£100k budget trackday / weekend car

[Far Cough]

sparta6 said:

^^this^^

Any street car will be compromised for heavy track work.
Any track car will be compromised for public road use.

Unless you factor in a 911 GT3

I too was surprised we got into 3 pages and no one mentioned a GT3. Probably because the OP was specific about the choice of an Exige or a GT4. If all bets are off now, then I`d be looking for a GT3.

I`ve just got out of a GTS with the 4 cylinder engine and I tracked it loads. Fantastic bit of kit. Had it 2 years and it cost me nothing to run in the grans scheme of things. I put 2 sets of tyres on it and had to replace the front brakes. Other than that it never missed a beat and embarrassed some pretty expensive machinery on track. When it was time to go home , I just put it in auto, set the cruise and wafted home ! I imagine the GT4 would be no different other than they have better and bigger brakes as standard so you would probably be OK and not have to replace. Even if you need to replace the pads on a GT4, its a very easy job and does not have to done by an OPC.

I chopped the GTS in for a 991.2 GT3 as my thoughts were that I was heading that way anyway so getting a GT4 would just be adding an extra car in between the other 2. You mention that you would do 1 trackday per month and I am assuming you mean in the summer months ? Even so , most insurance policies that cover trackdays give you about 6 per policy. A GT3 or GT4 would soak up that no problem at all. One trackday per month is not that much leaving the rest of the time running the car on the road. This percentage would not encourage me to get a Lotus unless that percentage changed quite a bit !!!

It`s a nice decision to have. You could do what a mate of mine has just done and get a couple of year old GT4, still in as new condition and arguably a more involving drive than a 718 ( if you believe the car journo`s ) and pocket £30k for tyres, petrol and possibly some brake pads.

It goes round and round and I have been there and got the T shirt. If you want a road car that soaks up trackdays then Porsche is the answer......

[px1980]

Shnozz said:

Another vote for an exige.

Although a lot of sense in the suggestion to rent a track car as and when needed and make it someone else’s problem. I switched to renting BatCats whenever I did a track day. Turn up in comfort, climb in the caterhal and let BaT take take of everything down to filling it with fuel.

Even taking into account the modest running costs of an exige, I still think it would be hard to financially beat renting a car as and when required.

I checked online, and these things cost £1000+vat for a day’s rental of a Caterham. They’re not cheap right?

[px1980]

Far Cough said:

Unless you factor in a 911 GT3

I too was surprised we got into 3 pages and no one mentioned a GT3. Probably because the OP was specific about the choice of an Exige or a GT4. If all bets are off now, then I`d be looking for a GT3.

I`ve just got out of a GTS with the 4 cylinder engine and I tracked it loads. Fantastic bit of kit. Had it 2 years and it cost me nothing to run in the grans scheme of things. I put 2 sets of tyres on it and had to replace the front brakes. Other than that it never missed a beat and embarrassed some pretty expensive machinery on track. When it was time to go home , I just put it in auto, set the cruise and wafted home ! I imagine the GT4 would be no different other than they have better and bigger brakes as standard so you would probably be OK and not have to replace. Even if you need to replace the pads on a GT4, its a very easy job and does not have to done by an OPC.

I chopped the GTS in for a 991.2 GT3 as my thoughts were that I was heading that way anyway so getting a GT4 would just be adding an extra car in between the other 2. You mention that you would do 1 trackday per month and I am assuming you mean in the summer months ? Even so , most insurance policies that cover trackdays give you about 6 per policy. A GT3 or GT4 would soak up that no problem at all. One trackday per month is not that much leaving the rest of the time running the car on the road. This percentage would not encourage me to get a Lotus unless that percentage changed quite a bit !!!

It`s a nice decision to have. You could do what a mate of mine has just done and get a couple of year old GT4, still in as new condition and arguably a more involving drive than a 718 ( if you believe the car journo`s ) and pocket £30k for tyres, petrol and possibly some brake pads.

