' or recycled parts void my warranty?
No. An 'aftermarket' part is a part made by a company other than the vehicle manufacturer or the original equipment manufacturer. A 'recycled' part is a part that was made for and installed in a new vehicle by the manufacturer or the original equipment manufacturer, and later removed from the vehicle and made available for resale or reuse. Simply using an aftermarket or recycled part does not void your warranty. The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act makes it illegal for companies to void your warranty or deny coverage under the warranty simply because you used an aftermarket or recycled part.
I have been unable to find a single case where a manufacturer has won any claim against an aftermarket component without first confirming beyond reasonable doubt that the component was the direct cause of a failure.
As for the UK, its a grey area because of the lies and potential fraud committed daily by the various dealers.
Do I have to use the dealer for repairs and maintenance to keep my warranty in effect?
No. An independent mechanic, a retail chain shop, or even you yourself can do routine maintenance and repairs on your vehicle. In fact, the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act, which is enforced by the FTC, makes it illegal for manufacturers or dealers to claim that your warranty is void or to deny coverage under your warranty simply because someone other than the dealer did the work.
Will using 'aftermarket' or recycled parts void my warranty?
No. An 'aftermarket' part is a part made by a company other than the vehicle manufacturer or the original equipment manufacturer. A 'recycled' part is a part that was made for and installed in a new vehicle by the manufacturer or the original equipment manufacturer, and later removed from the vehicle and made available for resale or reuse. Simply using an aftermarket or recycled part does not void your warranty. The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act makes it illegal for companies to void your warranty or deny coverage under the warranty simply because you used an aftermarket or recycled part.
I have been unable to find a single case where a manufacturer has won any claim against an aftermarket component without first confirming beyond reasonable doubt that the component was the direct cause of a failure.
ZeusF said:
graeme4130 said:
sone said:
ZeusF said:
sone said:
ZeusF said:
paddy328 said:
I was going to suggest that, but wasn't sure what they used. Though, the best one I've seen is yours Jason.
Thank you Its coming off now to make room for the turbo conversion.iandc said:
ZeusF said:
The only exhaust we have tested that gives power on the aventador is the oakley design system.
I had an Oakley on mine. It is titanium so weighs next to nothing and great sound. Oakley did a superb job of fitting and never got warning lights etc.can I ask, what pleasure do you get from making such a comment ?
Not many engines are developed to take that type of abuse
It'd be interesting to see how L-uk handle a potential warranty claim if the ECU shows that type of abuse backed up with various youtube videos ?
I also don't understand the issue with people revving so others can take pics. Remember that many owners allow people to gain pleasure from their cars wether thats at a show or a meet or as you drive by. The only issue I would question is noise at a reasonable time. other than that, whats the issue ?
I think if I was to actually drill down in my reasoning, the only thing I can think of is that whilst the minority (mainly camera kids) think it's cool and is going to get them a million 'tube hits, the majority (general public, passers by, residents of the inner city areas where the footage seems to originate from, etc) think it's utterly pointless, overly noisy and generally the act of idiots. This, in turn, perpetuates the general publics perception of supercar drivers
Revving an engine hard at a car show is one thing, stopping traffic in Knightsbridge on a busy commuter day and making flames is entirely another
I agree entirely about what you say re the warranty, they'd struggle to find legitimate grounds for rejection of a claim. However, any element of goodwill might be a different matter
I don't know if it's directly comparable to Lamborghini but when I had a Porsche the extended warranty was an entirely different beast to the manufacturer warranty.
The latter is the thing that is moderated by the Block Exemption regulations regarding customers being able to take their cars to indie dealers, etc. Not 100% sure as to how it deals with non-OEM parts being fitted during this warranty period, though I suspect the manufacturer would have a much harder job disclaiming cover unless the part was directly and unequivocally attributable to a subsequent fault.
The Porsche extended warranty, on the other hand, is effectively a contract between you and Porsche AG*. You agree to the terms of the contract when you sign up for it, and you are not "forced" to enter into the terms (as you essentially are with a new car warranty). The terms of that warranty are - the last I checked - fairly onerous: no aftermarket modifications are permitted, N-rated tyres must be fitted, etc. If you break those terms you do so willingly and are up the proverbial brown creek without a paddle, save for any goodwill you can recover. I don't know how Lamborghini's (or A.N.Other supercar manufacturer) extended warranty compares, but I'd be surprised if it was much different.
The key difference is that with the new car warranty if you fitted non N-rated tyres, and the suspension failed, Porsche wouldn't be able to use the presence of them as a reason not to provide warranty support. With an extended warranty they could on simple principal that you'd broken the terms of the contract.
* In the case of a Porsche extended warranty it's actually a contract between you and an underwriter directly, with Porsche AG essentially as the intermediary broker.
The latter is the thing that is moderated by the Block Exemption regulations regarding customers being able to take their cars to indie dealers, etc. Not 100% sure as to how it deals with non-OEM parts being fitted during this warranty period, though I suspect the manufacturer would have a much harder job disclaiming cover unless the part was directly and unequivocally attributable to a subsequent fault.
