intercooling

[mighty kitten]

its a 2.3 lump which helps but on the road you cant really open the tap much anyway ,not the best handling machine but probably a good thing given the size and traction you get with a big lump of iron over the wheels .

[anonymous-user]

stevieturbo said:

jontysafe said:

What are your intake temps like? All the tests I've seen on the PWR barrels say that they are great at causing as little pressure loss as possible but not actually that great at charge cooling.

Why do you run twin pumps? I've been told to keep water volume up (minimum 20 ltrs) but water speed down (14-20 gall/hr) other wise the water isn't in the radiator long enough.

Nope. Flow is good..and LOTS of it. I doubt you could ever have too much flow.
The last thing you want is slow flow.

And volume yes can be a good thing, but IMO the best place to have that volume is in the frontal radiator which should always be getting cooled.
Likewise lots of capacity for the engine heat exchanger is good ( assuming it isnt subject to lots of engine heat soak )

The first thing to remember in general about cooling, and intercooling specifically, is that most of what the "internet" says is completely false! Although, you would think the basics of heat and it's transfer between different mediums are quite simple, unfortunately, i would suggest it is not quite simply enough............ ;-)

[jontysafe]

I may have got my flow rate wrong, it's just under 14ltrs/minute.

[jontysafe]

Ok change of plan. NMS won't map with my avcr on the car as he will only use air injectors when on L8 management.
Suffice to say I don't want air injectors and really like the avcr.
Car booked into FC tuning/Sabre tuning in Bristol for live map now as he is well versed in L8 and avcr.

[anonymous-user]

Hey? The AVCR is just a boost controller yeah? SO, it either delivers the target boost or it doesn't, no more complication than that. Any which way you look at it, all boost controllers end up with a PWM square wave output to the boost control valve (the subtleties of THAT device IS beyond most aftermarket mappers ime), and most boost controllers are just using some basic PID, PI, or PD single degree of freedom controller logic, so hardly rocket science to tune...........

Meanwhile, your engine controller just has to deliver the correct ignition angle and fuel pulse duration at what ever boost pressure your boost controller delivers. So, assuming you don't want to get all clever and have multiple EMS linked strategies (like, hi/lo boost, limp home, baro/coolant/air temp dependent boost etc etc) i fail to see the issue?

[stevieturbo]

Max_Torque said:

Hey? The AVCR is just a boost controller yeah? SO, it either delivers the target boost or it doesn't, no more complication than that. Any which way you look at it, all boost controllers end up with a PWM square wave output to the boost control valve (the subtleties of THAT device IS beyond most aftermarket mappers ime), and most boost controllers are just using some basic PID, PI, or PD single degree of freedom controller logic, so hardly rocket science to tune...........

Meanwhile, your engine controller just has to deliver the correct ignition angle and fuel pulse duration at what ever boost pressure your boost controller delivers. So, assuming you don't want to get all clever and have multiple EMS linked strategies (like, hi/lo boost, limp home, baro/coolant/air temp dependent boost etc etc) i fail to see the issue?

Except the AVCR can do boost by speed, rpm, gear and generally works very well, and offers the user fairly easy access to these and multiple boost levels.
But IMO they are a pain in the arse at the same time because the user interface is pretty crap.

I doubt the L8 can do those things ( if indeed those features are being used of course ), although it can offer various boost levels via a switch.


But some people just prefer to do things the way they can guarantee results. Doesnt make either way right or wrong.
And sometimes controllers like that are safer removed, as more often than not customers like to tamper !

[anonymous-user]

stevieturbo said:

they are a pain in the arse at the same time because the user interface is pretty crap.

Ah, and we get to the meat^^^^ of the issue! ;-)

[jontysafe]

At the moment it is set to rpm.

It's not actually that difficult to use if you have one in front of you and aren't just reading the manual.

I'm going to keep the MSD chip just in case the live map loses the driveability.
I must admit I've been driving round a misfire at 2700-3000rpm so be interesting to see what Sabre Tuning can do. It's going to have to be mapped from no base map as the MSD chip is coded.

[jontysafe]

Took advantage of the good weather today and shot over to Spec R in Devizes.

What a nice guy Pete is, proper old school and makes a great cuppa. He`s pricing up a garret cored top feed intercooler as stage 1 then stage 2, if needs be is a new rad, swirl pot and header tank.

Core will most likely be 16x12x3in but if they don`t have that it will be 18x12x3in but that will require nosecone mods.

Must say it`s a fantastic road from Marlborough to Devizes really enjoyed it! If I`m honest I had a little play with a Nissan GTR who may just be wondering "how the hell did that happen"!

[chuntington101]

What the reason for going vertical core rather than horizontal? I'm pretty sure there is an off the shelf garrett core the size you want, or a longer core than can be cut down. Also would it not be easier to run the piping around the rad rather than over / under it?

[jontysafe]

Flow will be side to side just the inlet and outlet will be from the top of the endtanks

[jontysafe]

Soooo gutted.

Taking my son out for a spin earlier and heard a knocking so stopped engine straight away and got the wife to tow us back home.

Spun bearing? Dropped valve? Looks like another trip to Reyland Motorsport!

[stevieturbo]

jontysafe said:

Soooo gutted.

Taking my son out for a spin earlier and heard a knocking so stopped engine straight away and got the wife to tow us back home.

Spun bearing? Dropped valve? Looks like another trip to Reyland Motorsport!

Could be many things depending on the actual noise and circumstances.

Dropped valve is less likely....and by far the most destructive.

bearing..other, who knows.

[jontysafe]

My money is on spun rod bearing on number 4.
Was just pootling at low speed when I heard it. May have actually happened a couple of days before but no noise then.

[jontysafe]

Wee update

car has gone off to a locally recommended company called Basset Down Balancing for strip down and investigation.

I visited on Friday to talk through everything and go and see their premises and facilities and came away reassured.

I`m hoping it`s a crank regrind to 1st oversize and maybe a new rod but who bloomin knows.

Will update when I know more

[jontysafe]

Engine apart and ouchies!

Been suffering det and it's melted piston no. 2, crank needs a polish, block needs a rebore so new pistons rings, bearings, oil pump, oil cooler. Head and block strip and dip so new core plugs.

I suspect it's been running lean at high revs!

Not sure if I want to go cp pistons or forged cosworth racing pistons yet.

Will then run in on a very safe low boost then live map.

[stevieturbo]

I'm sure either piston will be fine.

[jontysafe]

There`s a fair bit of damage to the cylinder head and especially in one area around one of the valves. I will try and get a picture and post up for your thoughts. Engine builder has said it is fixable through possibly sinking the valve a touch and recutting the valve seat.

On a plus side he said the porting job was one of the best he had ever seen, hence I want to keep the head of at all possible!

Porting was done by Karl Norris at Norris Motorsport.

[stevieturbo]

Depending on the damage....shouldnt be too hard for a reputable machine shop to fit new valve seats, that way nothing needs recessed into the head.

[jontysafe]

Pic of det damage, this is on three of the four combustion chambers to a more or lesser degree