It goes round and round and I have been there and got the T shirt. If you want a road car that soaks up trackdays then Porsche is the answer......

So you tracked the 718 GTS several (do you know how many) times over 2 years, and costs were 2 sets of tyres + pads? + insurance also I guess? Would you mind sharing the £ figure please? Because this sounds very close to how I’d be using the car.

[bobbysmithy]

px1980 said:

I checked online, and these things cost £1000+vat for a day’s rental of a Caterham. They’re not cheap right?

You don’t need to rent it. Buy one and various companies will
Do the rest

Edited by bobbysmithy on Saturday 26th December 11:37

[_Leg_]

bobbysmithy said:

Absolutely fantastic machine and id love it but would still have a caterham(420r with sadev) for most tracks due to lightness/playfulness of them. Ideally, id have both. It's not gonna happen tho.

I used to track an MK Indy R R1 that had a full cage (no roof, doors or windscreen) and before that a Westfield. Most fun you can have on track and by far the cheapest on consumables.

I just got sick of getting wet. I’m constantly tempted to swap my Racetransporter 4 for a 6, kit it out to take 2 cars and buy a Caterham 620 R so I can take both that and the Exige to track days and swap between them.

[bobbysmithy]

_Leg_ said:

I used to track an MK Indy R R1 that had a full cage (no roof, doors or windscreen) and before that a Westfield. Most fun you can have on track and by far the cheapest on consumables.

I just got sick of getting wet. I’m constantly tempted to swap my Racetransporter 4 for a 6, kit it out to take 2 cars and buy a Caterham 620 R so I can take both that and the Exige to track days and swap between them.

You forget you’re wet with the fun you have

[Shnozz]

px1980 said:

Shnozz said:

Another vote for an exige.

Although a lot of sense in the suggestion to rent a track car as and when needed and make it someone else’s problem. I switched to renting BatCats whenever I did a track day. Turn up in comfort, climb in the caterhal and let BaT take take of everything down to filling it with fuel.

Even taking into account the modest running costs of an exige, I still think it would be hard to financially beat renting a car as and when required.

I checked online, and these things cost £1000+vat for a day’s rental of a Caterham. They’re not cheap right?

Trackdays are not cheap in general.

I tend to try and share T/D with a mate which adds only £100 to the hire of the car and then halves the overall cost so somewhere in the region of £750 PP for the day (depending on the track). In reality you cannot do more than 30 mins per hour as a driver so sharing a day is ideal. A Caterham is also one of few cars that can be driven the whole hour around and around and when its hired you are less inclined to limit track time to 20 minutes in the hour as you might do with a heavier personally owned car.

In other words, by sharing a BaTCat for a day you get the same track time as you might with just you driving your own car.

So £750 per person.

If you said the TD component was £500 (as £1500 all in including car hire), then taking your own car means that cost, plus fuel (£100 minimum), insurance (if not covered on annual policy), £100+, then tyre wear, brake wear etc etc. In short, way more than the £250 balance and thats not taking into account any additional wear and tear on your own car - not so bad on a track orientated lightweight car such as an Exige. but doing TD's in something more exotic and heavier I would expect that would cost £1k+ a day on average without trouble.

[Far Cough]

px1980 said:

So you tracked the 718 GTS several (do you know how many) times over 2 years, and costs were 2 sets of tyres + pads? + insurance also I guess? Would you mind sharing the £ figure please? Because this sounds very close to how I’d be using the car.

Probably 8 trackdays per year in my ownership.......... the std rotors on the front which are drilled are the weak point. Mine was normal steel brakes not the PCCB`s...... I plumped for the Big Brake Kit from Nine Excellence. Circa £1500 which was reasonable and the fit and quality was superb. Anybody with half a brain could fit it as it retains original calliper.

Michelin Pilot 4s tyres were about £800 all round. No service needed as the car came freshly serviced and the next one was due after I part ex`d it. I paid out to PPF the front of it due to the track use but not essential. Track insurance was part of my annual policy and I`d normally average 150-180 miles on track each time. During my ownership it also did a eurotrip each year which was 2500 miles of hooning round the Alps.