The Porsche extended warranty, on the other hand, is effectively a contract between you and Porsche AG*. You agree to the terms of the contract when you sign up for it, and you are not "forced" to enter into the terms (as you essentially are with a new car warranty). The terms of that warranty are - the last I checked - fairly onerous: no aftermarket modifications are permitted, N-rated tyres must be fitted, etc. If you break those terms you do so willingly and are up the proverbial brown creek without a paddle, save for any goodwill you can recover. I don't know how Lamborghini's (or A.N.Other supercar manufacturer) extended warranty compares, but I'd be surprised if it was much different.
The key difference is that with the new car warranty if you fitted non N-rated tyres, and the suspension failed, Porsche wouldn't be able to use the presence of them as a reason not to provide warranty support. With an extended warranty they could on simple principal that you'd broken the terms of the contract.
* In the case of a Porsche extended warranty it's actually a contract between you and an underwriter directly, with Porsche AG essentially as the intermediary broker.
Durzel said:
I don't know if it's directly comparable to Lamborghini but when I had a Porsche the extended warranty was an entirely different beast to the manufacturer warranty.
The latter is the thing that is moderated by the Block Exemption regulations regarding customers being able to take their cars to indie dealers, etc. Not 100% sure as to how it deals with non-OEM parts being fitted during this warranty period, though I suspect the manufacturer would have a much harder job disclaiming cover unless the part was directly and unequivocally attributable to a subsequent fault.
The Porsche extended warranty, on the other hand, is effectively a contract between you and Porsche AG*. You agree to the terms of the contract when you sign up for it, and you are not "forced" to enter into the terms (as you essentially are with a new car warranty). The terms of that warranty are - the last I checked - fairly onerous: no aftermarket modifications are permitted, N-rated tyres must be fitted, etc. If you break those terms you do so willingly and are up the proverbial brown creek without a paddle, save for any goodwill you can recover. I don't know how Lamborghini's (or A.N.Other supercar manufacturer) extended warranty compares, but I'd be surprised if it was much different.
The key difference is that with the new car warranty if you fitted non N-rated tyres, and the suspension failed, Porsche wouldn't be able to use the presence of them as a reason not to provide warranty support. With an extended warranty they could on simple principal that you'd broken the terms of the contract.
* In the case of a Porsche extended warranty it's actually a contract between you and an underwriter directly, with Porsche AG essentially as the intermediary broker.
This is how manufacturers and dealers win, they make you sign contracts that are not legal then get away with it but having a line in the contract that says something like "any part of this contracts that is deemed illegal or against consumer rights will be changed to bring into line with current legal legislation"The latter is the thing that is moderated by the Block Exemption regulations regarding customers being able to take their cars to indie dealers, etc. Not 100% sure as to how it deals with non-OEM parts being fitted during this warranty period, though I suspect the manufacturer would have a much harder job disclaiming cover unless the part was directly and unequivocally attributable to a subsequent fault.
The Porsche extended warranty, on the other hand, is effectively a contract between you and Porsche AG*. You agree to the terms of the contract when you sign up for it, and you are not "forced" to enter into the terms (as you essentially are with a new car warranty). The terms of that warranty are - the last I checked - fairly onerous: no aftermarket modifications are permitted, N-rated tyres must be fitted, etc. If you break those terms you do so willingly and are up the proverbial brown creek without a paddle, save for any goodwill you can recover. I don't know how Lamborghini's (or A.N.Other supercar manufacturer) extended warranty compares, but I'd be surprised if it was much different.
The key difference is that with the new car warranty if you fitted non N-rated tyres, and the suspension failed, Porsche wouldn't be able to use the presence of them as a reason not to provide warranty support. With an extended warranty they could on simple principal that you'd broken the terms of the contract.
* In the case of a Porsche extended warranty it's actually a contract between you and an underwriter directly, with Porsche AG essentially as the intermediary broker.
Basically they want you to think your not covered and only when you question it will they backtrack and cover you.
graeme4130 said:
To be honest, I'd find it difficult to convey a truly quantifiable reason as to why I don't like to see cars rev'd hard in a stationary manner for the benefit of 'camera kids' such as in the self named lord aleems videos for example
I think if I was to actually drill down in my reasoning, the only thing I can think of is that whilst the minority (mainly camera kids) think it's cool and is going to get them a million 'tube hits, the majority (general public, passers by, residents of the inner city areas where the footage seems to originate from, etc) think it's utterly pointless, overly noisy and generally the act of idiots. This, in turn, perpetuates the general publics perception of supercar drivers
Revving an engine hard at a car show is one thing, stopping traffic in Knightsbridge on a busy commuter day and making flames is entirely another
I think it all has a time and a place. Doing it in a residential street (even if that is a touristy shopping area too) is out of order. You're the eleventy billionth person to do it there that weekend.... its not big and its not clever. I think if I was to actually drill down in my reasoning, the only thing I can think of is that whilst the minority (mainly camera kids) think it's cool and is going to get them a million 'tube hits, the majority (general public, passers by, residents of the inner city areas where the footage seems to originate from, etc) think it's utterly pointless, overly noisy and generally the act of idiots. This, in turn, perpetuates the general publics perception of supercar drivers
Revving an engine hard at a car show is one thing, stopping traffic in Knightsbridge on a busy commuter day and making flames is entirely another
I'll happily oblige if I can do it without taking the piss as far are residents go etc. example - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FNxYTpd61xI - some random bloke asks me to rev it in a car park in the middle afternoon. Nobody inconvenienced, nobody hassled, no problem!
If I've got Schmee chasing me up mayfair with a semi in one hand and a camera in the other.... then f
k off.
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