Car did not miss a beat and having PDK was glorious as it allowed me the best of both worlds. Engaging when I want it to be and totally lazy when the roads were busy and slow. I can only imagine , a GT4 would be even better and more focused but you dont have the option of knocking it into auto for the boring stuff. Hence why I went GT3.

GTS was on standard suspension setup and it was a conscious decision to leave it that way and not pay for a slightly better setup. The downside was the tyres would wear the outside edge on track ,but the inside edge on the road. Something has to give when your flat out round a circuit !!!

[px1980]

Far Cough said:

Probably 8 trackdays per year in my ownership.......... the std rotors on the front which are drilled are the weak point. Mine was normal steel brakes not the PCCB`s...... I plumped for the Big Brake Kit from Nine Excellence. Circa £1500 which was reasonable and the fit and quality was superb. Anybody with half a brain could fit it as it retains original calliper.

Michelin Pilot 4s tyres were about £800 all round. No service needed as the car came freshly serviced and the next one was due after I part ex`d it. I paid out to PPF the front of it due to the track use but not essential. Track insurance was part of my annual policy and I`d normally average 150-180 miles on track each time. During my ownership it also did a eurotrip each year which was 2500 miles of hooning round the Alps.

These costs look reasonable - if I understand correctly, £1500 for brakes + 2x£800 for tyres for 2 years of 8x / year track days. So that’s £200/event in consumables. Insurance seems awfully expensive, I haven’t yet done proper research but quotes I’ve seen were £670 per *event*. I do hope to find something cheaper though. Say I manage to find something (assuming some multi-event discount) for £300/event. That’d be £500/event total costs, plus track fee. Not great but still cheaper than renting a Caterham for each event. I’m not sure if I haven’t missed something though. It could be that my assumptions here are optimistic.
Then there’s depreciation, too, obviously. On a GT4 it may be less than on other cars, but still.

Far Cough said:

Car did not miss a beat and having PDK was glorious as it allowed me the best of both worlds. Engaging when I want it to be and totally lazy when the roads were busy and slow. I can only imagine , a GT4 would be even better and more focused but you dont have the option of knocking it into auto for the boring stuff. Hence why I went GT3.

GTS was on standard suspension setup and it was a conscious decision to leave it that way and not pay for a slightly better setup. The downside was the tyres would wear the outside edge on track ,but the inside edge on the road. Something has to give when your flat out round a circuit !!!

That’s exactly my thinking. I’d be getting a GT4 with PDK as my heel and toe game is non existent. I was thinking that way I’d be getting great track experience, and easy cruising to/from it on the motorway, or - more importantly - I could still use it around London occassionally, not having to constantly switch between 1st and 2nd in the stop start traffic.

[MDL111]

_Leg_ said:

bobbysmithy said:

Absolutely fantastic machine and id love it but would still have a caterham(420r with sadev) for most tracks due to lightness/playfulness of them. Ideally, id have both. It's not gonna happen tho.

I used to track an MK Indy R R1 that had a full cage (no roof, doors or windscreen) and before that a Westfield. Most fun you can have on track and by far the cheapest on consumables.

I just got sick of getting wet. I’m constantly tempted to swap my Racetransporter 4 for a 6, kit it out to take 2 cars and buy a Caterham 620 R so I can take both that and the Exige to track days and swap between them.

How does that work? I mean getting an RT6 to take 2 cars?

[_Leg_]

MDL111 said:

_Leg_ said:

bobbysmithy said:

Absolutely fantastic machine and id love it but would still have a caterham(420r with sadev) for most tracks due to lightness/playfulness of them. Ideally, id have both. It's not gonna happen tho.

I used to track an MK Indy R R1 that had a full cage (no roof, doors or windscreen) and before that a Westfield. Most fun you can have on track and by far the cheapest on consumables.

I just got sick of getting wet. I’m constantly tempted to swap my Racetransporter 4 for a 6, kit it out to take 2 cars and buy a Caterham 620 R so I can take both that and the Exige to track days and swap between them.

How does that work? I mean getting an RT6 to take 2 cars?

When I was racing Ginettas one of the teams had two G40s in an RT4. They used a ramp that the first car parked on then it lifted the rear up, the second car went underneath.

I say RT6 purely because an Exige is bigger than a G40 and an RT4 wouldn't be big enough.


This is just from google images and it looks like an RT4 but the same idea.

[Far Cough]

px1980 said:

That’s exactly my thinking. I’d be getting a GT4 with PDK as my heel and toe game is non existent. I was thinking that way I’d be getting great track experience, and easy cruising to/from it on the motorway, or - more importantly - I could still use it around London occassionally, not having to constantly switch between 1st and 2nd in the stop start traffic.

The insurance is built into a normal road policy. For example A Plan include 6 trackdays into the annual policy. You just tell them in advance when you do a trackday.

What ever car you get will need tyres, petrol and brakes if you track it. The ideal is to minimize these or mitigate them .

[MDL111]

_Leg_ said:

MDL111 said:

_Leg_ said:

bobbysmithy said:

Absolutely fantastic machine and id love it but would still have a caterham(420r with sadev) for most tracks due to lightness/playfulness of them. Ideally, id have both. It's not gonna happen tho.

I used to track an MK Indy R R1 that had a full cage (no roof, doors or windscreen) and before that a Westfield. Most fun you can have on track and by far the cheapest on consumables.

I just got sick of getting wet. I’m constantly tempted to swap my Racetransporter 4 for a 6, kit it out to take 2 cars and buy a Caterham 620 R so I can take both that and the Exige to track days and swap between them.

How does that work? I mean getting an RT6 to take 2 cars?

When I was racing Ginettas one of the teams had two G40s in an RT4. They used a ramp that the first car parked on then it lifted the rear up, the second car went underneath.

I say RT6 purely because an Exige is bigger than a G40 and an RT4 wouldn't be big enough.


This is just from google images and it looks like an RT4 but the same idea.

Cool, I did not know this was possible. thank you

[Kent Border Kenny]

px1980 said:

I checked online, and these things cost £1000+vat for a day’s rental of a Caterham. They’re not cheap right?

I’d imagine that a fast road car other than something as light as an Exige is likely to cost over that in consumables / maintenance if used hard for a whole day.

Psychologically it’s possibly far easier to justify the £200 for the track day and to then assign the more frequent brake tyre and clutch changes to the “normal” car budget, but if the numbers are looked at dispassionately then the rental’s likely quite a bit cheaper.

[Shnozz]

Kent Border Kenny said:

px1980 said:

I checked online, and these things cost £1000+vat for a day’s rental of a Caterham. They’re not cheap right?

I’d imagine that a fast road car other than something as light as an Exige is likely to cost over that in consumables / maintenance if used hard for a whole day.

Psychologically it’s possibly far easier to justify the £200 for the track day and to then assign the more frequent brake tyre and clutch changes to the “normal” car budget, but if the numbers are looked at dispassionately then the rental’s likely quite a bit cheaper.

Exactly as I keep saying.

And the OP is already at £570 - £700 per event using his own car and that’s before depreciation on his own admission. Add in some consumables that will obviously be used harder on TD’s and it’s easy to see £750 a day - so what it would cost you to share a caterham hire with a mate.

As you say, many mask the overall cost as it’s not immediately obvious or comes in one lump, but there’s little doubt when you stand back at what it really costs you.

£1k hire between two people comes out cheaper is the reality. It sounds a lot as a headline figure but less so when you do the maths on the true costs to your own car.

[vdasilva]

_Leg_ said:

You were wrong I'm afraid.

There are no electronic displays in an Exige S3. It has an analogue dash with the usual lights for lights, traction, drivetrain mode etc and a head unit but there are no electronic displays (unless it's been fitted with an AiM2 digital dash like mine - stock pic below).



The head units play via bluetooth and cable direct from your phone. Also has hands free.

It has air conditioning.

It has a heater.

These are all standard. The AiM2 dash is around £1400, looks and operates superbly and also data logs on track.Lotus are now fitting them as an option.

Hearing what you say though you should buy a GT4. Even a standard Exige 350 Sport will leave it for dead on track and an Exige modified as I describe above is in a different class on track altogether. However, there's no denying that driving on the road, driving to and from track, the GT4 is a comfier, more cultured and nicer place to be.

As ever it's about balance and what's important to you. If the priority is track days and really going at it in a car designed to be on track and for that you're prepared to compromise a little on the road, then a modified Exige is the one to go for (or, if modifying isnt your thing, a 410 or 430). If the aim is to have a nice sports car for the road that you can do occasional track days in without really going at it, then a GT4 will do.

It's important to consider insurance too. £600 a year for comp cover on road and track for my Exige, even with the mods. That's worth bearing in mind when you make your decision. How much would it cost to insure the car you choose for track and if you dont, how much will not having insurance compromise your track day fun? Having a Lotus also lets you take part in Lotus on Track days that happen throughout the year and are extremely well organised. I guess there's a similar Porsche thing though?

Edited by _Leg_ on Wednesday 23 December 10:24

I currently own a Exige 430Cup and a GT4. I also own an MX5 BBR (300cv) and a 1995 Skyline. I purchased them in the reverse order mentioned. My favourite by far is the 430cup. The only downside is the insurance. It used to come included with 5 track days in UK and Nurburgring and SPA for an extra £250 per day. Two years ago. Now I pay £2,150 with zero track days!

Does anyone know any good insurance companies for 430 cup or track focus cars? By the way, I am 46, 11 years no claims, zero points in my driving licence for the past 10+ years.

[FWIW]

vdasilva said:

I currently own a Exige 430Cup and a GT4. I also own an MX5 BBR (300cv) and a 1995 Skyline. I purchased them in the reverse order mentioned. My favourite by far is the 430cup. The only downside is the insurance. It used to come included with 5 track days in UK and Nurburgring and SPA for an extra £250 per day. Two years ago. Now I pay £2,150 with zero track days!

Does anyone know any good insurance companies for 430 cup or track focus cars? By the way, I am 46, 11 years no claims, zero points in my driving licence for the past 10+ years.

Have you tried Classicline? Unlimited UK LoT days.

[coolchris]

Give privilege a shout I'm 43 with 16 years no claims pay £245 protected no claims 5k miles year on a 2.5 Noble m12 went up this year from £180 still bloody cheap though

[david-j8694]

px1980 said:

Ok say I was considering an Exige.
What sort of ballpark difference in running costs vs 718 GT4 or GTS are we talking about? Say assuming 8x/year track days.

Edited by px1980 on Friday 25th December 16:03

So it's gone from once a fortnight, to once a month and now 8x per year.

I'd get the GT4 PDK, as for the 8 TDs per year and the zillion other times you're going to be out and about, road trips, windy roads, etc... you're not going to want to be in an Exige. Neither is your misses (that appears to be an important consideration for a lot on here for some reason).

Are Exiges really that much faster than GT4s on track? I can't imagine it could take a GT4 around a proper track Silverstone...?

Edit: Didn't realise how old the thread was - OP did you buy anything in the end?

Edited by david-j8694 on Wednesday 7th February 13:16

[Spindoctor]

coolchris said:

Give privilege a shout I'm 43 with 16 years no claims pay £245 protected no claims 5k miles year on a 2.5 Noble m12 went up this year from £180 still bloody cheap though

I'm not sure you can assume insurers will price an Exige and a Noble similarly - they don't in my case. I'm also paying about £180 for the Noble (3R), but the Exige 410 is close to £500. Both without any track insurance. The Exige market value is higher but doesn't justify such a huge difference. Just one of the mysteries of car insurance.